trial of alleged rape victim who killed herself

[chaosmonkey]

www.theguardian.com/law/2014/nov/06/call-crown-prosecutors-account-suicide-alleged-rape-victim

A young woman who said she had been raped went on to kill herself after the Crown Prosecution Service put her on trial for making up the allegation in a case originally instigated by her alleged attacker.

A bit speechless, so have just cut and paste initial para - sorry

Countess,
The police mentioned 'inconsistencies' in the woman's story so your hypothetical examples may actually be close to the truth - not sure.

The CCTV, if it stood alone, could/would still be evidence that countered the womens story. A hypothetical prosecution might try and undermine that evidence, or inference from it, by introducing the model of post rape erratic behaviour. This might make it neutral evidence or it might still undermine the plausibility of her story. It would be a matter for the jury. However in this case there is other evidence that is also compatible with his story such as her diagnosis and her texts.

On the other hand, had there been CCTV evidence that showed her as irritable, pushing him away, staring daggers at him, turning from him, resisting kisses etc, then for sure a hypothetical prosecution would be using that as evidence against him. And in turn, the defence would try to explain away such evidence and it would be for the jury to consider the merits of such evidence.

Whatever conclusions a jury came to, it would not 'automatically mean' that a single juror had bought into a rape myth.

You come across as if you are posting here to specifically defend this particular man. It's hard to believe someone would do that based on a mouthpiece article in the Daily Mail. He may have had copy approval for all you know. He certainly can say anything he wants as she's dead. You seem to have swallowed everything as if it had been evidence in court subject to cross examination. That seems either gullible or biased.

Flora,
Not at all- it was a thread that caught my eye on the back of another thread. Then I got caught up in the discussion.

There is nothing gullible or biased about accepting (with the usual suspended disbelief) the reported evidence in the 1st instance, particularly as the CPS felt they had evidence that could prove she had perverted the course of justice.

There is no reported evidence, just a Daily Mail puff piece.

Well if it transpires that the CCTV footage was fake, that there were no 'best sex' texts and she was never diagnosed bi-polar and the CPS never intended to take her to trial for 'perverting justice' etc then perhaps you might have a point.
The BBC and telegraph reported similar details so no doubt they are also part of the puff piece conspiracy you allude to.

This may have been said before, in which case apologies. But having a mental health issue DOES NOT in itself make people more likely to make false allegations. It does make you statistically far more likely to suffer sexual assault. It also makes you far less likely to be believed by the police, CPS and other criminal justice agencies - anecdotally also by the public. This is hugely enhanced if the unwell person is female or from a minority ethnic group.

None of these factors may have influenced this particular case. But without insider knowledge of this specific case, it's invidious to treat it as if no such factors could possibly have come in.

Agreed you have to consider all the evidence and not just one piece in isolation.

The CPS felt they had sufficient evidence to prove her guilty of perverting justice and the evidence reported in a variety of media sources indicates that they were right to do so.

We dont know if they would have succeeded as 3 days before her trial she took her own life.

Possibly but extremely unlikely given the available evidence.

That would be where the tired old rape myths come in. You really have no idea what happened between these two people. There was no jury trial to decree that she lied. The "evidence" was never heard in court. I infer from the aggregate of the evidence I have available to me, and you can call it bias as much as you want, that you have bought into common rape myths. If you didn't, you wouldn't see the "evidence" you claim is so damning as particularly significant in anything other than a legal context, within a legal system where the vast majority of rapists get away with their crimes.

We have a very good idea.

The CPS felt they had enough evidence to prove her guilty of perverting the course of justice.

She prevented the trial happening through taking her own life.

I havent brought in any 'rape myths' - you would 'like' me to have done so as it fits your narrative but I have not - sorry to disappoint you on that.

git you don't have a good idea. You don't have any idea at all. You're simply accepting the viewpoints of a man accused of rape and construing all his statements through the lens of rape myths. So far so absolutely fucking normal.

Flora,
With respect you are just repeating a comfortable mantra:
eg- "its rape myths, you have no idea, its misogyny etc etc"

It's not just his viewpoints that have been expressed in the various media outlets.
Whatever evidence there was, it was sufficient for the CPS to try to bring the girl to trial for perverting the course of justice.
So we do have a good idea- a very good idea indeed as the CPS only do this when there is plentiful evidence and a good chance of conviction.

As I am sure you realise, being so eminently sensible and reasonable, the CPS is frequently wrong in what they can and can't prove. We have no idea what happened in this case, as the evidence on both sides, including the key testimony of the two people who actually knew what happened, was never fully heard. A legal decision on guilt or innocence was never able to be made. You appear to view Eleanor de Freitas' suicide as some sort of a getout clause. When really you have no idea what drove her to kill herself. Perhaps being raped and not being believed by people like you?

