I've never read.....

[tobee]

a (fictional) murder mystery book that has a satisfying ending. Discuss.

And I thought the 'Dragon Tattoo' thing was shockingly dreadful.

Yeah well the question wasn't "Did you like it?"

Yep - but I don't know if the ending was any good, because I didn't get that far. Just sticking my oar in!

Why are a accusing me of lying about reading Dragon Tattoo, Cote? I certainly read all three volumes, all the way through. I know that he didn't kill the family member but he was part of the family of the people trying to find her. I quite like about half of the trilogy. But I found there were too many dead bodies, usually of young girls, turning up. Personally, and I mean personally, I found that and the lesbian love scenes seemed to be stuck in for male titalation. I found Salander's father and half brother like something out of a cross between a poor James Bond parody and a bad eastenders episode. It had been an interesting murder mystery with unusual but engaging heroine and investigative journalists on a crusading newspaper until then.

Although I read them through, because they ended up disappointing me, I've largely erased the finer details from my memory. They ended up being a disappointing chore.

Interesting what you say about "The Maltese Falcon", Remus. I read it when I was quite young because I was a fan of the film and my dad's a big Hammett fan.I've not read any Raymond Chandler but I love films based on his books and his screen plays (even though not even he was supposed to know who was the killer in The Big Sleep"!) so I ought to do so.

I only read the first Dragon Tattoo book and I thought it was awful. Wouldn't bother with the other two after that. Have you read any of the Kate Atkinson Jackson Brody books? I enjoyed those.

I think Stieg Larsson had some brilliant ideas for his trilogy. I was gripped by the story of the Dragon Tattoo. Still think it's one of the most innovative crime novels I've read. The second wasn't quite as satisfying and the violence escalated to make for uncomfortable reading. The third really needed some tighter editing which sadly he wasn't able to do.

My dad loved them. He was a massive book worm and sped through them, completely gripped by the complex plot. I bought him the new one purporting to be a sequel but he didn't get to read it. Is it worth reading or is it disappointing?

I read good things about the 4th book (based on Larsson's notes) on this topic, Duchess.

OP - You start a thread saying that you have never read a murder mystery with a satisfying ending and I ask you what you thought was unsatisfying about the ending of The Girl With The Dragon Tattoo.

And you just can't answer the question. Why?

I didn't ask your thoughts about lesbian sex (which were not terribly at all "titillating" iirc) just what was unsatisfying about the ending. Did you feel there were loose ends? Did you think it was not realistic enough? What was it?

And if you really are going to take the "I forgot" line, then maybe amend your OP to "I quickly forget books I don't like so may have read a few with good endings".

I'm glad the fourth one is getting good reviews then. I shall read it soon. As this one was based on Larsson's notes, I wonder if he had sketched out plots for any more?

Exactly what do you mean by an unsatisfying ending, OP? I'm interested in what counts as fictionally satisfying in terms of endings in general, but was wondering (as someone who is fairly badly read in crime/whodunnits, apart from Sayers and PD James, because I'm much more character-driven than plot-driven as a reader) whether there are specific kinds of things expected in a murder mystery. Do you just mean that the resolution of the mystery was either too obvious too soon, or unconvincing?

Also because I'm just finishing writing a novel which ends with the heroine walking away from the man she's in love with to dedicate herself to her work, and suspect this may not be popular...

Well, it seems OP doesn't actually want to "discuss".

People's idea of a satisfying ending vary. Gone Girl isn't what I would call a great book by any means, but I thought its ending was very fitting. I'm surprised to see that many MNers think otherwise.

I think sometimes people want "evil" characters to lose in the end and "good" to win.

It seems not!

I'm genuinely interested in what satisfies people in endings, because it seems to be something that so many readers so often criticise (negative Amazon reviews often reference an unsatisfying ending), but it's harder to get an idea of what they think would have been better.

I'm possibly the only person in the Anglophone world who hasn't actually read Gone Girl, or seen the film adaptation, but I know the plot because so much of the press coverage talked about it - and it sounds perfectly well done within the genre bounds of that kind of novel. Not some cop-out where the POV character wakes up and discovers it was all a dream, which would be definitely 'unsatisfying'.

Is people's problem with it that the psychopathic anti-heroine isn't killed off or jailed for life or horribly punished in some way? Surely people don't still want the bad punished and the good exalted? (And I thought no one was actually 'good' in that novel, anyway?)

I'm with you, Cote. I can see why the ending of Gone Girl might have fallen a bit flat for some, but I actually thought it was very clever, and perfect for the characters. However I think she didn't quite pull it off. You can have the funniest joke in the world, but if the timing is off people won't laugh.

My problem with Gone Girl specifically is that the ending did not fit with the character of Nick? And most people wouldn't have done what he did. So if you are going to have a character do something that 'nobody would do in real life' you need to set them up as someone who might not conform

I don't feel that sticking with a woman just because she is pregnant is something that nobody would do in real life.

Particularly in their case, the mother is clearly a psychopath and Nick feels that he cannot just abandon his child at the hands of this woman.

I can totally see that happening. And don't see anything in Nick's character that would allow him to come up with a better solution, either.

Well I think we are allowed to disagree. I didn't feel it was credible and so for me that was an unsatisfying ending.
I didn't get anywhere with Stieg L as the style of writing and graphic sex scenes just alienated me.

I'm trying to think of a 'good' one. I loved Dalziel and Pascoe books, but more modern etc I love Harlan Coven for the Myron Bolitar series.

SPOILER WARNING!

My problem with Gone Girl specifically is that the ending did not fit with the character of Nick? And most people wouldn't have done what he did.

Yeah, I disagree with this. I think most people would cave in to a deliberate attempt to blackmail, using the wellbeing of their child as collateral. It might not work long term (in fact I suspect it wouldn't), but the way the book ends is wholly believable given how deeply manipulative Amy proves herself to be over the course of the book.

You are right that we're allowed to disagree, but I wonder how you think he would have reacted instead?

Anyone read Dark Places, again by G Flynn? Personally I thought she completely fluffed that. Not credible at all and far too little foreshadowing to make it even remotely believable.

And how about And Then there Were None? I love how creepy it is, and it's truly ingenious but the way the denouement comes means that the whole thing falls a little flat.

Remind me - I've just read it and it went totally out of my head. I also started the one about the sister of the man accused of murder (the famous family) and never finished it it was so weird.
Just remembered. Actually that was quite clever. I didn't guess actually.

You might like the Mo Hayder books - Pig Island is excellent.

Dick Francis
Colin Cotterell
Harlan Coben (later books only)

Girl with Dragon Tattoo was good enough for me, but other books in that trilogy are awful.