Women have their little careers till they have babies. Then they do as little as possible, preferably not working at all after that

[StealthPolarBear]

I am infuriated by this attitude which seems to be prevalent. After women have had babies they only work if they have to, and go part time if they can. But I can't put into words why I work - why wouldn't I? I work for the same reasons as I did before I had children. I work for the same reasons as DH works.
Either of us could give up work and we'd cope. But that was true pre-children. Women continuing to work FT seems to be a slur on their man's ability to 'provide'.

Blueshoes, really? thats rubbish as its such a sweeping generalisation. Mil was a sahm, sil was back at work in 6 months, still flying high in her career 18 months later.

So a mother who works outside the home is also not a role model since now their daughters think they must be married to their jobs?

The role model of housewife demonstrates to your kids mum doesn't work,dad does
Leaving other working women to demonstrate working role models,in chose job
At best a housewife will recall in past tense,when they worked x,y,z job

I had a very successful career before I had children. I made an informed and thoughtful decision to move on from that career. I have explained to my children over the years why I made that decision , and have made sure that hey have lots of contact with women who have made different decisions. I am as sure as I can be that I have not damaged my children's- a specifically my daughter's- ability to make her own choices in her life.

The focus of my last post was not on role modelling - though that has clearly struck a raw nerve.

It was on the implications of stepping away from the workplace on employer perceptions of women's commitment post-children.

blueshoes

I think we are all aware of the implications of our choices. Believe me my dd will make her own choices in life and I feel it far more important to instil that she has choices.
She is 9 and already has her life mapped out and nowhere so far has she discussed not doing as she pleases.

The implications of these choices go beyond workplace perceptions.

Although I have worked throughout my dc's lives, save for when I was on maternity leave, my ds 6 has already absorbed the fact from the schoolgate and seeing his friends' families that it is mummies that look after children and daddies go out to work, even though dh and I share out childcare fairly evenly when we are home.

rubyruby, your choice in itself does not matter. But it is the drip drip of these choices added up with those of millions other women in your circumstance that reinforce the status quo.

Ah, I understand what you are saying now. Not a case of raw nerves- more unclear posting!

I had a 16 year career in which I facilitated many women returning to work, working part time, home working( long before that was a "thing") and working flexibly. I reckon I've made a powerful contribution towards women making choices. My own personal choice- and I was lucky that it was an option- was to stay at home with my children. Other women make different choices- and I d everything I can still to facilitate that. And my perception is that WOH is the societal norm in. Britain today. I often feel like an anachronism.

blueshoes.

So if your dc decide to be sahp or wohp what does it matter if they are happy and they are doing so out of choice.

I do see your point about reaffirming stereotypes but I don't see how you can make somebody change their choices in life because society sees a certain type of behaviour as the norm.

As a family we have made several choices that go against societal norms because they are right for us, other choices may be classed as a societal norm. You do what is right for your family surely.

So what if it currently reinforces the status quo? Those of us who have decided to stay at home have decided to place a higher value on home life over work. The only preconceived notion I want to change is that working outside of the home is some how better than staying home. I don't want strangers raising the my kids if we could afford for dh to be the sahd we would both welcome it. I'd like to change the idea that it's not useful to society and get 50percent of men staying home too. That's what I feel is worth changing.

I can see my dd wanting to be SAHM and not going full tilt at her career. It is her personality.

I find that a concern, which I voice to my dh. Of course I would support her in her choices, but I will also say my preference is for her to keep her financial independence and maintain a stake and voice in the working world for her security and that of her dcs. There is also the political implications of her choice, but my main wish is for her to contribute and have an identity in greater society apart from wife, mother and homemaker.

We have brought our children up to follow their dreams, that it is important to enjoy what you are doing. To become good at what you enjoy doing so you can support yourself/ and family. To support your family in non financial ways, such as emotionally. To work to live rather than live to work, so you have time for family, hobbies and interests.

Perhaps we should look at educating our dc and the messages we give them through our actions. I certainly wouldn't want my dc to see me as the stereotypical housewife, so often depicted by society, so I don't behave like it.

rubyruby, if you took on more work outside of school hours and brought in more dosh, then your dh would not have to work such long stressful hours?

So your choice potentially impinges directly on your family, not just indirectly on societal perceptions.

blueshoes

Just because you are a mother and you don't work does not mean you have no identity apart from wife, mother and homemaker, how weird.
Surely thats part of the problem.
You are part of this society and you have the idea that a sahm is not contributing and has a limited identity.

So you see aspects of her personality that would make her likely to choose homemaker as an employment choice (for lack of a better word). Then I see your job as making her feel whatever she chooses is valid, because it's likely she will pick up your true feelings and see that you don't see her as succeeding. Surely her happiness is first and foremost?

Exactly potato, just as I don't see dh as a purchaser of building supplies it's just something he does. Wed most of us be awfully boring if our whole identify was that of our employment

Satsuki, perhaps another thing that could do with changing is the idea that if one parent is not at home ft, then their children are being 'raised by strangers'. Last I checked, dh and I are raising our children, with the help of a nursery and now aupair.

I was nodding along to drowninginlaundry's post earlier in the thread. A lot of these perceptions are cultural and it is also good to recognise that as well:

"I have to say this set up still baffles me. I am from a Scandinavian country where women all work, unless they are not able for health reasons. To choose not to work when you are perfectly able is unheard of, even more so if you are educated and used to have a successful career before children. I don't know any SAHMs in my native Finland. Children are all in childcare, and there is none of this agonising and hand-wringing should-I-shouldn't-I. Conversely, I also do not know any families in Finland where men have opted out of childcare and chores, where it is always the mother getting up in the night with the toddler, or always getting up in the morning when he has a lie in (I know several couples here in the Uk where this is the norm). Where I live now (provincial town in the south) most mothers I know either don't work or have part time work at home that they can fit around school hours. When my youngest was still at nursery there was one child who was there full time, 8am to 6pm every day as his mum worked FT. Jesus the bleating: 'that poor little mite...being left for an entire day...' When did a full time working mother become a rarity? I have lived in the UK for nearly 20 years and I still don't get this."

Blue, you have no idea what ruby's husband does. I can tell you were I to go to work dh would not be allowed to go part time at work.

You knew your aupair personally before she worked for you? How unusual. The difference here is I'm not judging your lifestyle, I see it as valid, do I prefer mine? Well obviously. We all do. I'm not shocked and upset that my dd may want to grow up and get a job as you are so worried about your daughter not getting one. I want dd and ds to both see that the options are equally good.

Satsuki, I would not put happiness as the end all and be all, even for myself. That is another cultural trait to value happiness over all else.

I see my job as a parent is to ensure my children get an education and gain the skills to make a good living and lead independent and fulfilling lives, to guard against unexpected contingencies and provide for their families. And yes, their role should not just be to benefit their families but to contribute to greater society.

I am surprised you reduce your dh's job to just a purchaser of building supplies. That is one part of a organisation that provides needed goods and services to society and creates jobs and wealth/taxes that keep the economy going.

Even if you dismiss people who purchase building supplies, we must all be grateful for the thousands of men and women who apparently put their family's needs aside to work ft and possibly even anti-social shifts and foreign postings so that we can have doctors, nurses, social workers, firemen, police, armed forces and teachers.

Satsuki, do you know your dcs' teachers personally before they started teaching them?