Feminism chat thread

[ElephantsAndMiasmas]

Hello

Been saying for ages that it'd be nice to have an area for just saying hi, letting off some steam and sharing the little things that don't warrant a whole thread.

So, I'll start...

My brother made me :o:o:o last night when we were talking about some crap sexist song. And he said (in all honesty) - well this is just one of the millions of ways the patriarchy keeps itself going.

Also got the updated email from the Feminism in London conference this morning - can't wait.

Anyone else?

I agree that things ebb and flow over time, and people and people are sexualised more or less over time, and there are cycles etc. But those cycles don't just happen by themselves, they happen because of the way people behave. The way we move out of an era of the objectification of women is by speaking out against it, not just waiting for it to happen by itself.

Or by claiming power, making objectification irrelevant. I'm finding this hard to articulate (you guessed??!) but I think those 80s/90s girl bands had a point. Stand up in your ra-ra skirt or pink bikini if you want, and claim the power anyway. I suppose I should be investing more rationale in this, am hoping you'll bear with me ... My idea is something like this: If we let the thoughts of (domineering) men define us, we're screwed. If we put a lot of effort into worrying how we look, then we're buying into that definition.

I take your points about look-ism and its associated ills, but suspect there's nothing to be done about it. These things are cyclical, and people always stress out about appearances when economies are weak.

Now feeling embarrassed about posting in a rush but I'm past a deadline

... ironic! I'm letting feminism interfere with rebuilding my economic power base!!

Can I just say I COMPLETELY agree with this from vezzie :

" while young women dress and behave more and more like sex objects, not knowing any other way, society does not change its views of such women (to respect them professionally, for instance) - if it did, it would matter less. The trouble is we have traditional values applied to 21 century normally dressed young women - who by traditional values are dressed like dolly birds. The alternative is to be ignored as a frump (as normal fashionable office clothes become increasingly cleavagey and tight). So however they dress they have given "permission" to men to devalue and ignore them. The always tiny window of sexually unmarked office clothing choices has become vanishingly small for women. "

And sorry I wasn't trying to be secretive about the Lynne Featherstone meeting, just found it hard to get back into this thread :)

Her justification for the Tories talking more about women's rights was that while May is the Minister for Women & Equality, LF is just for Equality. I did point out that she has managed to make comments specifically relating to women (e.g. body image stuff) in the past, so it obivously wasn't a no-go area. Also pointed out that Clegg has been far less outspoken on women's rights than Cameron, making it look as though the Conservatives are more progressive on this issue than the LDs. She didn't have much to say about what she was going to do about it, but she said that she would take what I was saying, and that she would be thinking about it, or some such. I know what poliicians are like, but she looked genuinely perturbed at the idea that the LDs might actually suffer the consequences in terms of votes from not speaking out on women's rights. Especially as so many of the other women there were nodding along with what I was saying :o

She should know about "intersectionality" though. So if she's just for Equality not Women and Equality, she should know that in every group of people who are for some reason disenfranchised (disabled, ethnic minority) there will be women among them, experiencing double the problems.

Anyway, keep up the good work Elephants

I have to mention this blog femonade that I found yesterday.

The reason I'm linking to it is because I can'T stop reading it and that last night I had the best night's sleep i've had in a long time and honest to god, I think it was because of this blog.
I felt a sense of peace and calm come over me as I was reading it that lasted well on into the evening and through until today.

Thanks sakura, it's not much sadly. I was imagining how cross you would all be if you knew I had the chance to challenge her and had just kept schtum. :o

WRT her "equality" line - IMO both she and I knew that that was a pathetic excuse!

What would anyone else have asked?

And on a totally different note, BBC Breakfast is about to talk about Michelle Obama. What are they going to talk about do you think? Her promotion of the education of girls? Her other good work?

Nah, it's her &£*&@?& DRESS SENSE again.

gah!
This is why i can't sleep at night and bite my nails. I know it is, it's all this bullshit.

Sorry sakura but that made me laugh. :o

Only because I so totally know what you mean though.

I know you get it, and this is why I have a slight MN addiction too

Ross Kemp is on Breakfast atm, he is talking about his visit to Congo for a new documentary. He is talking about the thousands of women being operated on for fistulas after rapes :(

One weird thing is, he and the presenters are using euphemisms for it. The women were "hurt" apparently, or "attacked in the heat of the battle". WT-fucking-F? Was wondering if they weren't allowed to use the word, which seems strange on a programme that features the news. Then when he got onto talking about the teenager soldiers who are actually doing the raping, and they suddenly weren't afraid to talk about it - "many of them were raped too".

I am quite literally biting my nails right this second.

but they're human, you see, they have feelings which is why it's notable when the soldiers were raped. Rape just happens to women, it's something women can expect, all part of the fun experience of being a woman.

Wish I'd watched Breakfast. I turned over in crossness at the Michelle Obama article and have ended up with The Wright Stuff. Are we aware of the Marie Stopes teen pregnancy viral? 'One up the bum no harm done...one up the bum and you won't be a mum'. All accompanied with a group of men poking a blow up doll :(

Is this really what we want young women to use as contraception?

BUt if Ross Kemp and the presenters were minimizing the harm done to women by not using the R word for them, but then using it when they were talking about raped men, then they're not doing women that many favours.
But itt's good that a man is using his privilege to focus on the Congo rather than not

Link here

wow, Unrulysun, that is incredible. And it is a charity as well. Could they have thought of anything worse?

honestly Unruly, about once every two weeks or so, when I feel I can't be shocked by anything, anymore, something makes me go Fuck ing hell. And I think this video is one of them.

"One up the bum and you won't be a mum." JUst..

Men aren't monsters, they don'T really think this is a reasonable way of going about preventing a pregnancy.... do they.. IF the charity is worried about unwanted pregnancy why not promote sex that doesn't involve penetration?