'Bossy', boastful, bright 6 yr old DD - need some advice

[GiveOverLuv]

DD is my younger child, 6 years old, bright and a real 'all rounder' - academically clever, sporty, creative and has a real 'can do/give it a try' attitude.

She is a lovely girl and I am very proud of her. In a way, she is everything I suppose I wish I had been at that age. I was shy, clingy to my mum and modest about my achievements, whereas she is outgoing, makes friends easily and is quite competitive in her school work, sports, dance etc.

I have always been quite careful not to quell her 'bossy', competitive nature. She has a quite domineering older brother (with Asperger's...so he can have a bit of a 'I'm right, you're wrong' 'I'm going first, you'll have to wait' type attitude towards her) and I like the fact that she is quite tough and determined and doesn't just lie down and take it.

Lately, though, I have heard her talking to her little friends and there is quite a lot of 'I'm the BEST reader in the class', 'I can do that much better than you', 'I know more than you about XYZ'- type of chat coming from her. She is also competitive over EVERYTHING - wants to be the best at every activity, win every competition, get every bit of praise at school available - and she is very very open about this with friends etc. She is the type of child who would never let a friend win a game just to be kind to them or give them a feeling of achievement. Ever. Although she isn't mean in other ways, she is a good share and turn taker etc.

I've gone the softly softly approach with her so far, just saying 'well, everyone is better at some things than others' or 'we can be really happy about what we are good at, but we don't have to be mean to other people' type route...but she doesn't get it. I know she is only little, and I just wondered what other feminists think about this?

Basically, with a very bright competitive girl, should you challenge this sort of boasting behaviour or what? I don't want to beat that bit of her nature out of her, as why the hell shouldn't she be competitive, but I also don't want to raise a child with no common manners/social grace.

Don't get me wrong - not obsessing about this...I know she is only a wee little thing...just interested to know WWYD?

ILove, right from the start (ie toddlerhood) we impressed on DD that everyone had their own 'best' skill. When she would get upset that she couldn't do something we would point out that she could do something else. If she was finding something easy and a friend was struggling we would make sure she helped the friend or suggested something else to do. So it was quite easy for us when she reached the end of her tether with her friend to see what the issue was.

We are lucky with DD in that she is quite a good all rounder- but I would say she was above average in 'emotional maturity', so for us it was quite easy to promote a sense of fairness and kindness. She's not perfect, slips up and so on but I never fail to pull her up for it. We praise her a lot at home and kindness to others gets the biggest reward.

I do think it is something that most kids go through, wanting to 'win' is very natural - survival of the fittest and all that but if a parent can temper that with promoting empathy and kindness then everyone is a winner.

Are you sure she's truely deep down confident? Perhaps the constant need to prove it to everyone is actually a need to prove it to herself.

Watching with interest. I was brought up to be meek, more or less, and was told I lacked confidence in my earliest primary school reports (ironically, the only bit I understood was that I was lacking in some desirable characteristic!) I still struggle with a lack of confidence. And now I have a confident (September-born, so old in her year) dd and don't want her to end up like me - but neither do I want her to grow up oblivious to other people's feelings. I will keep Eve's line in mind, about being good at being a friend, and the other helpful advice here.

This is all very useful to read. Thanks Eve.

OP, does your daughters boasting come from insecurity do you think? Or mainly from super self confidence?

(With my daughter, her boasting seems to have come on over the last two years, since going to a new school and leaving a previous group of friends. She used to be quite different, and I think her attitude masks a real sense of inferiority, and also her new school seems much more competitive in its approach)

Thanks for all your replies. Loads of food for thought.

I don't believe she is on the spectrum, no. I think a lot of her competitive nature comes from having a brother on the spectrum, so its partly learned behaviour and partly a reaction to being a bit domineered by him at home at times.

tomandizzymum - interesting, I do wonder this. Is the competitiveness and wanting to be the best driven by insecurity? I don't know. She doesn't seem insecure in other ways. I think it is definitely driven partly by always having to 'compete' with her older brother, who struggles massive with things not being on his terms.

