Do you ever change your behaviour to avoid harrassment/sexism?

[DraenorQueen]

Today a friend unexpectedly announced he was popping in, meaning I had to dash down Co-op and grab some wood and coal so said friend wouldn't freeze. In the shop there were 4 or 5 scruffy old blokes who were absolutely hammered arguing with the till assistant who wouldn't sell them alcohol. They looked filthy and were staggering about and generally had no intention of going anywhere.

I knew, I just KNEW that if I queued up I'd get some kind of harassment (am fat but with big breasts) so I stood at the far end of the shop pretending to browse. After a few minutes I though fuck this - I had 2 10Kg bags of coal to drag home so why the hell was I having to waste my time? I took my bags and queued up quietly and, predictably, two of the blokes made horrible comments about my size and a third made a delightful "head between my tits" gesture. All very unpleasant but they eventually moved away from the till, still arguing, and I got served.
Not the worst thing to happen, no, but it just pissed me of off that I KNEW it was going to happen and I had to change my behavior because of it, and when I didn't I had to accept the inevitable abuse. Does this kind of thing happen to anyone else? Does anyone else have to alter they way they act to avoid this shit from idiots??
Apols for length, just wanted a grumpy ramble and to hear others' thoughts!

I got fired from a bar job once because I didn't smile sweetly every time a man made awful sexual comments to me. The landlord said its was just part of the job and he hired me because I was hot so deal with it or leave.

Meant to add etcetera re all sexism.

Who knows how it will end up. It's all intimidation.

What woman is going to harass and intimidate you because you have big breasts?

@playswell

I don't play games i write what i mean to the best of my ability to express myself in ways others can understand. This is an admission that my communication skills are not always perfect and i can/ am often misunderstood.

Just because someone intends to be intimidating, doesn't mean you have to be intimidated.

Absolutely. I've been living in the Middle East for the past 10 years and South Korea for a year prior to that and I've had to completely change my behaviors.

I used to walk everywhere with my head held high and my Discman (yes disc man) plugged into my ears. Stopped that after being grabbed a couple of times because I had apparently ignored cat calls, or questions about how much I cost (the joys of being a blonde, white girl in Seoul). Now I walk with head down, quickly, scowl on my face and don't make eye contact. I had to have my husband drive me to work and pick me up because men started stalking my car and one guy actually got in my car when I parked and tried to kiss me. And I no longer take taxi's alone because a cab driver tried to rape me. I immediately shut down conversations with strange men and if they persist in trying to talk to me I hold up my phone and tell them I'm going to call the cops.

I'm not even going to get into how I dress far more conservatively, that's a given with where I live.

@UmbongoUnchained:
That landlord should have known he wasn't going to get a prostitute if he only paid for a bar job.
Women who want to put up with awful sexual comments for a living can do phone sex and earn more, I'm sure.

I think I would have been unwise not to have been intimidated by a group of men shouting at me 'If we see you again we're going to rape you'. Not builders on a building site, but a group hanging about outside a block of flats I passed regularly.

I would rather not feel intimidated

but it is not something I choose to feel it is just how i have often felt but it is what others have wanted me to feel, they have wanted to embarrass me, they have wanted me to be laughed at, they have wanted me to feel powerless and they have done their best to make sure that is how I feel

Fascinating reading. fitfatty that's terrifying! I must admit I wasn't even considering experiences from other cultures when I wrote my OP.
PassiveAggressiveQueen can I ask, when people catcall or make other unwanted comments or physically approaches, does your body not automatically respond? My heart goes into my mouth! I am extremely confident work-wise, sociable, articulate, but these experiences genuinely panic me!

I feel intimated by unwanted sexual attention too. I don't think it's unreasonable to do so. When a man makes unwanted sexual comments/advances to me when I'm simply walking down the street, then he's already shown he doesn't give two flying fucks about my wishes, my feelings, my boundaries, and my right to walk down the street without sexual harrasment.

I find men put their need to make sexual comments to a woman above that woman's right to nit be harassed very intimidating. They've already shown they will do what they want, I have no way of knowing if that will escalate to ignoring my physical safety until they try.

Ive adapted my behaviour since I was about 12, doesn't always work though as I've had men try to block my way, I've had my boobs grabbed in street, I've been followed and had rape threats in front of my child, I've been punched in the face, for ignoring catcalls and sexual comments from men, so when someone shouts "fancy a fuck" or whatever, I feel intimidated and scared. Sometimes just a bit, sometimes a lot. I hate feeling like that, so I try to avoid it, by changing my own behaviour. Eg I avoid going to the shops after 5 as there is often groups of men stood outside pub smoking, I have to pass three and there's never been a time where I've not gotten shit from them. So instead if a two minute walk, I detour and it's a 15 min walk instead. It's shit.

