What should the government do to reduce obesity at the societal level?

[waistchallenge]

We're the fattest country in Europe and the upshot is what you see here: people posting threads in desperation about their weight loss struggles. I think we can probably all agree it would be easier to never have gotten overweight in the first place and to never have had to go through these weight loss efforts and experiences.

Apart from the sugar tax, I cannot see that the government has done much, if anything, to reduce obesity in this country; it's higher than ever.

I'm asking here because we all have experience of this to be on here, what-if anything- should the government do to reduce obesity in this country? What would have helped you? Or is it all just ultimately a question of personal responsibility?

@BarrelOfOtters you can control weight if you have the willpower to do so. But it's also very easy to eat badly and the fact that food manufacturers and stores tout all the less healthy food with deals, colourful packaging etc that feeds sugar habits doesn't help society at all. I wish we were a country of food markets like our European neighbours. We are surrounded by sea but very few buy and eat fresh fish or know how to prep it.

Younger people are now a Deliveroo generation. Getting takeaways was a treat in my youth. It just didn't happen. Now people are too lazy to even walk to the convenience store. I saw a guy collecting a pack of vapes, an energy drink and large bag of Doritos from our local shop the other day for a delivery. The only people keeping in shape are the delivery cyclists around here.

We used to eat chips, sausage rolls etc for lunch at secondary school. We were walking to and from school each day though. It looks to me like habits are formed and now continue into adult life. The majority of younger people that I work with (especially women) are overweight or obese. I lost 1.5 stones myself, I felt great but it wasn't particularly noticeable. That's the amount of extra weight I was carrying. It's sneaks up in you before you know it. Clothing getting tighter.

The government need to do something about this. Better food labelling, realistic information about how to cook/eat, and promotion of fresh seasonal veg. Jamie Oliver, Tommi Miers and now Joe Wicks are completely right. I admire the fact they are trying to shine a light on this disaster that is incoming.

That's amazing @Gingerkittykat

I really hope this model spreads very quickly - there's nothing like that in our town. It makes perfect sense.

Younger people are now a Deliveroo generation. Getting takeaways was a treat in my youth. It just didn't happen. Now people are too lazy to even walk to the convenience store. I saw a guy collecting a pack of vapes, an energy drink and large bag of Doritos from our local shop the other day for a delivery.

That's terrible. But it don't think the Government can do much - rather parents need to teach their children how to cook and how look after their health.

Of course they can. They can implement change via planning policy, that’s like saying they can’t enforce disabled parking spaces or toilets in restaurants. They can commit to not allowing additional fast food outlets within x radius of schools, encourage investment in fitness and leisure. That’s just one means.

In the absence of government interventions, what are the options, realistically?

Younger people are now a Deliveroo generation. Getting takeaways was a treat in my youth. It just didn't happen. Now people are too lazy to even walk to the convenience store. I saw a guy collecting a pack of vapes, an energy drink and large bag of Doritos from our local shop the other day for a delivery.

Not sure which post this is from but that’s definitely not the case here, but also how do you know the age of the person who ordered it?

They can implement change via planning policy, that’s like saying they can’t enforce disabled parking spaces or toilets in restaurants. They can commit to not allowing additional fast food outlets within x radius of schools, encourage investment in fitness and leisure.

But we live in a free market economy and if there is demand for fast food outlets then companies will ensure that there is supply.

Things like toilets in restaurants and disabled parking spaces are very different and much easier to implement as they are simply requirements that companies need to have.

We don’t live in a free market in terms of town planning.

Just because we're a free market doesn't mean we're Libertarian! There are still some rules and the government aims to at least somewhat protect the populace, even if it's just to avoid costs further down the line- obesity is very expensive on a societal level

I understand all that. However, if people want to buy fast food they will find a way, even if it involves driving to a little further. If there is demand then suppliers will fill it!

Much better to reduce demand for such unhealthy food with education and encouraging healthy lifestyle choices.

school kids without cars won’t.

They don't need a car to get junk food as it can easily be delivered to their doorstep!

If they really want such junk food they'll find a way to get it, unfortunately.

