The Feminist Pub - come in and chat.

[LRDtheFeministDragon]

This is something like the fourth pub chat thread - please pull up a chair at the bar. Everyone welcome.

Old thread is here: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/1920422-The-Feminist-Pub-continued?

But it's pretty much full so welcome in.

Having quite a quiet feminist week so far, in RL.

Tell a lie. DS2 said that some people in his school are a bit silly because they said only girls cry. We talked about why people cry and what you do after you had a good cry...

I am having feminist despair day. I keep starting to respond to threads on here and thinking 'oh, it's not worth it'. May have to rejoin real life for the evening...

That doesn't sound too good. Have you got any of that deep heat stuff?

Keep an eye on it, spine stuff is not fun.

'Research impact' - ooh, joy. I firmly believe MN should count as impact.

penguins - is that because MN is really (present company excepted) odd at the moment? I am finding it a bit depressing, so definitely not just you.

Boys crying is a strange one ... my dad is not very feminist in many ways but always made us aware that men crying is perfectly normal and I think he taught us a good lesson there.

Yes, I am finding it a bit odd. I'm trying to get myself a bit more 'focused' on the whole pregnancy/impending baby thing and spending time on the pregnancy boards and it does do my head in a bit.

And yes, a lot of the place seems a bit odd.

How long do you have to go? I'm terribly rude, I'm sure I've asked that before! It must be lovely.

Things are odd. I'm thinking I may just hunker down in here and wait for it all to pass. Or read old threads about the West Wing and feminism. I like discussing TV shows and feminism. I do not like clicking on three troll threads before I've had my coffee.

is that because MN is really (present company excepted) odd at the moment?

There's threads and people commenting 'is MN odd at the moment' and such like all the time though, twas ever thus - SNAFU.

Ages to go! I'm just about hitting the six month mark. It is nice, but honestly by no. 3 I keep forgetting I'm pregnant (other than when I feel shit!) and this pregnancy was a surprise (to put it mildly) and I've not totally reconciled myself to having a third baby to look after. I mean, I know we made the right decision to continue, but at times I do rather like the look of my life the way it would have been. The way all my friend's lives look as no. 2 moves out of nappies, etc. And of course that's not something you can say to people in real life.

Sorry, that was a bit glum. Didn't really mean it to be.

Maybe, errol. If so, I have joined the ranks of the jaded whingers. Though I can't much be arsed to comment on it except here.

penguins - no, didn't sound glum. It is odd, isn't it, that any other big life decision (except perhaps marriage? And for similar reasons) it'd be considered perfectly normal on occasional to talk about the cons and the fears as well as the good side. It seems normal to me.

Thanks LRD. Much like not being that fond of other people's babies, or not particularly liking the baby stage, if you hint at this type of thing in real life people tend to react as if you have grown another head.

If I had just taken a big new job that would change mine and my family's life, it would be ok to say that, although I think it was the right choice, I am slightly shitting myself. And I can't resign the baby after three months if I don't like having it .

I suspect that there is a decent feminist point in there somewhere about valuing traditionally female roles and underestimating what they require from us. But I'm too tired to dig about for it.

No, I think that point is pretty much out there.

I do see what you're saying, entirely. And I promise I won't look at you as if you have grown another head if you say so (though, you know, you pretty much have by now ...).

Yeah, I kind of have. Maybe one day I'll say it out loud!

Sorry, come on, muttered about myself and now off to bed. Hope others are all ok and surviving these yucky short, wet days of January.

Night all

You do! And night. And stop apologizing! That's what this pub is for, some muttering amongst ourselves.

Just now, chat with DD (who is nearly 15) - we still like to share a chapter of a book at bedtime but sometimes nowadays she'll start talking about something that's happened during the day. But tonight it was 'You know, I'm still pissed off with that teacher from year 1'.

I knew exactly what she meant - the teacher who had asked the class what they wanted to be when they grew up. Well, since the age of 3 she'd always said 'a builder' - by which she meant building aeroplanes or bridges or robots or suchlike. So that's what she told the teacher, who said 'oh no, girls can't be builders'. So DD grumpily wrote 'ballet dancer' like every other girl in her class. (we obviously told her that her teacher was rather old and behind the times and of course she could build things when she grew up)

Anyway, tonight she had a nice rant about how if anyone ever again tells her she can't do something because she's a girl they'd be sorry for it - if a teacher did it (which obviously they wouldn't in a girls school nowadays, unthinkable) she'd march off to tell the headteacher. She made some comment about objectification in relation to the 'ballet dancer' bit too.

I've got me a spitting feminist kitten!

Your DD sounds awesome!

I love that. Because so many people would just think, no, ok, I've been told, I'll do something else. To remember when she was that little ... that's kick-arse.

Well, DD knew from prior discussions with us that the teacher was wrong. Part of what she was cross about tonight was that back then she couldn't tell the teacher what she really thought.

Yes, cos students aren't allowed to disagree with teachers. It' all about power and control.

I'm having a crap feminist time, as in I cba to be one!

There's a conference a 5 hour drive from me in Feb. I have a presentation I could do which they've accepted, but the idea of a 5 hour drive 1 or 2 days in the arse end of nowhere with nobody I know, being a serious intellectual feminist, then driving 5 hours back, specially when it could all be 2 feet deep in snow and I get horribly travel sick, just does not appeal.

I only put in a paper cos it will look good with work, who are terribly thrilled to be able to say their teachers present at conference. Why can't it be a week in Hawaii or California? I'd settle for Florida, but the middle of nowhere Ohio? What was I thinking?

Yes, cos students aren't allowed to disagree with teachers. It' all about power and control.

In this case , more to do with being 5 and shy TBH! She would now - one of the other things she said was along the lines of, if someone says something like that , do something about it or it'll piss you off forever.

Just checking in. Been a while - hope all are well.

I'm sooooo tired. And just so tired of reading crap on MN - not on FWR but the rest. I didn't respond - but the thread about the dh being horrible to his wife with the difficult baby just about did me in. It exhausts me. Why is motherhood/caring for dc treated as nothing ? What - children just bring up themselves do they?? And there are others.. I need to go to bed I think.

V sad cos dog is poorly. I don't think he'll get better. And I love my dog.

Oh, no. Is he aware of it? I hope not. Always seems easier when they don't realize they are too ill.

Sorry you've had that news.

He's back at home with us tonight- which makes us v happy and him v tail-waggy. But he's not himself and hasn't eaten anything which is worrying and I have to get meds into him tomorrow - which is going to be interesting if he won't eat

Thanks

Oh, he sounds lovely but I can imagine.

Hopefully he'll eat a bit tomorrow.

You'll make me cry I've had a lot of friends/family clucking over me/him today too. He's a much-loved lab - soft as putty and waggy-tailed as anything. It's his heart it won't get better - but possibly can be controlled by drugs. He's better at home tonight, that's for sure - but we're preparing ourselves.

He's my protector when DH is away on business. He barks if anyone even gets near the house

Apologies for sorrowful, non-feminist turn of the thread...