New mothers need the whole story about AP.

[wenchystrumpet]

I believe some attachment parents are being disingenous when they say their approach was easier for them (compared to other ways one can be a loving mother).

AP approaches are associated with severe and long term sleep deprivation. So, AP may have other benefits, but is being easier generally one of them?

I acknowledge that AP may well be experienced as easier by some individuals.

My contention is that out of the chorus of voices saying "I'm so lazy" there must be a fair few who have hurt their backs from wearing a sling or got depressed from being housebound and are just not acknowledging this part of their experience.

Why is this a problem? It's a problem because I think new mothers are being told only part of the story about AP. Having had no experience of parenting at all, they hear many (but no doubt not all) AP advocates suggesting that this is an easy way to be a mother, when in fact it is a very intense way to mother.

Mothers with mental health concerns, for example, may not find it easier to scale back their work in favour of spending long hours mothering without the balance that work outside the home can provide.

And yes I know AP is an 'approach' or a 'toolkit' but everyone knows certain ways of doing things are considered preferable.

What an odd post. No, I don't think women are generally disingenuous about AP. If it happens at all, I'd say it was very rare. I've had friends give up on AP, or become drawn to an AP approach, but it's very much a personal decision and I think people are generally honest about what does or doesn't work for them. Why wouldn't they be?

It's not something that I tend to talk to my other mum friends about in person, but my LO has slept in my bed from early on (not immediately as there is so much pressure not to that I didn't realise it was an option). Once I'd done some proper research into the risk factors of co-sleeping, I realised that in fact it is very safe if done safely.

I also exclusively breastfed and again found this much much easier because we didn't really have to fully wake up in the night to do feeds and I never had to sterilise any bottles or remember to take formula/bottles with me.

It's a very rare baby that sleeps well for the initial months, but I never felt really exhausted either despite night feeds, and by around 4-5 months we were sleeping through the night regularly and I would say my quality of life was fantastic.

I didn't do AP to the extent of giving up work; I returned to part-time work when LO was just under a year old and then back to full-time work within a couple of months of that. The breastfeeding didn't cause any issues as LO just had water or soy milk during the day time and was happy to BF at bedtime and in the mornings. Also, I didn't find that my attachment parenting made it difficult to leave her with the childminder. But probably I followed a child-led approach in terms of putting a lot of effort in to find the right person that my LO clearly felt comfortable with (who has become a close family friend) and doing the settling-in gradually over a few days. LO then went to nursery a year later and is very independent and well-adapted. I still breastfeed and co-sleep; LO is now 3.

1. So yes, my experience was very positive in terms of both sleep, health, and how my LO has developed and grown up.

1. I didn't experience any pressure to attachment parent. I did experience pressure NOT to; e.g. being warned off co-sleeping, feeling like I had to apologise for breastfeeding openly.

1. I don't tend to talk about my experiences, but am happy to if somebody expresses an interest or asked me. My strongly held view is that every mother should be supported in making their own decisions that suit them and their children, and that we are all different!

Bertie: "You're mothering too much, it's for your benefit"

Jesus, do people say that? See, the whole thing makes me so angry. We're bringing up the sodding baby, leave us to get on with it.

Oh and slings are brilliant!

Used a soft stretchy wrap tie initially, then an Ergobaby, and then a Tula Toddler carrier. Revolutionised my ability to get out of the house and do things easily! And LO loved it.

If they are hurting your back then like with backpacks you need some professional help in getting it fitted right.

Or if you have a pre-existing medical condition that would be made worse by carrying a backpack or sling, then just be sensible and don't do it, end of...

But I got judged by more than one person (including HV) about the co-sleeping - people will judge on anything at all if they are so inclined.

My DS1 would be sleeping in our bed if he could - we gently encouraged him into his own bed about 2.5 (yes, in general I was the one that spent the 30 mins with him until he went to sleep), and apart from a brief stints when he was 3 and ill/recovering, he's slept in his own bed ever since. His brother would prefer that I went and slept with them (he objects to DP's snoring), but again, as an adult, I've made the call that co-sleeping isn't going to work any more, so we don't.

My dad used to say that rules were for the guidance of wisemen, and the obedience of fools - and whilst that's not something I'm entirely grateful he's taught my kids, it's a good rule for life - step back and think about a rule rather than follow it blindly - chuck it out if it's not working.

wizzywig do you want to be co sleeping with a 7 yr old? It's not clear and I don't want to be presumptuous.

For me all this stuff was just common sense because it suited me.

For my friend who had a ravenously hungry baby and a back problem, it was common sense to take a different approach!

I'd like to point out, though, that formula feeding doesn't guarantee a good night's sleep at all. Of my peer group, those who have struggled with sleep problems have been AP and non-AP... seems like it's down to the baby's temperament and physical needs as much as the parenting methods.

I think it is a feminist issue is a style of parenting requires a woman to give up her financial independence (and yes, I appreciate that this is really at the extremes of AP).

Every parent thinks that their way of parenting their child is the right way. Of course they do. If they thought there was s better way they'd be doing that.

I think AP is s crock of shit borne out of either:

• unrealistic expectations set when pregnant before the realities of parenting kicks in. Or
• not having the energy to do anything else once the realities of parenting kicks in. Or
• being unable to break habits already in place once baby is older

I know others will disagree with me on this - in reference to my opening paragraph, everyone thinks their way is best.

I AP my firstborn, as a result of all three of the above reasons. I sure as hell didn't make the same 'mistakes' with subsequent children.

Interesting point - when I had DC2 and was much more routined and independent of me, (still bf tho). I had a bout of feeling really down when I realised how much I failed DC1 as a baby. Failed is maybe too stronger word, but that DC2 was so much happier, I was so much happier. I knew no different with DC1.