I don't want to paint a picture of her as a complete pain. She really isn't. She doesn't have tantrums or want her own way all the time. She shares really nicely with other children, happy to take turns in games and be lead by other children's interests etc (DS still struggles with all of this at the age of 10 yrs). Her teacher says she is very 'mature' and kind natured at school. She is one of the oldest in the class and one of the physically tallest, so I think there is an element of that 'natural' dominance going on too, which may well peter out as the others catch up.

I've had a think about it and I think maybe I do need to go in on a more direct 'manners/other peoples feelings' approach from now on. I'd hate to think she would grow up to think its OK to hurt other peoples feelings all the time, and I don't want to be seen as that mum who just lets her little darlings bad behaviour slide (trust me...I've had to deal with all of this magnified by 100 with my DS...knowing when to step in and say 'Actually, DS...thats not acceptable behaviour and its time to go' etc etc).

I should also add...interesting reflecting on how and me and DH were each brought up and the effect that might have

I come from a long line of clever, capable women with crushingly low self confidence . I was the bright kid at school who always played down my achievements because I didn't want the light shone on me or to appear boastful. My mother and grandmother were the same. My sister is also like this.

Whereas DH came from a poor immigrant background where he and his siblings were pushed and ho- housed to within an inch of their lives to achieve and be the best (the old 'if you're black, you have to be twice as good as the white kids to succeed' thing). My MIL is one of those who reckons DH was a genius who could read at 2 yrs old (hmmm...okaaaaay).

DH is definitely a complete doting dad with DD. He takes her to all her sports and dance classes and is over the moon when she gets player of the season awards for footie or a commendation for ballet or whatever. He really bigs her up massively. I haven't even spoken to him about this actually. be interesting to see what his take is...

*hot housed...excuse dreadful typos

OP interestingly the 'leader girl' I mentioned is physically much taller than the others. She also has three much older and pretty domineering brothers. It could be a reaction to being the smallest and least able at home.

I'm wonding if we would even be having this conversation about a boy, clever capable girls (I was one and I've got one) have to modify their behaviour to not offend others much more than boys do who are recognised as 'natural leaders'.

I am very reluctant to squash DD1's confidence in herself (like the OP's DD she's described as mature and kind and popular by her teacher so I don't think she is a pain) and will push her to achieve and NOT worry about the feeling of others too much, I felt like my own mother didn't approve of me and thought it was 'unfeminine' to achieve academically so I'm definitely carrying my own baggage here.

DD2 is much less confident (one of the youngest in the class so constantly catching up) and we do remind her constantly that if she wants to not have other people better than her at something then she needs to practice the things she thinks she's not so good at. I think saying 'X is good at A and Y is good at B' is labelling children too early, they will all get better as they get older and who is best at 6 will not be the best at 16. I'd rather give the message to an unconfident child that they have it within themselves to change rather than making them think things can't be changed.

I would also teach her it's ok to fail.

Sometimes kids like this are perfectionists, which is why they feel the need to be the best.

They can get so tied up in winning, that they won't try stuff they don't know they can do first go.

Blue to be fair I've had exactly these kind of conversations with my very competitive son.

Bluelamp, I am not convinced people do put up with boastful boys, as most children don't want to be led, so find people attempting to be leaders intensely annoying. Who goes around commending children on being the leaders of a group? Presumably some kind of PE teacher from 1952 from a boarding school with bullying problems, looking for boys of character to build the Empire.

But even if it were the case, there are loads of problems with masculinity, for both people who come into contact with masculine people and the masculine person's own mental health. Why would we encourage girls to behave in the same way? We should be encouraging boys to behave in a more feminine way. There are loads of things that men do that are glorified by imbeciles which are morally wrong.

One question to ask would be who are the children who are being told they're not good enough? What is the sex of these children who the OP's child is telling are not as clever/competent/sporty as her? Are they boys? Or is it in fact a group of girls being put down for someone else's benefit?

And if so, how on earth is any of this feminist?

Interestingly, she is in a little friendship group with two other girls and a boy, but also breaks off from them to play with other boys quite a lot as she is very sporty and the only girl in her class who goes to the after school football and multisports classes and who likes talking about minecraft . So its not just the girls who get her little comments about her superiority...

Are there other black/ mixed race children in her class?

