1/2 of all state schools have no girls sitting physics A level

[Himalaya]

Just listening on the radio.

Thoughts? Experience? Ideas?

child development i think it was, not actually childcare

I'd have run from that as a teenager! Actually, I'd run from it now!

the point is i grew up thinking that these traditionally female subjects were useless, worthless, no point in learning, and now I want to know these things.

It would be more useful to me to know how to use a sewing machine then know how to make a circuit board and what a relay switch and resistor do.

This idea that females are encouraged by society in to certain roles and away from other things, my experience is exactly the opposite, i may have wanted to do child development, but would have never dare told my family, they would have thought it was a waste of time.

and then when I had my own kids I studied it later on in life.

If I did physics my family would have been immensely proud. I did economics, politics, chemistry and maths

Parental expectation and pressure sucks whichever way it's leaning. My MIL is an arse, but I'm always sorry for her that she was forced to leave school at 16. By her mother, who said there was no point in her staying on to do A levels, because she was only going to end up getting married and stopping work.

I have a sewing machine - my MIL gave it to me when I got married. I've never touched it. I had to use one at school for 3 years and hated every second of it. I have a job. I pay people to make curtains for me.

The point is that people should have the option to choose. The real option, that includes making sure the way subjects are taught and classes are organised isn't putting off those DC who are interested in them.

And surely learning how the world around you works is one of the most wonderful things you can do! I always think how lucky DC are now, growing up in a world with so much information a mouse click away. I am 35 and it still makes me feel like a 5 year old when I look at my laptop and think that it's actually made up of components that are made up of molecules and atoms and that contain tiny charged particles.

You can google how to use a sewing machine an have it sorted in minutes.

you can google how to make a circuit board too lol!!

But you wouldn't need to google eg molecular structure, so you might miss that gem.

A friend's son is doing maths, physics ad chemisty A Levels. In one class there are three students, and in another only 2, sorry I can't remmebr which subjects.

If a school only has two students sitting a subject then a figure of no girls isn't actually that bad.

"everyone should learn home economics"

Really?

It has always struck me as a waste of (mainly girls) time.

I went to an all girls school that didn't teach it at all. To my knowledge none of the women I went to school with have starved, given themselves food poisoning, failed to figure out how to do laundry or whatever.I don't think it is the place of school to teach this stuff.

(has t it been incorporated into d&t anyway?)

I'm not sure that "home economics" as traditionally taught in England is much use, but sometimes I read threads on MN and am at the lack of knowledge about very basic issues of home and personal hygiene, nutrition etc, adequate knowledge of which would improve people's lives immensely.

I think the dumbing down of the education system in general has had an enormous negative impact on traditionally harder subjects such as science and MFL. Pupils now expect to get A* in subjects and tend to drop the ones they don't think they will easily perform well in. I did all 3 sciences at O level and physics was definitely the hardest of the 3. Many of the concepts are quite abstract, involved maths and were initially Difficult to grasp. Even in the 80 s far more boys studied physics than girls.

I agree, mumzy, and even children who are clearly future candidates for Russell Group universities will avoid subjects that they might possibly not get top grades in, in order to ensure that full house of A* that they think is the first filter on their UCAS form.

For me the central issue is that girls seem to exhibit different behaviour in single sex and mixed schools (though it may not be a clean comparison as I guess the few single sex schools left are likely to be fee-paying or grammar schools).

My PhD (as a mature student) is in theoretical physics, and I now work in R&D in geosciences. The thing that struck me was how closely this news paralleled my school experience. I went to a girls' comp in the late 70s/early 80s, which went mixed when I was in the upper 6th. In my year, (the last all girls year) there were about 10 girls doing A level maths and mechanics (the traditionally boyish pairing if you were in a mixed school) and about 6 doing maths and stats, 8 doing physics and 6 doing further maths. The year after there was a handful of girls doing maths and stats and 1 girl doing maths and mech, physics and further maths. At the time, my reading of the situation was that once boys were there in school as well as outside, the girls began to police their behaviour in school to ensure they were suitably feminine and attractive - and that doing maths and physics wasn't suitably feminine and attractive (think all those stereotypes in films of the time about nerdy unattractive women scientists). In a single sex day school, girls could do what interested them during the day without having to worry about their sexual attractiveness, then put on whatever performance they wanted to/felt they had to outside school. It takes a lot of bloody mindedness in a mixed teenage environment to say "fuck how the in-crowd or majority expect me to behave, I'm doing my own thing."

