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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Michelle obama's response to Donald trump

74 replies

quencher · 14/10/2016 18:33

It should have been Hillary's comeback to Donald trump on the night of the debate, which didn't happen. I found Hillary's response trump not good enough.

Michelle did what Hillary should have done. I watched it with pride that she spoke the truth. However, I found myself cringing every time Hillary's name was me mentioned. Not because I don't like her but because of her husband.
If a woman watched the whole 26mins and still supported trump, then am sure you can't be saved.

I have just posted a link to this video too. Grin

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SJ45VLgbe_E

OP posts:
QueenJuggler · 16/10/2016 16:28

Seneca - entirely correct. Without the work that Hillary's generation put in, life would be very different indeed for Michelle Obama.

Lweji · 16/10/2016 16:36

We still seem to live in a world where women have to be like men (better than, in fact). You only have to look at this election.

Bobochic · 16/10/2016 17:12

That wasn't a criticism of Hilary Clinton, just a comment on times moving on.

Lweji · 16/10/2016 17:15

Maybe feminists have moved on. Not sure about the rest...

OlennasWimple · 16/10/2016 18:02

Hillary couldn't have made that speech. Men like Justin Trudeau can and still get elected. Women like Michelle Obama can use their platform to make that sort of speech and get coverage (and good for her that she has and does). But sadly any woman making that speech and trying to get elected in the US - or the UK - would hamper rather than enhance their electoral prospects

BoomBoomsCousin · 18/10/2016 23:32

Michelle Obama is ushering in a new world in which women can be women without aping men, and be successful in public life.

I really don't think this is true at all. Michelle does great speeches, but she has never been elected to public office. She speaks up when she chooses to, about what she wants to, and she does it really well. But she gets to cherry pick her subjects and leave the ones that are difficult or on which she has a compromised position (a place all actual politicians know very well). She's the Jackie O of the 21st century. I don't even see her as much of a modern feminist role model for public life. She plays the good wife. I like her a lot. She's made a lot out of her position. But her whole life is about caretaking so a man can follow his ambitions.

Bobochic · 19/10/2016 13:25

But her whole life is about caretaking so a man can follow his ambitions.

This is so very, very far from the case.

Lweji · 19/10/2016 13:28

It is very far indeed.

Of course she interrupted her career as it would have meant a conflict of interest while he was President.
I'm sure she'll resume it now, even it in a different form.

HillaryFTW · 19/10/2016 14:51

Michelle had a full time career until 3 months into Barack's presidential run.

I do agree that she can be so impassioned and focussed because she picks her issues and doesn't have to cover the issues and reach the range of people that a politician does. She's great, but she's not currently a politician. She could be, but I suspect that's not what she'll choose to do next.

BoomBoomsCousin · 19/10/2016 22:19

By whole life I meant the way she is living now, not her history. Sorry, I see the way that can be read. Though, even before the presidential run, she was in Chicago following a path that made it possible for he husband to work away from home by being the caretaker of their young children.

This isn't to say there's something wrong with making the choices she has. We don't live in a perfect world. I've made many of the same compromises myself (though on a somewhat different scale!), but that doesn't make it a lifestyle I want my daughters aping. So I stick to the claim that she isn't a feminist role model.

Nan0second · 19/10/2016 22:29

Yes totally agree she is a terrible feminist role model.
She's a wonderful woman and it is a brilliant speech.
However, she had a fantastic career and she gave it all up to do the job of "wife of the president". Everywhere she goes, everything she does is for being "wife".
She does it brilliantly but I want so much more for my DD.
A husband would never be expected not to work outside the home of his wife was in a position of power.

HillaryFTW · 19/10/2016 22:48

She outearned him whilst he was in the senate.

Her job was pretty high profile in Chicago, I imagine they had a nanny.

HillaryFTW · 19/10/2016 22:51

I'm not sure, Nan. Mr May and mr thatcher both lower profile than their wives. Ms Booth and Ms Durante Gonzalez both outearned their spouses, and Mrs Cameron for a long time. Not sure what mr merkel does.

