Why is menstruation so dirty?

[IceBeing]

I got so much interesting information from my last thread I thought I would try again!

I mean I know the answer is 'the patriarchy' but....

why do I feel so repelled by all things menstrual? I am pretty sure I'm not alone...but while I would have no issue whatsoever with someone seeing a blood stain on my arm (from a cut or something) I would actually die from shame if anyone saw my menstrual blood.

How do I stop my DD from being infected with the idea that menstruation is dirty?

How do I cure myself?

I have managed to cure myself of the idea that armpit hair is dirty...and leg hair...but this seems an order of magnitude harder!

53- have an old towel handy .

MrsCakes - oh, I just meant, I would think that if you are dating a nice bloke, he is less likely to be the type to say 'eww, periods', isn't he? Depends how you define nice, of course, and I have been with a perfectly nice bloke who did do the 'eww periods' thing, but I forgive him as he was 17 at the time!

So...does the disgust around menstruation tie in somehow with the idea that women's body hair is also disgusting. As a society are we hiding more of the traits that make us women in case they offend people?

x-post, thanks Jeanne.

53 - I feel the same now we have a white duvet cover!
I'm pretty relaxed about menstrual blood (I could happily taste it, can't remember if I have or not because I am THAT relaxed) but I'd get stressed over the possibility of extra laundry...

Well, I depart from Greer in that I feel it's the laundry responsibility rather than the menstrual-blood-tasting that is the bigger feminist issue.

Though I know someone's got to do it.

*I don't think it is particularly taboo, just private/personal, like taking a shit is also quite private and personal for most people. We don't announce to anyone but our nearest and dearest that we are having a period any more than we get up from our desk and announce to our colleagues that we are off for a shit, or offer them a close up look at the snot in our tissue or the earwax on the end of a cotton bud.

I don't understand why you feel we should be needing to 'de-stigmatise' it any more than we should be trying to de-stigmatise shit or snot. All of them are inevitable, none of them are especially pleasant.*

I completely agree. All this mythologising I find a bit ridiculous. If the inventor of the mooncup had gone out of his/her way to come up with a name guaranteed to make me not buy one they couldn't have found a better one.

Greer is just Greer talking bollocks ,which she does frequently.

Castigating a sexual partner who doesn't want to perform oral sex on a menstruating woman is deeply unreasonable.

And it does smell, not infected (thank you very much)just a hot, irony smell. I don't like the smell of liver either and menstrual blood and clots are far worse because it's still warm

Surprised noone else has mentioned...?
I think a large part of it comes from the blue liquid adverts, teaching people from as soon as they can see the telly that period blood is so disgusting that adverts for menstrual products have no mention of the word 'blood' nor anything other than euphemism (and brght blue water)

It IS dirty when left outside the body and not washed. Bacteria, smell, etc. Not dirty when just coming out.

Oh and (from upthread) my kids know when i am menstruating. Theyre too nosy not to! Their understanding of tampons and pads are that they are special 'plasters', and that mammy bleeds because she isnt having a baby. Whats the fuss, its only biology?

In the past, pregnancy, breast feeding (combined with lower body weight), maybe until child was 2 or more, meant a lot fewer periods! Then pregnant again... So I suppose was a v good sign a woman was fertile again.

In Longbourn by Jo Baker (P&P written from the servants' POV - which I didn't think was perfect but I really enjoyed the read) the housemaid complains at one point about having to scrub the rags when all five Bennet girls' periods coincide. Obviously the author isn't contemporary to the period!

Most women who worked must have had a way of managing that without bleeding everywhere they went.

There is actually really interesting evidence that many poorer women did used to openly bleed in the fields or factories. It is even mentioned in the Bible when one woman says she can not stand up from the straw she is sitting on, as she is bleeding into it. Although in the bible story this is a ruse as she is actually hiding something under the straw. Sorry for the vague details, as it is all from memory.

The Ancient Egyptians had tampons, so obviously some sort of protection has been around for ages. It's a bit egocentric to assume it's only been in the 20th century that anyone thought to absorb the flow!

I didn't say that. I said that poorer women did routinely just bleed in the fields. There have always been artefacts that rich people use throughout history, that poorer people don't.
There are descriptions of women working in fields in France bleeding openly. Some poorer women in some cultures and times did use protection. But it is wrong to think that this was always the case.

Sorry Mariamin my brain was still on housemaids and other indoor staff (who I can't imagine would be able to bleed freely in many situations?) - I was vaguely aware of field and factory workers. I imagine it would vary by region, culture, background etc

Halfway through the Sara Read article and she definitely thinks there are class differences. This is really interesting.

I've read the thread, and can't see that anyone has raised the point that you can be "toilet-trained" for urine and faeces, but you can't control your own menstrual flow. It is "shameful" if you soil yourself by losing control of your bladder/bowels. Ergo it is shameful if you soil yourself because you can't control your own menstrual flow.

Not saying I agree with this, but that's the underlying logic, I think. People who can't control their bowels/bladders are usually the very young or the very old, so there's the implication of being weak/helpless. So possibly a feminist issue by association, further "evidence" to lump women in that category.

Castigating a sexual partner who doesn't want to perform oral sex on a menstruating woman is deeply unreasonable.

still, come on, be fair: my point was that some men (and some women) think that the idea of oral sex on a menstruating woman is utterly revolting, and think oral sex on a man is totally normal and women who don't want to do it are odd.

My point is, when you think about it, one is no more logically fine than the other. It's my cultural conditioning too. I wouldn't particularly like the idea of oral sex with someone who was menstruating, and I have no problem with blow jobs. But, I don't think there's much logic to that position, is there?

I raised exactly that point Bigfoot

The control thing makes a lot of sense to me - I think that's another reason why using a cup has made me so much more relaxed about menstrual fluid (and yes, I have tasted it - my own and other people's - it doesn't really taste of much, in case you were wondering!). The fact that disposable sanitary products tend to be white seems to underscore the aspect of helplessly soiling something - the tampon, the pad, your pants, the sheets etc while if you use a cup it almost feels like an achievement. I'm a bit disappointed that my otherwise excellent meluna doesn't have scale markings - I'd love to emerge from the loos high-fiving everybody and shouting "62ml bitchez!!!"
But perhaps that's just as well.

Wow thanks for all the responses. Once again MN feminism chat is not disappointing!

I am taken by the control issue. I hate the sliding feeling of blood leaking out and it makes sense now I think about it from that point of view.

I have found the mooncup to be a revelation in terms of smell and flow control, but I also see to have a reaction to them and get sore quite quickly.

stubbornstains that's the whole point... couldn't be arsed fussing around with old towels just in case I fancied sex while I was bleeding. But fortunately I went through the menopause a few years ago so the only thing staining my sheets these days is cat paw prints!

I've read the thread, and can't see that anyone has raised the point that you can be "toilet-trained" for urine and faeces, but you can't control your own menstrual flow. It is "shameful" if you soil yourself by losing control of your bladder/bowels. Ergo it is shameful if you soil yourself because you can't control your own menstrual flow.

It is a rubbish biological design in that sense. It would make a lot more sense to be able to expel menstrual blood like urine or faeces. God got it wrong.

Ebearhug I remember boys at school who thought that's what happened! That you went to the loo for an extra few minutes and expelled your period, all done