Why are people still counting calories when it doesn’t work

[Ifyoubelieveyouwill]

Just that really. I don’t understand why people are still counting calories when the science shows it doesn’t work and makes you gain more weight in the long term. As a 20 year yo-yo dieter I’m proof calorie counting leads to obesity over time.

Now the scientific evidence is conclusive that it’s the nutritional quality of food that matters for weight loss. Not the calories in/ calories out equation. I wonder why diets like WW and Noom are still so popular.

Have people just missed the memo? Not being goady, I’m just wondering whether people feel the short term weight loss is worth it.

Travelling to other countries which don’t have easy access to Western foods and seeing people eating portions of healthy food, they just don’t have the obesity problem we have. That seems key to me. Not whether we consume fat. But whether we consume processed foods and sugar, rather than calories

I feel like you are right and wrong.

Eating carby / sugary foods makes me hungrier. Usually all day long. If I go out for breakfast and choose pancakes I know I'm going to be in the stuffed then peckish cycle all day long.

Compared to if I just skip breakfast and have a protein / high fat lunch.

It's 10000X easier to self regulate calories if you cut out the processed foods / carbs / sugar.

So what I think is... calorie counting usually fails but calorie deficit is actually the way to lose weight.

And calorie deficit is so much easier if you aren't in the constant hunger cycle caused by eating sugar (carbs).

@Cavagirl

OP aren't you conflating the science of calorie counting diets with people's ability to follow calorie counting diets properly

As you say, it's far harder to eat 1200 calories of steak vs 1200 calories of a pizza. That doesn't mean calorie counting doesn't work, it means they are for some people more difficult to follow.

Agree with this.

@Angelica789

Yes if you don’t have access to processed foods you are more likely to be a healthy weight. This is because processed foods have been designed to make us eat more and more. It’s easy to consume too many calories. The unhealthy western dietary environment makes it very very easy for people to become over weight by presenting them with cheap foods that are designed to be eaten to excess. That means too many calories.

I always thought that it was the calories in processed food, but I watched That Sugar Film and the man ate the same number of calories for 60 days, but got them all from prosessed foods instead of his usual, low sugar real food diet. He gained over a stone! Seems like sugar is the issue. If you have a low sugar diet, your hunger hormones settle and you don't get cravings for snacks all the time.

@Ifyoubelieveyouwill

I know several alcoholics due to my job. They are slim because they barely eat food, special brew and cigarettes is their diet of choice. This is very unhealthy!

Many of us who struggle with our weight know it's the extra calories in booze that causes the weight gain, food wise I'm eating about right

It sounds to me like you're conflating losing weight weight with maintaining weight loss, and to a certain extend pure calorie counting doesn't work for maintaining weight loss. If you use up you daily calorie allowance eating chocolate for breakfast, by force of will you can still lose weight if that's all you eat. But realistically eventually you'll crack and eat something else later on as hunger always wins eventually. You have to reduce calorie intake in a smart way that still keeps you full.

All 'diets' work if they produce a calorie deficit, OP. There really isn't any big mystery to it. People go about it in different ways because different foods and routines suit different people. They stop working if people start eating at maintanence or excess calories.
Just to adresss a couple of your points, British people used to be like the people in the countries you have visited, ie we just ate food without thinking about calories. That's because food was comparitively expensive for most people and they couldn't afford extra food. Even for better off people it wasn't the done thing to overeat, people were just used to smaller meals and fewer snacks.
Some alcoholics are obese, some are underweight and malnourished. It depends on a lot of factors - how far advanced the condition is, how they take their alcohol, their economic status, etc etc.

I’m in awe of those of you who have the will to log all the calories you eat, that shows real commitment and dedication. You clearly have a lot of self discipline. I just can’t sustain it (and thinking about food all the time is not good for me!)

It's not as simple as 'calorie counting doesn't work' the evidence you're talking about (which is real and solid, I'm totally with you on that) refers to drastic calorie reduction so the crash dieting etc.

My base calorie use is about 2300 a day, so if I go below 2200 I'll sloooowly lose weight. I've used calorie counting to keep and eye before and stick around the right number for me and not get caught out by hidden cals in other snacks and drinks etc, that's very different to statically cutting to 1200 a day and causing metabolic damage for example

@Ifyoubelieveyouwill "So personally, I decided not to count calories and eat what I want to feel full from a healthy list of foods."

So....you're eating lower calorie food then? AKA calorie counting.

This whole thread and your messages make no sense.

I think that there is no one size fits all approach for weight loss. A lot of it will depend on the persons own pitfalls. Calorie counting once in a while works for me because it reminds me of what a portion looks like. I don't need to eat different foods, just normal portions. I wouldn't eat the pizza, I prefer a salad with tuna, I prefer greek yoghurt to cake and would rather have some nuts than crisps and I prefer water to any other drink. I just need to eat a normal or smaller portion of carbs and not too much chocolate per day and I'm good on the weight loss front. Those are my pitfalls and counting calories does help for me.

Other people have other issues where a different diet or mindset will help them lose/ maintain weight.

Because even though they’ve debunked CICO they are not exactly sure what the correct equation is as we’re so individual.

It’s got to somewhat mimic our ancestors as we were eating a completely different diet for thousands of years quite successfully before industrialisation changed agriculture. It stands to reason our ancestors wouldn’t have had three meals a day. I’m sure there would have been feasts and famines.

I suspect fasting alongside low carb is probably close as long as there’s no processed shit in there.

Well the NHS Better Health Weight Loss app is about counting calories, so I will stick with that and trust advice from the NHS.

Calorie deficit is the only way to lose weight.

