junior doctors ...

[eldritch]

My first post in this area so please be gentle!

Last night I was watching a fly on the wall documentary about a group of junior doctors starting out on their first jobs. One of them is female, 24, blonde, attractive, likes to wear pink shoes, has a pink stethoscope etc. On her first day on the ward someone changes her name on the spreadsheet to "Barbie" and colours it pink. The next day she finds someone has drawn on her staff photo on a noticeboard, giving her a crown, silly hairstyle etc. She is clearly gutted but tries to laugh it off. The prevailing attitude from the other doctors (mostly male, but some female) is that she should just suck it up. She does.

I was and that she was treated like this as she was clearly good at her job and had worked really hard to get this far. In my workplace (public sector, but not hospital) this kind of thing would be seen as sexist bullying and taken very seriously, but it seemed to be pretty normal there. For me the most disturbing thing was that her supervisor seemed to be the ringleader in all this.

I wondered if they might have edited it a bit to make it look more dramatic than it was (the whole episode was about identity), but the reactions did seem pretty real to me.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this as it's still preoccupying me this morning! Is this just banter, and do women have to put up with this in some professions? I really thought this kind of macho doctor culture had died out but clearly not ...

i thought the pink stethoscope was a bit of a bad move too - sort of like pink electric drills would appeal to women

Amanda, you've just talked about how you wear "conservative, sensible suits in dark colours" and no "jewellery or fashion shoes". For yourself you don't seem to consider bright colours and fun jewellery as acceptable but it's ok for men you say?

Would a dark blue stethoscope be ok? Or a light blue one? Or green? Or purple? Or red? I've never checked to see what colour my doctors have used but guess they must come in the full range, not just black and pink. And someone (other than Suzi) must be buying all these colourful stethoscopes, else no one would make them.

Incidentally, last time I was in A&E, I noticed that crocs were very popular and they came in a variety of colours. I didn't see one person walk out complaining about the doctors' and nurses' shoes. I think they were all sick and waiting for treatment so had other things on their minds.

Btw gender issues are cultural ones, what is gender if it's not a cultural concept?

Haven't seen this episode, but - Medicine is inherently sexist. Every week I meet a patient who expects me to be a man, just from their clinic letter. It's better than it was 20 years ago when I started training but I still have to put up with casual sexism on a regular basis, from patients and colleagues. Fortunately, I love what I do and we are slowly reaching a point where you can be a relatively senior female doctor without having to act like a man but there is still a long way to go. I have to say that pink stethoscopes annoy me. It is a functional item. It should only come in black. It's not a toy or a decoration. But that's just my view, clearly there is a demand for these things!

In terms of bullying/sexism within the profession - well, there are certain things you can do to protect yourself without compromising your sense of self, but you largely just have to get on with things and prove yourself through your actions rather than your appearance. It's unfair but it's a fact of life. It will only change slowly, and it will only change if women hang in there and support each other, acting as quiet role models for those who are coming through behind them.

I've got plenty of pink shirts, I don't think pink looks unprofessional per se. Also although I don't have any novelty cufflinks, that's not for any particular reason. My colleague has some great ones in the shape of bicycles.

You're quite right about the gender/culture thing obviously, I'm thinking but I'm not sure how to say it better, I'm sure you know what I mean.

I suppose what is interesting is what can be pink and what can't and what it is about pink that makes that the case. The tools of the trade - laptop, mobile phone, briefcase, handbag, calculator, stethoscope in this case, most certainly have to be black, grey, navy.

Working in a hospital means working in a fairly male dominated workplace. Many female doctors struggle to get patients to remember we are doctors not nurses (no offense to nurses, but it is not what I am). Part of that is the way we dress and the way we introduce myself. "Suzi" doesn't convey the professional relationship well. That is why I always introduce myself as Dr Springbok, patients need to feel reassured that I am a professional and that they can trust in me. Yes clothes shouldn't matter but they do.

The whole environment is about ribbing each other. You can't have a thin skin about something like this.

Amanda, you're right, it is interesting what can be bright and coloured and what can't. I have a bright pink coat I wear to work. People see it all the time because we constantly walk between buildings. I've only ever had compliments about it but this thread has made me think maybe I'd better go for grey next time. I won't because hopefully I'll be over it by next winter when it's time to get new one, but it does make me feel a bit about my coat.

I also have a gold handbag. I bought for weekends but started using it for work. Again no one has ever said anything other than a compliment on it.

And I carry a Cath Kidson floral number to keep my gym kit, books etc in.

By all accounts I have committed professional suicide, but I think I'm doing ok.

springbok, I don't think the whole environment should be about ribbing each other. If people are unhappy or uncorfortable at work, things need to change. There is a happy medium. We have fun at work, we enjoy each others company and we do take the piss out of each other. But it's always kind and if someone steps to far and the person on the receiving end doesn't think it's funny, it stops straight away. Which is as it should be.

Do people really care about the colour of a stethoscope? If she was using two yoghurt pots on a piece of string, then I might be worried.

I think she's great.

karmakameleon I think colourful coats bags and shoes you can get away with. I also think you can be a bit more daring as you get more talented and well known within your field. Probably as you get older as well.

I'm not sure AyeRobot, I feel pretty ok about it sitting here, I'm trying to imagine how I'd react to her if one of my close family was being placed in her care and I'd just met her.