Crikey it feels a bit like a war zone at the moment!

[msrisotto]

I'm talking about that silly MRA group. It was so nice that we got the "I believe you" campaign going, such a valuable campaign. I suppose what with mothers day coming up as well, it just proved too much for the misogynists! So sad.

AbsentFather you seem to be conflating two different sets of stats here and wrongly assuming that because they don't say the same thing there must be something dodgy going on.

But surely the abuse cases which are discussed in contact/custody hearings only make up a small proportion of the total number of cases of abuse and there is no reason to suppose it would be representative.

Thus it is possible that a higher proportion of the cases in which a man is the abuser, come up in court at contact hearings, than the proportion of the cases in which the woman is the abuser.

Given that so few men compared to women are caring for children as single parents, it is likely that the majority of the abuse perpetrated by men will be in two parent families, while with there being so many women raising children completely alone with no father wanting to get more involved, the abuse perpetrated by those women will not feature in the statistic for custody and contact hearings.

*yet not yes

Why are you ignoring the parts of the survey which show a majority of male abusers, out of interest?

AF, so did you wife make a false allegation against you then?

"Almost all had someone to turn to for help and advice, mothers being most commonly mentioned (69%), followed by fathers (40%) and teachers (21%)."

That's nice, isn't it

not following you, messy

I believed that the family court would be pro-Mum and anti-Dad, but in reality it was much more fair than I expected. I can't complain with the way my particular case was handled. I think that things have improved significantly from the way the courts treated Dads in the past. I hate the way discussions about parental responsibility always seem to descend into debates about other issues. I don't see the need for such vile hatred from feminists, they're just intent on muddying the waters. Lots of children grow up with a single parent, but having two parents sharing responsibility must be best for children and their parents.

AF=absent father in that post

unless you have (c) the initials!

vile hatred?

Did you miss the bit where all the feminists said they wanted the best for the children and a fair hearing for the parents and some have concerns about the secret nature of the family courts?

Let's not forget that F4J was a splinter group that broke away from FnF and there are many fathers that are members of both groups. A number of years ago a FnF research officer signed a petition from a racist American fundamental christian group that called for the repeal of the 19th Ammendment that gives women the right to vote.

Some mums may make allegations that can't be substantiated but some dads make allegations of parental alienation that can't be substantiated either.

bloody hell, that's happened before, sorry messy

it's why I use AbF

I don't hold the copywright on the intitials AF though

So you would still choose to believe that men make up more than double the instances of child abuse in a family?

Yet in most cases before the breakdown of the parents relationship the male was more often than not trusted to look after the children. Suddenly at divorce men become bad fathers.

My wife and her solicitor alleged that I was mentally ill. They could not specify what but said that I was safe to look after my 1 yr old daughter but did not want me around my 5 yr old son unsupervised.

I got a written letter from my GP stating no history of mental health issues, I got a psychiatric assessment done but the court still went with my wifes allegations. It became clear that there was nothing I could do that could prove that I was not mentally ill.

I am not choosing to believe anything.

I am pointing out a large hole in the statistics (time actually with the child/ren) which, when factored in, means that father are more likely to be violent towards children than mothers.

I also think it is wrong to pick one part of a survey and ignore the others. The same study shows that of all sexual abuse, a tiny number said that their abusers were women. Strangely you draw on this study but pick and choose bits of it that you think (incorrectly) show women in a worse light than men, but not vice versa. You paint an incomplete picture and expect support? I don't think so.

That sounds a bit odd. Apologies for prying, but do you share your one year old daughter and five year old son with the same Mum? It would be interesting to see how a solicitor could justify contact with one child, but not the other?

Both of the children by the same parents.

They put the argument in court that I was safe to be around my daughter (who needs more care) than my son, but the judge dismissed it immediately telling them there was no way they could implement an arrangement that saw one child go without.

The whole process as I stated earlier is a farce. The judge can hear completely contradictory evidence from one parent and yet still follow guidelines rigidly against another parent who is falsely accused.

absentfathers

The NSPCC have produced a more recent report on the same themes. It is here you should have a read.

Looking at the appendices, and generally through it, it looks to be a much more thorough document. And is, of course, more up to date.

There are 6 or 7 main conclusions. One of them is:

"The high proportion of males reported as perpetrators of severe child maltreatment supports the need for gender sensitivity and effective engagement with both fathers/male partners and mothers in child protection and early intervention."

If you believe that the NSPCC are a reliable organisation, as you must do as you cited them in the first place, then presumably you will be able to look at this more thorough, current report with quite clear findings, and reassess your stance.

that has linked the wrong one, hold on

AF - sorry for the mixup - I did indeed mean Absent Father!

Re. the report that you (AbF) gave us a link to: if you scroll down to page 48 you'll see that it says that whilst there is gender symmetry in cases of child maltreatment (as you already pointed out), for the more severe maltreatment and sexual abuse there is gender asymmetry with perpetrators being mostly male (which you didn't point out).

Plus a bit further up in cases of DV it shows a marked gender asymmetry.

Of course none of this means that a normal father should be denied access to his children but perhaps this is what the judges have in mind when they, as you pointed out, err on the side of caution. It is criminal that a small minority of men cause the courts to look suspiciously on other men, if that is indeed the case.

What do you think, AbF could be done to sort this out so no normal father is denied access but no abused child is forced to continue access?

here

I read the report and it states for physical and emotional abuse that men and women were equally as likely to be the perpetrator against their own children.

re gender asymmetry DV

recent report

"Males were 93.8 per cent of perpetrators of domestic violence where one parent had beaten up
the other parent."

entirely my mix up, messy, and my ego

You read the more recent report?

Why don't you think sexual abuse is damaging?

Why aren't you interested that most children said they could confide in their mother? (Possibly because most children lived with their mother - see I can say that yet you deny it? Even though this fact is the basis of your complaints in the first place)

Why aren't you interested in sexual abuse? I mean, seriously, why on earth not?

What about the DV stats, what do you have to say to that?

etc etc

I mean, come on.

Whoops repeated point re sexual abuse.

It probably needed repeating though.