Feminism and SAHM

[samoa]

Can a woman be a feminist and a SAHM by choice?

yes.

As far as I'm concerned, feminism is about having choices, and having a voice. It's not about what job you do or don't do. In the same way that feminism means it's okay for a woman to work and her partner to be a SAHD.

of course. Next.

Yes.
If it suits you and your family.
I would say though that to be a 'feminist SAHM' you need to be quite vocal and determined about the snidey remarks and the slide towards servantdom that can occur.

No, as long as someone else (a man) is paying your way in life, people are not going to take your views as a feminist seriously. Perhaps they should but they won't.

I suppose that marriage itself is quite feminist, though; after all, if the relationship does go wrong, the woman's work as sahm will be recognised as having worth in the marriage and be compensated for in the event of divorce.
I'm not saying that being a sahm is worthless-far from it, just very difficult for a woman to be taken seriously as a feminist if she is reliant on man for money (or another woman if she is a lesbian).

anyone who doesn't take someone seriously as a feminist because she is caring full-time for children is clearly such a twonk that I wouldn't give a shit about their opinion.

I've never met a feminist yet who thinks being a SAHM in any way impinges on feminist credibility, though perhaps there are some. There are plenty of non-feminists who do but they're usually the ones who also come out with 'you can't really be a feminist because you shave your legs' type comments.

So what about a SAHM in a gay relationship. If they are being supported financially by another woman? Is she credible because it's not a man that supports her or maybe a lone parent on benefits?

or is it really just about paying your own way

I think this idea that you can't be taken seriously as a feminist if you don't measure up to some arbitrary set of ideals is ridiculous and is really one of the biggest misconceptions about feminism.

Yes, but the type of people who like to mock feminism will make very sarcastic comments about sahms who argue that they are feminists.
I once overheard a conversation where a sahm was arguing her feminist credentials and the other person said, 'So you'll be off to make your husband's dinner soon. What are you cooking tonight?'

but who cares?
if they don't pick on SAHMdom they will pick on something else like women wearing make-up to work or liking baking and proclaim that that means they are not proper feminists.
they are just about the least important people. their opinions don't count.

Why would participating in the patriarchy's own-brand capitalism be a prerequisite for feminists? :o

I find it sad that things are reduced down to money. To say that because someone isn't economically independent, in a world that is structured in a way that means that not everyone is, they can't hold a certain political view is problematic. And really sad that capitalism is so hegemonic that it comes down to money.

I think there is more to the discussion of SAHMdom and feminism, but money isn't my lens.

And cooking meal for someone does not mean you are not a feminist. I cook for my husband every day. Cos I like cooking more than washing up, and then he washes up. Does this mean I'm not a feminist? It means I get to do the job I prefer.

And I agree with Seth that you will always get attempts to undermine you for whatever they can find.

Our marriage is an equal partnership. I work part time and OH works from home. I do the housework because I have more time. I cook because I am a better cook. OH pulls his weight with childcare and does 90% of the washing up. He also does his own ironing. He earns more than I do and always will. I don't have a problem with this because our partnership is not simply based on how much we ech contribute financially. Nobody who knows us would be able to see who "wears the trousers" in our relationship, and that is how it should be.

I have the lifestyle I want and enjoy, so how can that not be feminist?

I don't think it is the cooking that is the issue, it is the depending on someone else for money that is the issue. I do not think that a woman who is financially independent is going to be accused of NOT being a feminist because she makes a lasagne.

Of course you can! In my understanding feminism is all about women making their own choices in life.

I don't think that you have to be financially independant to be a feminist. It is all about balance.

I agree. But, realistically, how much choice can someone have if they are not earning their own money?

He (or she) who pays the piper will call the tune.

I think that come the revolution and sexes are equal that a woman's choice whether to be a SAHM will be exactly that: a choice. At the moment I don't necessarily think it is (certainly not in a good percentage of cases) and money/flexibility in the workplace plays a good part.

As the structure of the workplace and to a great extent the financial framework in which we live is run by men then the choice to be a SAHM will always have an element of that dominant influence. However, many other of our decicisions will have those patriarchal undertones.

So in answer to your question - of course you can be a feminist and be a SAHM. Feminism isn't all about being a working unit - it is about equality in values and respect, creating genuine choices and making informed choices. To think otherwise surely means that being a SAHM is not valid choice - one of things that feminism is working against eradicating.

Is feminism about making your own choices in life? Some women would seem to make quite anti-feminist choices. I hope it's possible to be a feminist and a SAHM (I was one for 5 years), but I also think there's a place for questioning why more women than men make that choice.

"He (or she) who pays the piper will call the tune"

I call most of the tunes in the bunbaker house

feminism is about choice and so much more than that; the capitalist ideologies of our time make an absolute fetish of choice and this was picked up the feminism-lite of the 1990s where people talked as if feminism=choice therefore every choice a woman makes will be a feminist one.
in fact choice is very much less free than it first appears; choosing to be a SAHM is not like buying a handbag. Have just been reading 'Perfect Madness: Motherhood in the age of anxiety' by Judith Warner and she is rather good on this - she writes about how practically everyone she interviewed felt they had no other option than the working/SAHMing situation they ended up with.

there are some very good points in this thread. Marantha is spot on about how not earning your own money limits your choices (and the point would be heartily applauded by Xenia, I'm sure).
As FallenMadonna says, we definitely need to look at why it is a choice made by women not men.

I think it's also worth saying that many working mothers certainly don't feel free, or that they have much choice in life; if every minute and penny are accounted for and you are exhausted that can take away your sense of agency too.

one thing I am enjoying about SAHMing is the freedom and independence about what I do with my time and my brain; it is lovely to be freed from the (academic) working mother guilt of feeling that everything I read and thought about should be work-related. Contracting out your childcare (and hence giving up a measure of control over your children's upbringing, though this will vary depending on how much choice over childcare you have) in order to slave for an employer who is interested in their business, not your and your family's welfare, may not always be the feminist option despite it resulting in more financial independence for you as a woman.

"Yes, but the type of people who like to mock feminism will make very sarcastic comments about sahms who argue that they are feminists."

Well they can fuck off then!

DH and I contribute equally, but differently, to our household. Money is not the only thing in the world worth having, and paid work is not hte only thing in the world worth doing.

I want to be a SAHP, so does DH. It makes more sense for him to be the earner because I am breastfeeding and he likes his paid work, and I didn't. But I contribute just as much as he does. The point is that he values my contribution just as much as his own - just because it doesn't involve money, doesn't make it any less important.

We are interdependent, not dependent. We are a team and have divided up roles according to what makes the most sense.

And I have to say it really pisses me off to hear that anyone thinks that if you choose to be a SAHM and contribute to your household that way, that you are 'letting the side down' or whatever.

Feminism does not, IMO, mean living like men have lived/are living. It means having your work, whether taht's paid or unpaid, based int he home or out of the home, being as valued as men's work.