My DS is quite similar. Wants to be best at everything and quite often is. And lets others know about it.

I found reading a book with him I'M THE BEST! about a boastful little dog whose friends teach him a little lesson was useful to get him to think about how this makes others feel.

Ooh interesting angle, MadBanners.

There are two black girls and one mixed race boy. Its a very culturally mixed class (probably only two white English parents) but quite white, also (loads of Albanaian, Polish, Italian, Turkish etc).

She is definitely starting to be a bit vulnerable to the whole racial stereotypes of beauty thing. Another worry. She wants straight hair at the moment, and I am doing loads of positive reinforcement stuff around her beautiful curls and amazing heritage etc. she is also very tall and has a different body shape to her little girl friends, who are thin and delicate (she had lovely long legs, broad shoulders and a prominent bum!).

I see all her little insecurities and do want to bolster her identity up...maybe why I struggle sometimes with feeling like I am crushing her spirit when she acts like a madam.

God I sound really neurotic, dont I? . Promise I am not. Its just struck me lately, all this...

Thanks bearhug. Will look at that book.

Just had a chat with the mum of the other little girl today, actually. Her friend, who she is uber competitive with. She sees it in DD but said she doesnt see it as a problem and said she would tell me if she felt her DD was hurt. But she did say if I was worried, we could try doing something regularly with both girls based on team work and cooperation, rather than 'being the best', which was very sweet of her.

I have similar issues with my DS, who is 10 (and probably on the spectrum though we have no formal DX) - he is both clever and arrogant at times, so it isn't just a matter of girls not being allowed to be competitive/confident. Some children do need more reminding to be kind and it's a balancing act between making sure their social skills develop and not crushing them or making them feel bad about the skills they do happen to have.

I don't want to sound mean, but my more introverted dd is friends with someone like your dd. I can't wait for the day she decides she is mean to her and finds a new friend!

I think some people are overthinking a little. Saying "But I AM a better reader!" is simply a fact to her, as though she had stated "But I am taller." She is six. Empathy is extremely simplistic at this stage - they can understand that a person is sad, angry, scared, etc when they are right in front of them, and can probably make a guess at how somebody might feel in a situation they can relate to, (e.g. "If X lost her ice cream, how might she feel?") but they can't yet extrapolate that to understand that "If X isn't as good at reading as me, they might feel bad about that. If I point it out, they might feel even worse."

That's simple for us to understand but it is not simple for a six year old. It's four different concepts all at once - first that somebody else might feel differently to them about a situation, secondly that somebody else can be in a different position to them in the first place, thirdly the concept of self-esteem and feeling good about oneself, if she's confident and there's nothing which really "gets to" her then she might not even understand that horrible feeling of unworthiness at all. Which is great for her but not so good for her empathy skills. Then fourthly the idea that something she says might exacerbate or kick off some feelings in others, especially, again, if she's thick-skinned herself. And an extra fifth one if applicable - that somebody can feel one thing while outwardly displaying a different feeling - smiling while feeling sad, for example.

Remember as well that a lot of other six year olds will be similarly black and white and actually might not be as upset as an older child would be to hear "You're not as good at X as I am". Although of course you should try to teach her that this might upset somebody, don't jump to the conclusion that they are being upset right now, because they might not. They might be totally happy to accept "X is best at jumping but Y is best at reading and N is best at making paper aeroplanes" or whatever.

If her friend isn't bothered by it, then it doesn't sound like your DD's behaviour is actually that much of a problem. Working on team work and cooperation sounds like a good idea for any child though, as does working on empathy and emotional intelligence, intrinsic rather than extrinsic motivation.

OTOH, I would be very wary of inadvertently giving her the message that she is responsible for the emotional state of everyone around her. If someone gets upset that she wins a race, that is not her fault and she is entirely in the right to feel happy about winning the race and wanting to celebrate that. If someone gets upset however because she shouted "haha I beat you! You are rubbish!", then that is poor behaviour on her part.

I am not sure I am explaining well above, as I am feeling incredibly angry about this thread. I don't think that it is ineluctably masculine to feel a sense of joy in winning a competition, or in being good at something, and I think that criticising women for that is frankly not allowing women to be whole people.