I didn't realise how much better it could be if I didn't thing differently. I didn't realise by trying to make life easier and more positive, I was actually making life with a baby much harder and difficult by APing.

I've read the whole thread and all I keep thinking is 'oh bog off OP.'

So that's my contribution.

I don't really have financial independence and I'm a feminist. I had intended to return to work but after DS was born I changed my mind and realised I wanted to be at home with him. I'm still a feminist.

The idea that only working outside the home is feminist is pretty off

Actually Dr Sears wasn't that keen on women working after having a child.

He was bashed for that of course, so his revised editions basically say "Work if you must, but as little as possible - you don't want to hurt that attachment you've worked so hard on, do you?"

"It's not AP, it's the whole damn thing!"

This. And as someone who AP worked for, including the superficial labelly bits like slings and co-sleeping (but doesn't think that's best for everyone, obviously) I am tired of the AP bashing. It's NOT ABOUT BEING A MARTYR. Or about following some kind of "herd".

Women giving up their financial independence wouldn't be an issue if there was no sexism and if men were equal committed partners. Even (shock horror) men could do AP and give up their own financial independence. It's not an AP problem, it's a sexism problem.

I can't really tell - because everyone seems to be coming at this from a different perspective - is the objection to the idea of a "parenting style" existing at all? Is it that it's assumed these particular practices such as SAHM, co-sleeping, slings, are prescribed? Or is it just that mothers are isolated, derided, unsupported, and yet told what to do all the time from people who are sitting in ivory towers never having even looked clearly in her direction?

I don't think you know what attachment parenting IS, OP.

Ooh, busstopbetty, you are completely right and this is a massively interesting aspect of motherhood. My thinking about it has changed completely since I became a mother. I work but feel that the most interesting points for me are (1) the value placed on the work of mothering, (2) legal protection of those who do the work of mothering, and (3) why the government can't do more legislatively to safeguard women's employability in part-time roles and make it illegal not to offer all jobs as job shares, in order to protect the financial independence of primary parents who also have to balance work with caring responsibilities or take a career break.

This is probably for another thread! (I haven't found the feminist chat yet, will go have a peek...)

Is it really specific to AP though or is it about SAHMs of all persuasions?

I knew quite a few women who AP (I trained as a BF peer supporter too so met others here)

IMO without exception every one ended up wit marriage/ relationship: husband issues as a result (talking 1-2yrs in here). Now 7yr later none have paid work (this is in London where every other mother I know works).

Seems to maybe be / become a bit of a hiding place for some women AP. Means they have a reason to be lazy (flame me!) eg one woman I know who was sleeping 4 in one bed and 2 sons were aged 4 and 6. When had she returned to work as everybody else did, could have afforded to rent a 2 bedroom flat easily (well paid IT trainer).

I think some people with depression / martyr tendencies can slip into an AP hole as it requires no major decision making 'follow the baby/ child' and weirdly absolves the parents of responsibility to an extent 'oh we don't do boundaries / bedtimes/ he chooses his own food (ages 3 ffs).

The chronic exhaustion as well of these parents a year or so in, how aged they look and how their social life has died plus personal hobbies often (chronic exhaustion plus all night bedroom shenanigans) is also never discussed.

I think the usual compromise/ regular approach of a good routine with bedtime boundaries BF if possible by 6m, plus time for mum and dad and self fulfillment should be promoted to new parents. Not the current 'round the clock BF forever' or 'formula feeding but we won't tell you how' as seems to be in the case

Sorry if this offends anyone but 7yrs in its interesting to see which women have careers and thriving children and strong marriages. You'd think it would be AP children but 3 I know are being assessed for behavioural issues only in year 1 / year 2 of school, all with mothers that wouldn't discipline / raise their voices. Quite shocking actually.

I only ever here so being criticised as mad parenting, only don't by mothers who knit their own nappies. I think it has s terrible press, even though many aspects of it worked really well for me and meant I actually got more sleep and was more relaxed than with my first DC.

Attachment parenting really isn't the same as not having boundaries, routine, structure etc...

God this whole discussion is so tiring, so basically do what works for you and what makes you and baby happiest. Every mum is different, every baby is different.
Judgement will come from EVERYWHERE when you're a mum, that's the feminist issue, not specifically AP.
The idea that being a SAHM is anti feminist is ridiculous though.

Also no one on this thread seems to be able to decide what AP actually is.

Yes, of course all attachment parents are lazy, haggard, sexless martyrs. Sigh.

Reminds me of years back when that stupid Bringing up Baby show was on and the only measure of parenting success was getting a baby to sleep through the night in its own room. The attachment parents in that were actually getting a decent nights sleep, but because they were bed sharing and occasionally feeding in the night, it didn't count.

ICJump, not working outside the home doesn't mean you're not a feminist, but surely you see that for an awful lot of women giving up their financial independence is a risky strategy. Every week there are posts from women who are married (or worse, not married as then they're entitled to half of fuck all), but who aren't in a position to be able to leave a shitty relationship.

"Attachment parenting really isn't the same as not having boundaries, routine, structure etc..."

Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't.

Yes I understand that but rather than the act of mother being the issue it's the way we place worth on it. So for example if everyone received a mincome it wouldn't be an issue.

I did AP. Got loads of sleep, no career or marriage issues and happy babies. I didn't go around telling people how great AP is or joining any fb groups. I think you need to just not worry so much about other people OP. If it doesn't work for a parent they'll probably find their own way.

Attachment parenting has a specific definition. That definition doesn't include not disciplining children, or not vaccinating, or being vegan, even though I suspect AP parents may well be more likely to not vaccinate (for example, not trying to get into vaccination arguments!)