That's awful INicked being pouched is absolutely terrible. the more I think about it the more upset and angry I feel it just becomes part of our lives it becomes second nature :(

Passive, you claim that being shouted at in the street isn't intimidating and yet you find a question posted on a screen in front of you to be 'aggressive.' If, to you, a comment on a screen is aggressive then surely you can see how a comment made by a man to a lone woman on a street could also be aggressive and intimidating?

And in answer to the question, yes, and I wonder what it must be like to just be able to walk down the street and not even think about nastiness from other people.

I've been punched in the face, for ignoring catcalls and sexual comments from men

Similar thing happened to me in South Korea. I was at a bar with friends on New Years Eve, it had a cover charge and was all you can drink for free. This huge American soldier asked if he could get me a drink, I politely said no thank you, I'm fine and he punched me in the face. Then when my friends tried to intervene he punched them and threw them to the ground too.

All over a free drink.

Maybe i have anger problems, but my response is anger not fear. Maybe it helps that i am almost 6 foot and quite wide shouldered so men don't try it on with me as much

If i lived like the woman in seoul i would def. be frightened.

I am angry too, PAQ.

Angry that these men think that we should have to put up with this shit. But it is possible to be angry and intimidated at the same time.

Girls and women are trained to be intimidated by men, we're trained that getting angry isn't 'nice'.

As I wrote up thread I have responded in anger and also punched a guy in a pub who grabbed my boobs . You are right though people do expect women not to behave like that . It's ok il just get sexually assaulted and let men grope my bits as long as I remain dignified and lady like . Not

Luckily I'm tall and pysically quite strong in the past this has really helped especially when I had to literally fight a man off me and I dread to think what would have happened if I didn't

Of course I'm angry. I've fought back. Kicking the cabbie in the nuts was how I got away from him, because luckily he was actually smaller then me!

I'm furious and fuming, but I also don't want things like this to happen again, so I do things to avoid it.

If I'm ever caught out, and have to be anywhere remote, dark etc, I will try to look like a man! I put on a scruffy beanie, my husbands coat (in car for emergencies) and take my purse out of my handbag so I don't have to carry it. I've even hidden before when I've heard cars coming, the idea of men knowing a woman is out alone and vulnerable scares me.

I suspect that being nearly 6ft tall and quite wide shouldered does help you not being a target for cat calling and men getting in your space so much

I am sure you are not totally free from it other sexist remarks made towards you

being only 5'1 and small build, I have a vulnerable look (or I did) is a magnet for men that think it is ok to harass me and I noticed if I myself was feeling low and vulnerable it would happen even more. as I got older and more confident it has happened less but it still happens even when I have been pushing a buggy

walking along the road alone and a man behind me who is quite a few inches taller than me and even of average build, I am well aware he could over power me easily and he is making suggestive remarks is intimidating how can it not be

Maybe i have anger problems, but my response is anger not fear. Maybe it helps that i am almost 6 foot and quite wide shouldered so men don't try it on with me as much

I feel angry too.

Im angry that it has become so normal for me to change routes,dress, how I carry myself etc that I can't even add all the times or list all the ways I've done it.

I'm angry that my exp isn't unique and every woman I've known has had unwanted sexual , comments.

I'm angry that it isn't taken seriously, I'm angry that if a woman ignores it she's rude, if she responds she's encouraging it, if she says fuck off she's angering them, no matter how she reacts there will be many saying she's handled in wrong, she should do this, she should do that etc.

I'm angry that for many women, their coping strategy is to make themselves invisible as possible. I'm five foot and size 4, I can't shrink any further.

I'm angry that rather than tell women how to feel, what to do etc,many people don't focus on the men who think this is ok and tell them to change their fucking behaviour.

I'm angry at the men who think this ok, I'm angry that because of men like that there is a good chance my daughter and my nieces will some day feel intimidated by pervy men in the street, that she too may alter her movements and behaviour to avoid it.

But in the moment when I'm walking alone and a strange man approaches me, or I have a man or several man walking behind me telling me they are gonna fuck me, I feel intimidated and scared. I get the fuck away as quick as I can. I feel the anger once I'm home and safe.

Exactly

In the moment I often feel fear

Later and thinking about it now I feel really angry

I am angry that I have become so used to avoiding situations that it's become second nature and by it becoming second nature it normalises what happens it's just part of life

How did it get to that

I expect that a lot of women are like me, having adapted their behaviour since sexual harassment started at age 10, 11 or so, and now couldn't begin to untangle different learned behaviours.

Certainly do avoid any man who has that blend of egoism and aggression, like the plague. I'm also wary around any male with mental health or serious learning difficulties.