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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

The small things

76 replies

NiNoKuni · 18/09/2015 20:16

I'd read the various threads there have been over the last few months or so on here about titles and, even though I'm a Mrs DHname, totally agreed about the outdated absurdity of it all. In this spirit, I have now taken to choosing the most outlandish title I can when ordering things and currently have a package on the way to Commander NiNoKuni. This makes me giggle like a loon and I can't wait to get it Grin

What small yet oddly satisfying things have you done in the name of feminism? Or are there things you still really want to do (besides smashing the patriarchy, obvs)?

OP posts:
YonicScrewdriver · 20/09/2015 17:18

Lass, the sense of negativity on the thread is coming far more from you than any other poster.

Any small issues of feminism you'd like to cite? Anything already cited that does "speak" to you - maybe the point made by scallops about language used to describe similar behaviour differently?

SenecaFalls · 20/09/2015 17:34

In my work, I have to make statements about men as a class fairly often. I never say NAMALT. Plenty of other people to do that.

Original poster
NiNoKuni · 20/09/2015 17:57

On the language note: I've made a conscious effort to moderate my language to exclude terms like 'bitch', 'tart', 'bunny boiler', 'ball breaker' and so on. Not that I ever did much of that but it's quite easy to fall into if you're not paying attention, I think. I don't know if that's mega-obvious to others, but it was a small revelation for me! I have also been known to object to being called 'baby girl'

And since Anya from Buffy's genius 'Oh, penis!' exclamation, I do find myself using male genitalia-related swear words wherever possible.

YY Yonic, last night's Dr Who was quite refreshing!

OP posts:
YonicScrewdriver · 20/09/2015 18:02

Directed by a woman as well!

I too try and change language.

ozymandiusking · 20/09/2015 18:05

Two boys Two girls, I do exactly that with my Christmas cards too!

LottieDoubtie · 20/09/2015 18:19

I love the using the words generally reserved for women when talking about male colleagues. I shall be using that tomorrow!

partialderivative · 20/09/2015 18:39

When I see a new guy at my gym (I'm generally the woman in the weight lifting room) I correct their form and tell them how to use the machines

Do you do this in an ironic manner Thefitfatty, sort of 'This is what it's like to be mansplained to'?

Or just because it 'feels good'?

YonicScrewdriver · 20/09/2015 19:13

Partial, why do you persist in making single posts on threads in FWR ignoring any sexism from men but jumping on anything you perceive as possible sexism from women?

You used to engage properly, now you just do this. Why?

NeverEverAnythingEver · 20/09/2015 19:15

I get the holding-the-door open business. I do that too. There are men who would insist on opening doors for you despite the circumstances being that it would be most fucking convenient if you were allowed to open the fucking door yourself.

On small things - at one professional dinner every time a dish came to the table (Chinese dinner) they would say "ladies first" - me being the only woman there. Eventually I snapped and told them to stop doing it and said that it was an act of othering, telling me that I was the odd one out and didn't belong there. There was a palpable silence. Grin I am very proud of myself for having done that, and it's thanks to this board that I had the correct words to tell them to stop.

NeverEverAnythingEver · 20/09/2015 19:16

And I enjoyed the Doctor Who too. Smile

NeverEverAnythingEver · 20/09/2015 19:18

Do it if it "feels good". Do it in an "ironic fashion". Just do it.

Tirfarthoinn · 20/09/2015 19:27

i have adopted the gender neutral title Dr (I am entitled to use it but I'm not a medical Dr) and enjoy using it in business settings.
I always offer male colleagues help with things like moving furniture and they normally accept as do I when the tables are reversed.

PlaysWellWithOthers · 20/09/2015 19:29

When I see a new guy at my gym (I'm generally the woman in the weight lifting room) I correct their form and tell them how to use the machines

Do you do this in an ironic manner Thefitfatty, sort of 'This is what it's like to be mansplained to'?

Or just because it 'feels good'?

Can't speak for FitFatty, but I generally did it because not using the correct form made any lifting the men were doing pointless and using the machines incorrectly is bloody dangerous.

But, fuck it, if it makes you feel better to think like that partial, knock your fine self out.

