Lamentation by CJ Sansom - anyone read it and want to discuss it?

[Dumbledoresgirl]

I've just finished it and I would love to talk to some fellow Shardlake enthusiasts about it. Anyone interested?

I've just finished Lamentation, got a complete shock with Jack, had to reread that line a few times! Took me half the book to really get into it this time, although I think I preferred it to Heartstone.
The Matthew Bartholemew series by Susanna Gregory is worth a look, it's set a couple of hundred years earlier, in Cambridge, and it's about a doctor / priest crime fighting duo. A lot better than I've made that sound...

Remus I did the same Tudor-fest thing.

Dumbledores I actually shouted out loud "For god's sake, CJ, you're supposed to KILL your darlings, not fecking...(spoiler) them!!!"

:) Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooo. At least Jack is still alive, the darling. I'm not very interested in a series which replaces him with Nicholas, although I'll probably still carry on reading them because Sansom at his worst is still better than many others at their best.

SPOILER I was completely traumatised by what happened to Jack - far too overly invested in fictional characters! I'm not convinced that he would have survived such a catastrophic blood loss, especially after being dumped in a rubbish heap. I love the way Sansom portrays Tudor women - they're usually ciphers or stereotypes in fiction, probably because we don't have much source material in comparison to the men.
The Giordano Bruno series by S J Parris is brilliant, but my current favourite is John Shakespeare (Rory Clements): anyone read these too?

Helyantha I agree. Jack has had loads of injuries over the course of the books and yet never has a wound got infected or anything. And then this time, having been dumped where he was, with the injuries he had, I thought 'well, that's just not survivable, is it?' And yet...

Yes, yes, even a maimed Jack is better than a dead Jack. In fact, a maimed Jack might well be an angry, vengeful Jack and I could quite enjoy reading about that, as long as Shardlake was there to stop him going too far (rather like in Revelation when he was trying to mend Jack and Tamasin's marriage).

Nicholas is ok - give the poor lad a chance Remus! - but why start with a new assistant when you have a perfectly good one already? I mean that question for Sansom. I actually wonder whether the man realises what a female following Jack has. I don't often feel the urge to write to authors, but I admit it crossed my mind after reading Lamentation, hence this thread after I decided Sansom would probably take me for an idiotic love struck teenager if I wrote to him about his treatment of a fictional character

I also love the Giordano Bruno books. I know on a literary level they probably can't compete with Shardlake, but I love the character and I would say there has been a greater consistency in the quality of the plots than Sansom has achieved Heresy I know!

I was looking up the Rory Clements books the other day but didn't end up buying one because I hadn't seen a recommendation for them before. I might take another look. And also at the other books recommended here. I like the idea of a different period.

The other Tudor ones I have read (but didn't really enjoy) are the Phil Rickman ones about John Dee, and of course Hilary Mantel but they obviously aren't crime/mystery novels.

While we're talking about how likely it is that Jack might survive his injuries, that reminds me: the other thing about what Sansom did to Jack (you see I take it very personally!): not content to lop off his xxxx - do we really need spoilers here? the thread title clearly asks if anyone has read the book and wants to discuss it - in the same attack he also has a sword thrust into his back! Surely he would have to be exceptionally lucky not to have the sword penetrate at least one of his vital organs? And yet that major wound is totally trivialised.

You're right, we don't need spoilers - but picture me, if you will, with my mouth actually hanging open, for quite a long time.

I will give these other books a try. I tried one Parris and just got cross because it wasn't Shardlake. I suppose it would be good for him to be less pathetic over women he's saving himself for me

Recently finished Lamentation which was a Christmas present. It was a vast improvement on Heartstone, though I thought it was saved by the gripping and empathetic description of the Mary Rose disaster. My favourite books in the series are Dissolution, Revelation and Dark Fire.
Back to Lamentation, I enjoyed seeing more of an insight into Shardlake's character and his relationship with the main characters. So glad that the conclusion left the door open for another Shardlake's novel! Devastated about Barak, won't say more so as not to spoil it for other readers.
Wish the TV/ Radio would serialise the Sansom books. Who's my Shardlake's? How about Toby Jones, can see him evoking all the lawyers strengths and weaknesses. What do you think?? As for Barak my vote goes to Richard Armitage - think I've got the right name, anyway he was the one in North and South, and Spooks.

