Not all men

[AskBasil]

Interesting article here

Yep. It's totally OK for him to be a sexist prick. Because he's only sexist in private. Or he's not all men.

Or something.

Buffy - no it absolutely does not come from the same place as NAMALT.

The people who are saying he should not lose his position are not NAMALT at all.

A crowd full of men booed him at the Man city game last week. They undoubtedly would feel themselves in the NAMALT group.

Lord Ouseley, the chairman of football’s anti-discrimination body, Kick It Out, said: “The Prime Minister stated earlier today that he wouldn’t tolerate these types of comments in his own cabinet. Men who clearly don't support Mr Scudamore.

I like many men are appalled by the emails and cannot understand how the FA and Premier League appear to have cleared him.

I think if you were to make comments that go anywhere near suggesting that men as a 'class' are indifferent to what Mr Scudamore has done you will be dead wrong. I personally would be deeply insulted and that would be nothing to do with semantics over 'some men' or 'all men'.

They cleared him because they don't care about women, just like men as a class.

And who the fuck are you to demand that women discuss sexism in a way that does not offend you?

"I think if you were to make comments that go anywhere near suggesting that men as a 'class' are indifferent to what Mr Scudamore has done you will be dead wrong"

Really? Are you saying that he is an exception, then? A one off?

Well he's still got his job.

Men as a class haven't booed loud enough it seems.

I think he'll win, because men as a class simply aren't as disgusted by injustice and inequality as they should be.

It doesn't offend them to have their mothers, sisters, daughters, friends, referred to as gashes. It doesn't make them cringe and be angry to hear women being dismissed as irrational - by the head of a sport synonymous with male irrationality.

They simply don't care that much. It doesn't matter how much the PA protests that she's not a militant feminist, it doesn't matter how sensible and calm and measured the language used by Women in Football is, it doesn't matter what linguistic and tone hoops women jump through, this man will be allowed to stay in his job because men as a class don't fucking care about women and all the bending over backwards to reassure them that we know they're not the nasty other ones, will make not one iota of difference.

Great post, red.

ManWith, some people in the past protesting against their group's behaviour have used the phrase " not in my name" - would you find that helpful?

Basil, I'm not sure it's that cut and dry. I think it's unfair to label a sport or all football fans in that way. The premier league consists of 18 teams. If I take your assumption that all football fans are male ( I know this not to be the case) the majority of money the premier league earns is from overseas. Fans won't boycott their teams because they see them as part of their community. Something passed down by their ancestors. Something akin to a religion.
Most of the message boards and radio feedback I have seen, outright condem scudemore.
Next seasons income for the premier league £5.5 billion. If you know how to get at people at the top of this size of business then please let me know.

Also, he is not head of a sport. That's Greg dyke. However, the FA have no power over the premier league

Srry for not reading thefucking full thread, so it may have already been said.

But I really don't care if men are on side at all because men only make up half the population. They aren't the majority. If we get all the women on side everything will change and we won't just be getting equality on male terms but on women's terms. "Nice guys" always seem to be the most entitled twats of them all... (yeah, rape is such a concern, but I'm only going to worry about it if you ask me to do so... and nicely) so I'm especially not worried about convincing them.

I think it's unfair to label a sport or all football fans in that way.

Boo fucking hoo. Apart from internet boards and calling radio stations, what have football fans actually done to try to get to Scudamore. Men seem to have no problem running the entire fucking world but faced with one man in charge of a sports organisation and all of a sudden they're asking women how to deal with it.

ManWith, if the email had said "never employ more than one black person because when they get together, the gets too much" - do you think he would have been pushed harder to resign?

WhentheRed - yes I totally agree with your last two posts.

I don't go to football matches, barely watch it on TV and am not that interested in the game - but there are men who have that interest in the game, they buy the tickets, the food, the programmes, etc.

I would like to see the The Football Supporters Federation organise a campaign on this.

Again it is a specific idea that asks men to get behind. For example, ask men to commit to not going to the first premier League match of next season in protest. Its one game but a huge amount of money. Its the wielding of economic power in the game that will that makes things change - or protect the staus quo.

BillnTeds - yes I do like that 'Not in My Name' idea a lot. It could be a general slogan for all men to use and get behind a lot of issues like this. A sort of continuous campaign that men can sign up to.

I know it might sound cheesy but you know men are pretty happy to be seen publicly getting behind the Movember idea. Loads of men get involved in charity events as well as campaigning on all sorts of issues. Its not like men don't care or want to campaign. It just needs some sort of focus.

Men cant really engage like women can in 'Feminism' - its a movement for women by women but men could have their own movement. There just isn't one. I think if a few well known male public figures came out and said something about these issues then a 'Not in My Name' idea could quickly take hold.

Scudamore, while disgusting... isn't footballs biggest problem though. SO why should we expect them to care about a few words on a screen when they don't care about the huge problems?

If prostitution goes up wherever a football match is hosted why would FIFA send the world cup to Brazil, a country known for child prostitution? Where are the fans boycotting that? If a football fan is known to use prostitutes will they get a ban? They ban them for racist behaviour don't they?

Those are all fantastic ideas, manwithnoname. Why don't you get them started? I'm happy to help in any way I can.

Prostitution goes up wherever you get large concentrations of men with money to spend. Its a fact not specifically linked to football.

I realise this is extremely frustrating. There are so many issues here men need to get engaged with. It feel overwhelming.

I do get why sometimes feminists want to blame 'all men'. I can see why NAMALT is intensely annoying - it seems like men as a group don't care don't care even though large numbers (the vast majority) actually do.

Every journey starts with a single step. If we could get football fans to agree there is no place for sexism, racism, and every other 'ism' in football then these second order issues like violence, public disorder, prostitution, etc would also go down around football matches as well.

Giving men a cause to unite behind that isn't strictly labelled "feminism" but which campaigns to raise awareness of damaging male attitudes towards women are, and with a "not in my name" slant is a great idea, ManWith. But here's the burning question: Are you expecting women to organise this?

Because that's the crux of it. You're full of ideas of what women should do, with little apparent interest in actually affecting any change yourself.

And back to football.... I seem to remember hearing that back 100 years or so ago, there were women's teams which competed equally with men's teams, and often won. But this was terribly damaging to men's fragile egos and so the football association of the time banned women from playing.

Women's football continues now of course, as a poor relative to men's. Millions upon millions of pounds spent scouting, training, buying, selling, developing male players. A tiny fraction of that spent on women. Can you imagine how amazing women footballers would be if they had the same amount of time/money invested in training them? And you can't convince me that every single male player in the men's Premier League is better than every single female player in the whole world. There has to be some level of overlap.

This doesn't just apply to football - it's the same of all sports. I resolutely refuse to believe that there are no women in any sport who are capable of competing on the same level as men, even if they're in the minority.

The single and only reason they're excluded: because they're women. Sport is such a sexist institution it makes me utterly sick. WTF should football care about one man making a few sexist comments when the entire institution is built on deep misogyny?