Would you say the same about cigarettes, no point in restricting the age to purchase, adverts or making them expensive because people will find a way to buy them anyway.

Cigarettes are easy to define.

'Junk' food is not. How would you decide what foods to disallow?

Food that is predominantly sugar, saturated fat and empty calorie white carbs

But even with all the laws and restrictions, young people still manage to buy them and are still smoking them. Where there's a will, there's a way!

Same with virtually all other aspects of regulation/prohibition, it's usually only the "law abiding" who follow them, there are always ways around for the less law abiding.

Such as car number plates - law abiding people go to Halfords, show their ID and car registration documents and get one made. Less law abiding people get "someone down the pub" to make one for them or get illegally spaced personalised ones made from ebay!

Need a better definition than that for the law it would need.

How do you define "predominantly", is it over 50%, over 75% over 25%?

Is it say 50% of all those food components, or just 50% of one of them?

What's you legal definition of "empty calorie white carbs"?

Lawyers would keep themselves busy for decades with your weak definition. They're still arguing in VAT tribunals about biscuits, cakes, tea cakes, etc and very nearly got that way with the stupid "pasty tax" but at least they saw sense and realised it was stupid.

The problem is a lot of the kids won't eat anything else because for most, the beige crap is all they are fed at home.

So food goes to waste and kids go hungry.

This gives me visions of the people on the ship on Wall-e.

It's a very accurate depiction of the society we are becoming........

And how are you going to approach people on medication (eg steroids) that cause massive weight gain? Will they get the thin person rates?

Steroids don't cause weight gain. They increase appetite which means people eat more and then gain weight.

Ditto other medication such as anti-depressants and PCOS meds.

I periodically have to take steroids and while it's hard, I change my diet accordingly.

As other PPs have said, some things are down to choice and willpower.

It's too easy to make excuses.

When standing at the queue in our local garage, you can see them putting the boxed out for delivery. It's all alchohol vapes and junk food.

It’s not always that simple. When my DM is on Olanzapine for psychosis she eats like 10 starving navvies, and can gain two stone in a month. She’s also three sheets to the wind. She wouldn’t have the mental capacity to restrict her eating to counteract the overwhelming food cravings. There’s a reason why there is an established link between antipsychotics and type 2 diabetes.

@Menomeno there will always be outliers and exceptions, but fit the majority it is down to the individual not choosing to make necessary adaptations.

You’re suggesting that people on anti-depressants, who are already struggling to cope with life should have the mental fortitude to overcome drug-induced food cravings. I don’t think these people are outliers or exceptional. It takes enormous amounts of strength and willpower to resist. I speak as someone doing exactly that since I had a testosterone pellet inserted. It’s really tough and I feel constantly starving. I know that if I was currently depressed I wouldn’t be able to do it.

I agree, @Menomeno - I have had clinical depression since my mid teens (although it was not diagnosed until I was in my 40s - up 'til then, I thought it was normal for a me to be so unhappy about bullying that I was contemplating suicide). I am sure that depression has had a big effect on my weight - a vicious circle of comfort eating, weight gain, hating myself for the weight gain, getting more depressed and then comfort eating more.

Basically, in my head, when I am at my lowest, I honestly believe that there is no point looking after myself in any way, including my diet - because the world wouldn't miss me and might be better off without me.

I am on antidepressants now, and will be for life. I have tried to come off them, but each time, have ended up in the blackest depression I've experienced, and have had to go back on them - I'm too scared even to try coming off them now. The tablets have stabilised my mood, and I am a long way from the worst of it - but I still struggle to look after my diet. And I have exchanged comfort eating for antidepressant induced cravings.

Add to that the fact that I have Long Covid, which leaves me utterly exhausted all the time, and breathless just from walking along the hall from the downstairs loo to the front room, making exercise pretty much impossible, and I feel like the obstacles in the way of me losing weight are almost insuperable.

I have had a bit of success with the 5:2 diet - two days a week, I only eat dinner - and if nothing else, this has reduced the number of calories I am eating each week. I can't say I have noticed much change, but when I saw family recently, who hadn't seen me since before Christmas, they thought I was better.