Male nannies/childminders

[Lottapianos]

Just listening to a discussion on the radio about male nannies. The general feeling is that having men work with young children is a good thing. No argument there!

However, the reason given is not because men are 50% of the population and it's good for children to spend time with both men and women so they can start to see both sexes as equal. The reason is that 'men and women play differently' - men are more 'rough and tumble' and kids love that Oh and some boys are growing up without a man in the home and they need a male role model in order to develop normally and not grow up gay. Or something

I really do get sick of all this essentialism - men do this, women do that - in the same way as I can't stand people talking about how boys and girls are inherently different. I really think that putting people into boxes based on their biological sex is stifling and unfair - what happens to people who don't 'perform' in the way they are expected?

Any thoughts on this issue?

yes I DID mean to say at the end "none of them would subscribe to this view, and it has no effect in RL." Quite an omission.

Empusa - your comment re 'equality' and feminism is pretty much why I have never self-identified as a feminist, tho' subscribing to most principles, and being in support of feminism over the years. In a 'questionnaire' posted by someone ( I forget who) recently I was assessed as an 'equalist'. Which this thread makes me happily think I was properly assessed!

One of the reasons why there are so few men in childcare and primary school teaching, but childcare in particular, is ecause of the low pay. We pay people more to look after our cars tan our children.

Ch

Looking after children, a traditionally female role, is massively undervalued.

It is going to stay a female role with the attitudes on this thread.

Quite exotic

pan I'd much rather call myself an Equalist. That's the one thing this world really needs.

The majority of the attitudes on this thread is that men should be nannies and sit next to lone children on flights and that those who have a problem with that because of pedophiles are fearmongers.

I think that I will have to go with equalist. I find it irritating that I could have 17 yr old twins and the DD could earn money babysitting and the DS couldn't. Luckily I had friends who did pay my DS as a babysitter.

There's a male nursery nurse at DD's nursery. I didn't think anything of it when he was introduced to me; we then went round the corner and the manager whispered to me that 'I know it seems odd having a man here but it IS good for the children to have a male role model and he's really very good...' I must have looked a bit as she kept on going on about it until I said 'I don't mind either way, honestly!' I guess they have lots of people being concerned about having a man working there, which I find rather sad.

FoodUnit Sun 09-Sep-12 11:58:09
And the reason touching children is now taboo is not because of 'peedo hysteria' but because of very real acts of abuse overwhelmingly perpetrated by males. So the perpetrators deserve the blame for these measure, not those who want to prevent them from perpetrating.

Let me fix that for you:So the perpetrators deserve the blame for these measure, not the innocent parties that the ignorant are attempting to blame

The majority of the attitudes on this thread is that men should be nannies and sit next to lone children on flights and that those who have a problem with that because of pedophiles are fearmongers.

Well, Pretzel, that's not my view.

I advise my child(ren) to avoid strangers and to know their own boundaries and to loudly protest and report inappropriate contact. I think men should be nannies to those families who want them - or daycare workers, or reception teachers - and like all other professionals in that role they should be well trained, CRB checked, well referenced, well monitored ...

I don't let any tom, dick or harry look after my children. I DO let a male teenager babysit my toddler, despite having been sexually abused by a male babysitter when I was a child, because I know this particular individual better than my parents knew my male babysitter, have known him for years, and because I have other precautions in place which my own parents neglected (including teaching my children that their bodies are theirs, and who can touch them, etc). I do not think our babysitter's gender makes him a threat because I know him.

FWIW I do think that statistically, children are more likely to be sexually abused by males than females, and I do think I would advise my children to seek out parents-with-children when lost, beware strange men, etc. I don't think that's rampantly absurd.

The difference between a carefully sourced man employed in a caring role, and a random strange male - or female! - sitting next to an unaccompanied minor on a plane, is enormous.

Men aren't Paedophiles.

paedophiles are paedophiles.

cf. men aren't rapists; rapists are rapists

The majority of rapists and childmolestors are male
This WILL influence people's views.

Exactly OneMoreChap you have hit the nail on the head.

But the majority isn't always the rule is it.

blackcurrants Tue 11-Sep-12 21:31:01
I do not think our babysitter's gender makes him a threat because I know him.

Of course, most abuse is from someone known, not "strangers".

Maybe we could have an equalist board?

The new movement starts on Mumsnet!

A few people asked for an Equalist board back when the massive FWR bust up happened, and got human rights instead

Heh heh.

I was waiting for a rad v lib comment.

Had no idea the outcome had been human rights, though. 'twas all so shoddy and divisive, this is the first time I've been back, I think. Certainly haven't been loitering.

It was nuts. I'd been off MN for a while (stuck in hospital :() and came back to absolute carnage.

Haven't read any of the comments - page 12! - but just want to say that some of my gay friends have been the best!! babysitters

me being away a week!<

AND he was a teenager,

Me LP

God bless them forever!! for helping me keep my sanity ;-)

Believe me, I understand the fear.

We need to have faith as a society that not every single person is a criminal.

We also need to have real prison time for rape.

OneMoreChap you posted Of course, most abuse is from someone known, not "strangers". As if you thought that might be news to me. I am well aware of that. As I mentioned upthread, I was molested as a child by someone well known to me.

As a result, as I also mentioned upthread, I therefore have other precautions in place to protect my child's safety.

blackcurrants what you said was
I do not think our babysitter's gender makes him a threat because I know him.

Oh well, as you know him that's all right then.

Unless you specify that you "have other precautions" people might assume that you assess risks and make judgments, like all parents do. For example, I wouldn't have left 3 children alone in a house, while I went for a meal with friends. I'd probably rather have left a teenage boy in charge. I imagine the McCann's think that.

If you don't want a male nursery nurse, or a primary teacher "because of my children", I presume you'd be happy if I don't want "your children" to mix with mine because of their gender-phobic attitudes?

That McCann comment was a really low blow.

I have no idea why you are being so antagonistic towards me, OneMoreChap, when we essentially agree on what is being discussed. But since it appears to be pleasing you to quote me out of context and then insinuate that I am a terrible parent, here is the paragraph from which you are quoting the last sentence:

I don't let any tom, dick or harry look after my children. I DO let a male teenager babysit my toddler, despite having been sexually abused by a male babysitter when I was a child, because I know this particular individual better than my parents knew my male babysitter, have known him for years, and because I have other precautions in place which my own parents neglected (including teaching my children that their bodies are theirs, and who can touch them, etc). I do not think our babysitter's gender makes him a threat because I know him.

I think you'll agree that the last sentence, coming at the end of that paragraph, has a rather different valence than just "I know him, it's fine, la la la laaa."

I am saying that I do/will use male caregivers for my child who are CRB checked, monitored, and so on, and I do not think there is something inherently suspicious about a male who wants to work with children (as I also mentioned upthread, my husband works with children.)

You are saying If you don't want a male nursery nurse, or a primary teacher "because of my children", I presume you'd be happy if I don't want "your children" to mix with mine because of their gender-phobic attitudes? ... actually I have no idea what you are saying to me here. Because I'm not saying the things you seem to think I'm saying, so it just doesn't make sense.