@Ifyoubelieveyouwill

I’m in awe of those of you who have the will to log all the calories you eat, that shows real commitment and dedication. You clearly have a lot of self discipline. I just can’t sustain it (and thinking about food all the time is not good for me!)

I refuse to log what I eat either. I like to nibble on stuff instead of eating large meals. That just makes calorie counting an absolute pain in the arse.

So your point is that it's easier to eat high calorie food than lower calorie therefore calorie counting doesn't work??
You're not making sense

I think the point the OP is trying to make is that there are 60 calories in a custard cream and 80 calories in an egg.

I could scoff a whole packet of custard creams (especially with a cup of tea)... but two hard boiled eggs are the limit of how much I could eat.

It's going back to the demonisation of fat and how you can basically plot on a graph how obesity rose in line with that. Everything became about low fat and 'healthy' carbs, when really that way of eating makes most people feel hungrier.

I'm another who believes that calories in versus calories out is basic science. I was always slightly plump and put on a lot of weight at university. After I left and discovered calorie counting and was in control of my own meals, I lost nearly four stone and have kept it off 30 years later.

However, on the subject of alcoholism - I agree that alcoholics often don't bother eating. I was absolutely skeletal during my active drinking years, so my alcohol calories didn't seem to be absorbed without food. I'm talking four bottles of wine a day. In AA, many people gain weight once they stop drinking because they switch their addiction to food. If they both ate and drank previously in the "drinking years", then obviously they lose weight.

@Tangled22

Well the NHS Better Health Weight Loss app is about counting calories, so I will stick with that and trust advice from the NHS.

Calorie deficit is the only way to lose weight.

Well that’s just not true. I eat more calories but less food now and yet have maintained my weight for over year.

I follow the WW's plan. I don't count points, I use their daily menu plans to eat healthier and better than I do without. Where it goes wrong is when I go off plan and eat crap (usually chocolate or biscuits). In my case this is always driven by the same thing. Sleep. If I'm well rested I make good food choices and enjoy what I'm eating and have no desire to eat rubbish. If I'm tired then I cannot control my urge to gorge on high calorie crap.

To me, calorie counting = same as fuel in a car, you top up your energy via calories, then you burn off x calories, however if you have left over fuel then your putting more fuel in, more than your using up, therefore that to me leads to a bigger belly.

@Ifyoubelieveyouwill

So personally, I decided not to count calories and eat what I want to feel full from a healthy list of foods. I haven’t eaten any ultra processed food. I don’t stop eating due to will power, but because I feel full and satisfied.

I have lost nearly a stone in 1 month and I will continue eating this way for life as it’s so easy doesn’t require me to really think much about food. SW and WW (calorie counting) left me thinking about food all the time, which I now realise led me to a diet- overeating cycle. I wasn’t even over eating that much, just eating the wrong foods.

It’s quite a revelation not calorie counting for me (I appreciate that lots of you guys want to/ enjoy counting calories and we’re all different!)

But restricting your body to a healthy list of foods is probably calorie counting by stealth (I bet they are all low calorie foods, or foods it's hard to eat a lot of without feeling full). You are only not thinking about food because your body is now used to this way of eating. Basically you've managed to do what people who are not overweight/never been on a diet do naturally. I actually don't think this is so far away from the Slimming World "Free food" type model (with no/limited syns).

I applaud your weight loss, but a month in is probably not long enough to say that you'll eat this way forever unfortunately. I hope it continues to work for you!

Do you have any legitimate sources that back up your “calorie counting makes you gain weight” statements? I suspect you’re interpreting the data incorrectly going by your increasingly babbling posts that are far from your initial claims

Well the NHS Better Health Weight Loss app is about counting calories, so I will stick with that and trust advice from the NHS.

You'd be better off listening to the Snake Diet guy from Youtube than listening to the NHS for diet advice 🙈

And you only have to look at Edward berneys and his work with convincing people about certain foods being healthy than they actually were, and then extrapolate that to then considering how much science and research has been influenced by $$ to then wonder how much the science has been influenced for the diets etc

Sorry OP but I think you're kidding yourself a bit. You've said "I know it’s not due to a lack of willpower for me, just eating the wrong foods" and (about dieting) "You clearly have a lot of self discipline. I just can’t sustain it" but then you've explained your new way of eating (which is another diet, lets face it) and you see yourself eating like this for life as it's so easy etc. - can you not see that even now, you're dieting?! You're making conscious decisions about what types of food to eat, you're not just eating whatever you fancy. I think it's great that you've found something that you feel works for you, but I don't think it's any better than calorie counting.

I don’t think people that yoyo diet can be compared with those that calorie count. I lost 3 stone and have never been on a diet other that 2 weeks of slim fast that I realised was ridiculous. I increased my activity level and kept an eye on calories, I don’t go as far away weighing and recording but I do think to myself oh I’ve not moved much today so will have a smaller tea, or I ate a lot of snacks/had a takeaway yesterday so will just have soup for lunch. If you see it as something to do until you’ve lost the weight then you will never be successful, this is why extreme diets are pointless.

Just because it doesn’t work for you doesn’t mean it won’t work for others.

I agree lots of research suggests there is more to it than JUST counting calories - but they still matter.
Consensus at the moment seems to be a low carb diet and intermittent fasting .

I suspect that the reasons people don't do this are:
we've been told before that it was fat that was evil - what will be the next advice ?

calorie counting isn't perfect but is easy and cheap and allows for some 'treats'

Lots of people have conditions that make fasting difficult and pregnant or breast feeding women certainly aren't advised to

I think it's all about finding the thing that works for you. I find low carb most effective for weight loss but the hardest for me to follow for example.