Parris didn't do it for me. Only read one, and that was enough.

Which one did you read Remus? I am going to have to google the following because the titles don't exactly stand out in my memory. Was it

Heresy - set in Oxford
Prophecy - set in London
Sacrilege - set in Canterbury
Treachery - set in Plymouth

The weakest of those in the one set in London imo although there is a hilarious scene when Bruno is trying to make it look as though he is getting drunk whilst actually feeding the alcohol to a dog.

Oh that's a shame, Remus - I've always had a weakness for monks & Italians :) John Shakespeare is great, though - just enough connection to documented events without being strangled by them.
I wonder if the parallels with current religious difficulties explain why the Tudors are so popular? When I first read the Shardlake novels, I found it hard to understand how anyone could be so fanatical about religion, but there are definite echoes in modern life. Fortunately no equivalent of Great Henry though (yet).

'Heresy' I think. Can't remember much about it tbh.

Interesting to hear others' views on who should play Barak - my nomination is Aidan Turner (about to be Poldark on the BBC). He's swarthy, hirsute, has dark eyes and curly hair - absolutely my mind's eye image of Jack. Toby Jones would also be a great Shardlake. Ages ago there was a rumour that Kenneth Branagh was looking at doing it but I don't think there is any adaptation planned. It did influence me to imagine him as Shardlake ever since though and I also think he'd be great though doubt he would do another crime fighter after Wallender?

I can't see a tv company filming the Shardlake novels purely on the basis that it would cost too much and be too difficult - all those costumes and Tudor streets etc. But that aside, of all the names mentioned, Aidan Turner fits Barak best in my mind's eye.

1inamillion - there was a radio 4 adaptation of Dark Fire not so long ago.

I enjoyed them all, although i was stunned by the ending! (Poor Jack! Poor Tamasin! How could he?!) I did think the plot was rather stretched this time, too, but still very readable. I didn't notice the over-use of 'sardonic' but it is a while since i read it.

I have read the first 3 Parris books, but i gave up the will to live with the last one and it is still unfinished. What i didn't like about them was the use of first person. I find that very off putting in a book and I expect that was a good part of why I gave up reading the last one.

I'll definitely stick with Shardlake through another novel - and after that we'll have to see.

Just Googled Aidan Turner. Hell, yes!

Just finished queens Gambit by Fremantle. Enjoyed it, so ta for the recommendation! Off to try John Shakespeare...

in the middle of it, very good so far

finished now, it was excellent.

he also overuses sharp

I am trying my first John Shakespeare novel. So far I am enjoying it, not enthralled in the historical detail but it's a good read. I have Heresy to try on my kindle too. I do need a bit of Tudor drama in my life.

I'm a bit more than halfway through my first John Shakespeare novel too. I am enjoying it but find all the different characters and sub stories told from different character's points of view a bit muddling. I need to sharpen my mind, I know

Another huge Shardlake fan here! Hope you don't mind me joining the thread.
I love these books and like you all, I was in shock at the barak ending. I started to read a lot quicker to get through to see if he survived. He is such a strong character and I enjoy reading about his life.
As for Shardlake himself, I actually really like him. He's a deeply complicated man. No idea who would play him in a TV adaptation though. As for barak, they would need to be rough and manly and very sexy!!! Because he just is all those things.

I'm really into much earlier history now. I have read soooo much Tudor history books and moved onto plantagenet history, some fiction but mostly non fiction (I'm a history teacher!!) I am fascinated by the lives of these people.

Sansom has a real knack for describing Tudor life and for developing characters that you really feel connected to.

I could highly recommend some plantagenet books if anyone is interested in earlier medieval history!