Mr Clinton will be First Gentleman and I doubt he will have a job.

DixieWishbone · 19/10/2016 22:55

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Aeroflotgirl · 19/10/2016 23:02

I don't like HC or DT, if I was an American, I just could not vote. But Michelle Obama, is excellent, and wish she was running for president.

HillaryFTW · 19/10/2016 23:06

Dixie, she might be young enough but there's no evidence she wants to, is there?

quencher · 19/10/2016 23:23

Am glad with what the Obamas have done. I can also understand why Michelle would have taken a back seat to let her husband follow a route where he would break barriers for black people in America.
Yes, she is a terrible feminist, who isn't? We all pick what we can handle and do to the best of our abilities. It takes a clever person to do that.

In terms of standing on shoulder of Hillary Clinton, I doubt that. She has criticised Hillary before. She looks at Hilary now as a better option to trump. A better example to her girls than trump. But is Hillary the best? I doubt that. In terms of paving the way as a group of women, her generation did.

For people criticising her role as housewife and taking a back seat, I thought feminist came in all different shapes and sizes.
I also, think she saw a potential in her husband even though sometimes she wanted them to give it up. Well potential to creat history. It's life changing not only to black men but the whole black community in general.

A lot of people look at feminism differently, if following her husband is the biggest crime. Then she is not a feminist, (in the worlds of piss taking Annie Lennox, "feminist lite").

However, for a lot of black girls and lots of girls of other races will see what she has achieved and how she has handled her self in public. She might not have been president, but to black feminist she has broken barriers, she has challenged opinions on what is to be a black woman by just being herself. That in itself is feminism. Other people might not see that because it's inconceivable to think that one person will be representative of a whole race and a group of women by just being in the spotlight. However, that is how most black women are seen.

According to the first black female to run for presidency in America, Shirley Chisholm, a feminist, a woman who fought for better welfare for women.
Once said that when she entered the room, they saw a woman first and her skin second. What I take from this in relation to Barack and Michelle and how they have worked the system to their advantage and benefited a race. The benefits might not be seen now in income, jobs and how people are treated. They have changed the potential of what black children can aim for.

OP posts:
HillaryFTW · 19/10/2016 23:27

She's not a housewife and never has been.

Perfectly possible to be a feminist housewife though.

quencher · 19/10/2016 23:45

Form what I understand, she is not paid for being as hostess of the White House. Which is her role and she has commented on the pay they don't get. (How many housewives, get paid salaries, unless it's the arrangement, and that is still not the norm).

Secondly, it has been mentioned on this thread that she has taken the back seat to her husband. That includes giving up on her career and not embarking on new since he became president. Technically, she is not staying at home but at the same time you could say the same for housewives who host dinner parties and charity galas as their past time.

I could be wrong. Smile

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quencher · 19/10/2016 23:52

The above is meant to say " in the words of Annie Lennox" not world.

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Bobochic · 20/10/2016 00:14

Crikey, Michelle Obama not good enough a role model?!

I made sure my DD watched MO's speech last week in full, twice.

BoomBoomsCousin · 20/10/2016 03:08

You make a good point about her being an African-American woman in the public eye quencher. And there is a lot to admire about her anyway.

Lweji · 20/10/2016 08:46

www.whitehouse.gov/administration/first-lady-michelle-obama

During her stay in the WH, she has launched four initiatives.
One to encourage girls education.
One for veterans and families (she appeared on NCIS even)
One against childhood obesity
One to encourage further education

She's hardly a housekeeper.

dudsville · 22/10/2016 19:55

I'm late to the table, been ill. My mother asked me to watch this speech. She right leaning and she had to recommend the speech to me when her husband was out of the room because of his political views and behaviour. I can't wait to talk about this speech with her. It was perfect. There was a cartoon when Barack first became president "please do not walk on water", it was a reference to the way he'd been built up to be a god but was human and we all needed to remember not to hold him to a different standard. In the same way we can't make Michelle out to be more than human, but she is one of my favourites of us! And I agree it would have been amazing if Hilary had made this speech.

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