But physics isn't hard! It's logical.

And intellectually stimulating - application of theory to the real world. How much more interesting and relevant can you get?

I know that some people don't "get" the logic and do find it hard, but that's the case across both genders. I am absolutely amazed that people still exist who think that girls are innately non-scientific. Thought that idea had died about 100 years ago.

As for home economics, we had textiles and food lessons at my school (girls' school) and I learnt nothing whatsoever of any use to anyone.
I learnt how to cook and how to sew on buttons/make small repairs to clothes at home.

Lurcio - I am sure you are right, but I just don't understand how a girl who excels in physics & maths (because that's how their intellect is set up) can NOT do them.

On the home ec and 'textiles' - given that many children come from families where sadly they aren't taught the basics, a course for everyone on essential life skills might be wise. Wouldn't have to be a long one. The non-practical aspects could be covered in Citizenship. But absolutely these subjects should not be, or even hinted to be 'girls' subjects. I'm glad to say the boys' GS parallel to DDs school has in the last few years built home ec facilities.

This could be supplemented - facilities and equipment allowing, which is the rub - by extracurricular activities which would be a matter of choice.

Many of the concepts are quite abstract
That was precisely one of the reasonswhy I did want to study physics and chemistry. Also because they do require teaching - whereas many arts subjects you can go a long way reading books on your own.

It takes a lot of bloody mindedness in a mixed teenage environment to say "fuck how the in-crowd or majority expect me to behave, I'm doing my own thing."

Or a total obliviousness to such factors. I don't think it for one moment crossed my mind to be influenced by whether any other girls were doing the same subjects as me. It didn't occur to me till long after, but my O-level physics class only had 2 other girls, one of whom was poor at maths and dropped out - they were two of my best friends, I wonder now how much they were influenced by my choice to do it?

I agree re a basics of life course. In textiles, which I did before I could choose not to, I made papier mâché. I think I learnt about sewing on buttons at Brownies.

I did Physics and maths A levels way back when (amongst others). Loved it. I think that the female brain is well able to be fantastic at physics. The UK culture (maths and physics are 'hard') is to blame for lack of interest. Have an Aunt who did engineering in the 50's.

Think not enough light reflection, rainbows, prisms, circuits, radio building, diffraction, magnetism, coefficient of expansion, pendula done in primary schools. The old experiments are the more exciting at first hand and good for basic principles. The Roald Dahl museum in Buckingham shire is great for physics. The science museum in London is terrible. I hear the Cavendish lab in Cambridge is worth a visit but have never been as it is not open to the public only to schools.

Loved ' The New Science of Strong Materials' one summer. A very important book to understand buildings and bridges.

Forgot to say that I have a sewing machine which I love and make curtains and clothes. Physics and sewing are perfectly compatible. I did medicine anyway.

Also want to say that studying colloids which were physics and chemistry combined made me understand so much about cooking.

Am indebted to blue Peter for papier mache. Spent a very happy summer making puppets with papier mache heads and sewing the hand glove things once.

I did Maths, Physics and French at ALevel (at a grils' school). Physics was my favourite subject, though went on to do a Maths degree. I wouldn't have minded studying with boys at a mixed school (that's what happened on my degree anyway, I was very much in the minority), but I have a very male brain!

for goodness sake, don't tell dd. her favourite videos on the intenet are physics based.

I was not allowed to do physics at school. 3 sciences was too restrictive, apparently.

I was the only girl in my Physics class. The same pupils (me included) that were in that class were also the Advanced Maths group.

I know some of my female classmates didn't want to study Physics because they deemed it boring and once the majority of the females didn't want to do it, the rest seemed to follow suit!

I'm an oddball though and was a total geek, so it didn't bother me being the only girl. Although the Physics teacher always said he felt sorry for me!

I have a daughter and although she is only 2, I will be encouraging her to study all the sciences when she is older.

cookery and textiles lessons at my dds school just irritate her and me

I would LOVE to see home ec dropped, in fact I have asked for it to be made non-compulsory at dds school (independent). I'd like to see electronics or even woodwork offered as an alternative. She can cook well enough already and has no interest in taking it any further, I can cook so she'll learn from me as it is.