YonicScrewdriver · 20/09/2015 19:37
ChunkyPickle · 20/09/2015 19:43

I don't know why, but, if I hold the door open for someone (I mean if we arrive at the door at the same time, rather than keeping it open for someone behind me - which is just manners) when I'm with my kids - ie. I hold the kids back and say 'just let the lady/gentleman through first' then the response is normally accepted (sometimes with a smile, sometimes with entitlement). If I do it when alone, then I'm dramatically more likely to get the surprised response (and I try to only do it when it makes sense, not for dramatic effect as some men are wont to)

I also don't martyr myself to cards (my family don't really do cards) - doesn't stop MIL explaining to DS1, whilst standing next to DP, that mummy will help him make and write a card to FIL, or her contacting me regarding family presents (she is lovely, but was forced to give up her career and go to 'family compatible' work when she had DP, and doesn't quite get my forceful shared parenting) it's taken some hard-heartedness to not jump in and take responsibility so no-one is hurt (on his side) when they don't get a card from us

YonicScrewdriver · 20/09/2015 19:47

") it's taken some hard-heartedness to not jump in and take responsibility so no-one is hurt (on his side) when they don't get a card from us"

Yes!

OneofTHOSEWomen · 20/09/2015 20:16

I pour myself a large alcoholic drink at family social events. I come from a moderately conservative Indian family, alcohol is reserved for the menfolk.

partialderivative · 20/09/2015 20:38

Partial, why do you persist in making single posts on threads in FWR ignoring any sexism from men but jumping on anything you perceive as possible sexism from women?

Fair point Yonic.

However in this case I was a little taken aback at the way the poster seemed so proud of the way she barged in on another's exercise session to let them know that they were doing it wrong.

I know it is a cliche, but if the genders were reversed and all that...

I am humbled that you think that I used to engage properly, though time zones do sometimes make things less easy.

I respect the wisdom of you, and many other regular posters on here. I agree that maybe the male contributors ought to speak out more often when nonsense is posted.

I will hold your comments in mind

ALassUnparalleled · 20/09/2015 20:38

Wouldn't insults or swear words not referring to either sexes genitalia be preferable? I've never understood why these body parts are used to express contempt. I've asked that before on MN and got the explanation, well they just are, which I don't think is much of an analysis beyond vaguely going along with the idea sex is somehow dirty or wrong.

As for bitch, tart , ball breaker etc I might not call myself a feminist but I honestly don't think I've ever used those terms for a woman.

ThinkAboutItTomorrow · 20/09/2015 20:53

I called a senior colleague (my peer) a 'boy' the other day. His expression was a picture.

Original poster
NiNoKuni · 20/09/2015 21:09

Wouldn't insults or swear words not referring to either sexes genitalia be preferable?

Here you go:

the history of swearing is one of a movement back and forth between the holy and the shit. At different times in the history of the west, the primary taboo has been to do either with God, or with the functions of the human body.

I swear. I like swearing. I use those words because they're swear words. I'm also a post-grad qualified linguist, although etymology is not my field. You could always tweet Susie Dent and ask her if you fancied.

As for bitch, tart , ball breaker etc I might not call myself a feminist but I honestly don't think I've ever used those terms for a woman.

Good for you!

OP posts:
cadnowyllt · 20/09/2015 21:39

Dr Who - Would've liked to have seen a few of the cannon fodder snipers be women, but progress!

Wasn't there one on the iplayer version at 15:53 ? Looks like a woman to me - not that I'm an expert.

YonicScrewdriver · 20/09/2015 21:43

Was there? Thanks, I'll check.

Thefitfatty · 21/09/2015 06:17

*Do you do this in an ironic manner Thefitfatty, sort of 'This is what it's like to be mansplained to'?

Or just because it 'feels good'?*

Two reasons actually. Either they are new and doing it wrong, in which case I'd hate to see them hurt themselves or waste effort, however they almost never listen to me anyway, so I laugh to myself.

Or secondly, because they've interrupted my workouts in the past to either to show me what they think I'm doing wrong (9/10 this information is incorrect, the 1 times it's correct I am grateful for their help in correcting my form), or have come and tried to fix a machine I've already come to the conclusion is broken, and say "wait a minute, wait a minute, I've got this, you're doing it wrong." So the next time I see them struggling with something I like to go up and just say "it's still broken" and watch them once again not listen to me and try and fix the damned thing while I laugh silently to myself.

Bulbasaur · 21/09/2015 06:49

Am I the only one that enjoys sending cards? I like to design them (I use that word loosely as I do those cheesy photo cards) and send them out. But I don't feel pressured to do it. I don't think it should be looked down upon to do cards either if you enjoy it.

Here in the US we don't really put titles near our names when applying for jobs or having mail delivered. It's just our names and addresses, but that does sound fun.

I hold doors open for random people that are coming, I don't think anyone has refused to go through for me. I do answer "Hey girl" with a playful "Hey boy" though. I'm not too fussed over little things, but I also work in a relatively new tech field, so coworkers are generally in my age demographic and I haven't really encountered any sexism. So it probably doesn't rub me the wrong way the same way it would if I had to deal with it on a constant basis.