Is John McEnroe right about Serena?

[MercuryMadness]

I know nowt about tennis but from watching bits here and there, I cannot believe McEnroe is right. Serena looks so powerful and masterful with the ball.

I can see her giving lots of male professionals a fucking drubbing.

Is he really right?

Sorry if that's a stupid question, but what did McEnroe say?

I think he could be. She's awesome.

Gah! I think he could be wrong.

I think he is right but it's a criticism of the sport, not of Serena. She's said herself that men and women's tennis are very different.

Don't know but this is interesting
www.theguardian.com/observer/osm/story/0,,543962,00.html

I had to laugh when they interviewed the 700th ranked bloke who said he'd fancy his chances as she's pregnant and he isn't.

So what if he is? It's not a relevant point in my opinion.

What's he after, agreement that the women's game is less important? Maybe that they should be paid less, or have less TV coverage? Or women shouldn't bother playing tennis because they'll never be as good as him. Why does it matter exactly what level of male player she could beat? Is he so insecure in himself that he needs to clarify exactly how much more inferior women's tennis is, in his opinion?

Women's tennis is women's tennis. It's different to the men's tennis. That's fine.

I thought her response was classy.

Women's tennis is women's tennis. It's different to the men's tennis. That's fine.

Well quite.

Vestal: www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/40408799
I don't know enough about tennis to have an opinion.

Oh, so he said a man who's not in the top 100 could beat Serena?

Well, probably - there's a reason why women don't compete against men in most sports.

However, since sport is by definition not productive work, and has only entertainment value, women's tennis is worth exactly as much as men's tennis.

If it were about efficiently getting a ball to the other side of a net, we would use machines.

Whenever I've heard any female professional tennis players being asked about this they have all said they wouldn't stand a chance against any of the top ranked men. I suppose they are the best placed to know! I think the men's hitting is just so much more powerful, and consistently so. Serena can hit a serve as hard as many as the men, but not perhaps not keep it at that pace for every shot throughout a long match.

I think the 700th ranked male player interviewed is Dmitry Tursunov, who is a well known joker so that sounds about right. He was also ranked 20 in the world before he got injured, so there probably is a good chance he could beat Serena.

Oh, just read the article. Well, I don't have an opinion, don't know how much tennis relies on upper body muscle mass.

As it is also about fast reaction, I'd think he could well be wrong.

DH played Wimbledon. He agrees with the number. But he totally disagrees that women's tennis is inferior.

Personally I have no idea. Except there are an awful lot of tennis players out there. 700 in the world of top men tennis players will be very good indeed.

I don't know why McEnroe said it. Other than to make a distinction. And why would he bother?

What is the point of discussing it? Dissecting in detail whether Serena could beat the 215th player or the 433th? It all smacks of trying to denigrate the women's game by insinuating that it's vastly inferior to the men's game. It doesn't matter what rank of men's player Serena could beat. She's the most amazing athlete and an incredible tennis player, and she seems like a nice person too. I like to see her play, it's great seeing a strong and confident woman athlete.

Sport is all about competition. So a woman's match is every bit as riveting as a men's match.

Does anyone know, as i have been unable to find this in the articles reporting his comments, why he said this? If he was specifically asked, then I think his only other option to refuse to answer. He couldn't have said that Serena could compete with the top male players as it's really not true.

Serena is an absolute ledgend - I hate how she is always the focus of such negativity. She is always so dignified in her responses.

In my opinion Serena would give most professional male players a run for their money but that's not how the sport works so is totally irrelevant. I think only a fool would consider they could beat Serena easily.

This gives more context to what he said.

www.964eagle.co.uk/news/sport/2316344/john-mcenroe-ranks-serena-700-in-the-world-on-mens-tour/

Of course he promoting his new book.

I personally, as someone who only rarely watches tennis, prefer the womens game. There's less emphasis on power and the matches are shorter! Five sets bores me to death.

He's just a bloke. A bloke who was excellent at tennis.

Perhaps interviewers should stop asking sportsmen feminist questions or questions about female sport or indeed any societal political questions?

Because they're not qualified to answer it

He was asked why he referred to Serena as the best female tennis player and pointed out that men and women's tennis is different. Personally, the way things are going, I find it quite refreshing that someone is willing to say that.

Mcenroe has been banging on and on about this for literally centuries.

Why he does is anyones guess.

Didn't Billie Jean King take up his challenge once and play against some bloke who happened to be wandering around Wimbledon/ranked 5 million. She lost.

Well, he could have made a good point by saying that it would be massively unfair if Serena had to compete against a bloke who "feels like a woman" because of the role muscle mass plays in tennis.

Only reason to talk about it, in my opinion.

It's a stupid, apples and pears comparison. Either you think women's sport is worthwhile in it's own right, or you don't. If you do, then watching women at the peak of their ability compete in fair contests against each other will be exciting, if you don't then you'll make stupid comparisons with the men's game. After all, Usain Bolt could be easily out-sprinted by a cheetah, but we don't make that comparison, because we're interested in how he does against other human males.

And people only ever make these comparisons and expect them to be taken seriously when they're out to denigrate a group - either for sexist reasons as in this instance, or, thinking back to the shameful racism in America in the 30s and 40s, when Jesse Owens was forced to earn money after the end of his racing career as a fairground attraction running against racehorses. Apologies for the quote from the wikipedia entry, but it's quite revealing: Owens said, "People say that it was degrading for an Olympic champion to run against a horse, but what was I supposed to do? I had four gold medals, but you can't eat four gold medals." On the lack of opportunities, Owens added, "There was no television, no big advertising, no endorsements then. Not for a black man, anyway.""