But do enjoy your baseless speculations anyway. It's not as if she can prove you wrong, is it?

I'll draw whatever conclusions I personally think any evidence points to, as well. Starting with my strong impression, based on your posts, that you don't really grasp what certain rape myths consist of or understand why they are so pervasive and damaging.

So we do have a good idea- a very good idea indeed as the CPS only do this when there is plentiful evidence and a good chance of conviction.

Naive and deluded.

We do have an idea of what went on in the case.
Just some of the details:
They had a brief affair where a sexually adventurous tantric sex coach (who advertised on the net- a secret from her friends) initiated a sexual relationship with a wealthy man.
They had multiple sex sessions at his flat where she texted her father at 2am so he would not be worried.
She subsequently texted her friend that it was the best sex of her life and texted him she was addicted to him etc.
They then spent 100s of quid in a sex shop the next day which was seen on CCTV.
She then sent bizarre tests about suicide to him.
This and other behaviours led him to break off the relationship.
Soon after she alleged to her friends that he drugged, imprisoned and raped her.
Her friends told him of her rumour spreading so he went to the police to stop her harassing him and spreading rumours- but they arrested him.

Hers was a serious allegation that could have resulted in a very long sentence from 10-14 years.
She suffered from a bi-polar disorder and was prone to erratic behaviour.
2 months later the CPS eventual dropped the case after they found her evidence 'inconsistent'.
He started a private prosecution to clear his name which was taken over by the CPS.
They were about to have their trial but tragically she took her own life 3 days before.

The CPS may not be perfect but they rarely take on these sorts 'false allegation' cases unless there is strong evidence.
And you are again resorting to simply stating 'rape myth' rather than looking at the details of a particular case on their merits.

I mean, one has to ask, what would you say DID constitute likely evidence of a false rape allegation if this case doesnt qualify?? serous question btw…

Evidence is presented in court and is subject to cross-examination. Other evidence can be brought forward to put certain aspects of evidence in context. None of that has happened here.

You, git, can view everything you've read in a way that enables you to believe the man accused of rape. It's much easier that way, isn't it?

Cross examination you say?

Can you cross examine multiple texts?
Can you cross examine CCTV?
Can you evaluate physical evidence that doesnt exist due to the allegation only being made after being dumped?

Remember the guy WANTED the trial- he had to fight for that trial till the CPS took the case over.

He was denied his vindication due to her passing.

Its true that I think she made a false allegation - a view shared by the CPS.

ps can you describe evidence that would suggest a false allegation in your opinion?

pps I enjoyed the witty insult at the end there by the way- clever work.

The CPS may not be perfect but they rarely take on these sorts 'false allegation' cases unless there is strong evidence.?

Absolute bullshit. Go google Layla Ibrahim or Gail Sherwood. In both cases the police fucked up the rape investigation before it even got off the ground by losing, disregarding or compromising vital evidence, and then chose to charge these women with perverting the course of justice with no real grounds for that belief. The CPS were more than happy to proceed to trial.

It must be nice in your world, where the justice system never gets it wrong.

In both of those cases, there must have been some grounds and some evidence against them as both were convicted.

Reading up on both I can see why a jury convicted them, especially Sherood. Thatstuff just from reading theirony version of events. Can't seem to find the court record.

There are miscarriages of justices in this country, I don't see those two cases as an example.

Back to this case. With an IPCC complaint against the police and a complaint against CPS, it will soon become clear if these texts exist.

Venus,
I never said the CPS never, ever get it wrong.
I was on a different thread only the other day saying the CPS got it wrong on another case.

But nonetheless they mostly get it right and they rarely take on such cases and when they do its because they have evidence.

If you are saying you can NEVER trust the CPS then we had better let out every murderer, rapist and thief that ever got convicted.

Mengog,
Interesting you think both Venus's examples were correctly convicted - I will try and look them up later.

Im very interested in the texts too- if it turns out they exist the police have a lot of explaining to do. If they dont exist ditto… but for different reasons…

Just read 3 different Sherwood accounts.
Police were incompetent and although there was some evidence she had lied- it was a very odd case- from what I have read she should not have been convicted. Clearly the jury disagreed but juries do make errors too.

Just read Ibrahim accounts.
Similar thing… incompetent forensics, and while there is some incriminating evidence against her its inconclusive and I'm surprised she was convicted by a jury.

Gita why do you keep quoting this man's version of events (as told to the Daily Mail) as fact?

Amethyst
I have quoted from a number of sources including the guardian, BBC & others.

But the most salient 'fact' is that the CPS brought her to trial for 'perverting the course of justice' as they felt they could gain a conviction based on evidence.

Is there an aspect to his version of events or the reported evidence that you dispute?

There are miscarriages of justices in this country, I don't see those two cases as an example.

Good for you. I'm sure the world was holding its breath to find out your opinion on the matter.