Please remind me why I'm not letting my daughters have Barbies

[plantsitter]

They really, really want them and it's so difficult to stand firm... Please give me some arguments to keep me (not them!) convinced.

Thanks in advance!

Because the genderizing of girls (and boys) begins at such a young age anyway. By the age of 3-4 both boys and girls are already picking things as 'male' or 'female', but they are still learning about gender at this stage, and believe that gender is flexible and can be changed. Buying Barbie would contribute to solidifying exactly the gender biases that you are trying to prevent. They will get enough gender influences from school, teachers, their friends, TV, etc, etc.

Honestly I don't think it will turn them into bimbos unless that's the message they're getting elsewhere. My daughter had them, even had a few shudder Bratz (hated those dead eyes!) then moved on to Monster High.

I can honestly say that her only body confidence issues come from girls at school (one little so and so initiated a waist measuring session when they were 6!) and currently she gets asked why her hair is dark, why is her skin so pale, why are her legs so fat etc etc. She's 13.

Admittedly a lot of the girls in her years are very thin with totally straight legs and have mousy/blonde long straight hair, so Dd's short dark hair and curvy figure may seem alien to them.

But Dd considers herself a feminist and does her best to carry on regardless!

How old are they?

Are there any dressing-up dolls (for want of a better term) around at the moment that have a less extreme figure?

Sorry for Daily Fail link, but...

"If Barbie was* a real woman she'd be forced to walk on all fours and would be physically incapable of lifting her over-sized head"

*or "were", as we say in English...

Did you have Barbies as a child? I know that it is anecdotal, but I really don't think they did me any harm and DD is really enjoying playing with hers.

Let them find their own way.
Let them have them.

I used to think this before my daughter was born - she's now 25. She loved dolls, though, and I wasn't going to police what other children gave her as presents, so she had quite a few Barbies. What I noticed was that when she played with them the roles the dolls played didn't depend on the type of doll she was playing with, so Barbie might be the little sister, the bald baby doll might be the mum, Action Man was the baby, etc.

In the end, she will be most influenced by what you talk to her about, by what you do, by her friends, by what she reads and what she watches on tv.

My daughter's been a feminist since she could speak but can still remember the pleasure she got from playing with her dolls.

Someone will buy them one anyway as soon as they invite school friends to parties! My younger son wanted a Barbie - he also wanted fairy wings, Action Man and a dolls house. I think young children are just little magpies who like 'attractive' things and will go for a wide range if the gender stereotypes haven't been rammed down their throats.

I'd be inclined to use Barbie as an opportunity to talk about the issues rather than trying to alter their thinking by denying them one.

I wouldn't let my sons have toy guns but they picked up sticks and pointed them at each other. When they were about 8 my dad bought them an air rifle without asking me!
For me it was a similar argument as healthy eating - I wanted my children to have a healthy diet but knew that the occasional packet of Haribo would't kill them In the same way, if the messages that they receive from you, your partner, friends and family promote equality and minimise gender stereotypes then a hideously deformed plastic doll with a sickly smile on her pouty lips isn't going to poison their minds.

I really don't think they do any harm. One of my DDs was never interested, the other loves them. They're just dolls.

To give your eldest something to go to therapy about when you give in and let subsequent children have them

Because they reinforce sexist stereotypes about women?

Because they are bloody horrible toys?

Because they aren't even nice dolls, or well made?

Because there are better things to be teaching your child than unattainable physical attributes, nice clothes and a painted on smile are the meaning of life?

"Let them find their own way." Except they aren't finding their own way are they? Otherwise we would have boys clamouring for Barbies as well.

It seems a few of us on this thread found our own way in spite of barbies, though.
Feminism gives girls and women choices.
I won't take away my girls choices.
I can point out the destination I would like for them, but I will leave them to find the way.
Barbies mingle with shin pads in my house of girks.

I haven't and wouldn't buy one myself and I wont buy one for other girls. However, my girls now have two that they have been given as gifts. They quickly bored of them and the Barbies spend a lot of time at the bottom of the toy bin with the horrid My Little Unicon type things.

I subscribe to The Mighty Girl and they have some great resources for sharing with girls of all ages around many topics. There is some good stuff on there about what a real women would look like/be able to do (or rather not do) if her body was that of Barbie. The DDs (6 & 8) were fascinated and repulsed, tbh which was highly satisfactory. We talk a lot about having strong healthy bodies and the enjoyment we get from what our bodies can do - running, jumping,dancing, cycling.

So to sum up my approach - a ban glamourises the forbidden item. Exposure and explanation demystifies it and makes it a bit meh.

Thanks for replies. Some interesting ones.

I did have Barbies (sindies actually) but I have terrible self-image now! Of course I don't put that down to just having Sindies as a kid.

I suppose my original objection was the body image one and what they would grow up believing is beautiful, but that seems like a losing battle now anyway given all the other influences.

We do have Lottie dolls which are the 'wholesome' alternative but they just don't have the draw of Barbie et al.

Will have a look at the mighty girl thanks. I like your approach shutuplegs. I will have a think.

scallopsrgreat my boy clamoured for a Barbie and was given one I suspect that the problems lie with people who think it's 'weird' to give 'girls'' toys to boys. Ds2 used to love dressing up as a fairy.

IF you are looking at A Mighty Girl, it useful to be on their Facebook feed. The main website is a list of resources but they put great "starters for 10" type posts on their Facebook. I'll see if I can dig out the Barbie one - it was recent.

It often prompts me to get the girls to look at the posts and it sparks a useful discussion.

I can't find it via A Mghty Girl but his is one that we looked at;

barbie proportions drawn on a women

Blimey, that last post was almost unreadable with typos. Sorry.

Couldn't you get her this one? You could say that she's so thin because she had dysentery caught from working in some exotic but remote locations.

its fine to not give your children whatever they ask for, but having fashion dolls will not harm them. Yours and the rest of your family and friends attitude to bodies and people in general are what hurts girls. Not dollies.

if its the company you dont like, how about 2nd hand ones or another brand?

I don't see the point in restricting them. They are harmless toys.

I do agree with the poster who said that by banning them you're giving them a mystical allure. One of my son's friends wasn't allowed a tv and wanted to sit in front of ours for hours on end when he came round to play. My son wanted the telly off when friends were round - far more interested in playing with his Barbie!

Toward the stars is also a great website for toys, resources and clothing that doesn't reinforce negative gender stereotypes.