low carb diets -seems like everyone's on one, but I thought dieticians etc generally don't recommend them?

[GhostOfAWasp]

I am not a dietician, but I know a few and they seem to think that all the anti wheat arguments are pseudo science and carbs aren't that bad! Granted, they work, but surely cutting any food group from you diet would have the same effect? I never found it felt very healthy or sustainable long term.

Have I missed something?

(Clearly I have no idea what John Briffa is suggesting specifically, although I have read a fair bit about him saying that as a veggie you're screwed. I have just downloaded his book.)

ghost the low carb diet that I think you're talking about doesn't sound representative of low carb diets I've been on

there are good and bad ways of doing it, like with anything

I can't seem to find anything about veggie low carbing other than the ghastly Rose Elliot book. There has to be a better way. And I really don't want to give up my lentils!

clean and lean is good, its not no carb or strict low carb, but its pretty low GI

Interested in this thread. I have ibs and sm addicted to sugar. I want to change the way I eat, I have given up bread but I don't eat meat so I would struggle to not have pasta ever . Also I love porridge. I also can't cook so would need easy meal ideas. I would be interested to hear from anyone who had made this work when they don't eat meat,

There's another food: oats! Oats are awesome and not to be shunned, surely?

I don't think low carb works if you are a veggie - certainly a ketosis veggie diet is unsustainable. Vegetarianism is a new concept in terms of the human diet.

Better to go low GI as a veggie and eat pulses, nuts, seeds etc.

I think the problem with carbs is the refined and processed ones
carbs as nature intended are IMO okay, if it still looks like what it was when it grew then its fine, so whole fruit is okay, fruit juice isn't so great

So would oats be ok then? Need to google low gi

oats and barley are good

I use oats for all kinds of things incl making chickien drumsticks for LO

re: oats and barley - depends whether you are avoiding gluten (although can buy gluten free oats)

Is there some sort of calorie limit you would still need to stick to? A calorie in is still a calorie that needs burning, isn't it? Just been googling the clean and lean diet and came across Alex Steinherr's blog. That sounds almost doable if you could chuck some quorn or tofu in there. And more veg...

no because if I up my protein and snack on nuts and eat good fats my calories take care of themselves, really they do! when your blood sugar is nice and regulated and steady and your hormones are doing what they should you take the right amt of calories

Yes you do need to eat less calories than you use to loose weight, but one of the benefits of high protein diet is that you don't actually need to count them on this diet, it just happens, you get full, you stay satisfited, your cravings ease

I don't think quorn would qualify in clean and lean BTW

No, I thought as much. Dammit. There's not much slack for veggies, is there? Suppose I could try to live on avocados and cottage cheese?

I don't think a low carb diet that excludes pulses is much cop, tbh. There are too many nutrients in pulses to exclude them, and the fibre in pulses is not readily digestible by humans, it's there to feed your gut bacteria, which are necessary to help you deal with your weight issues. Just in the process of looking at something for a student of mine that says the short chain fatty acids that the gut bacteria produce from the undigested carbs in our diet may actually help to regulate appetite and weight, so removing those complex carbs from your diet may actually be counterproductive.

Any low carb diet that advocates the loss of pulses, fruit and veg is on a hiding into nothing, IMO. Getting rid of refined grain products is the way forward; and potatoes you have to be a bit careful with - cold boiled potatoes are a good way to eat them (in potato salad etc.) because the starch becomes resistant to digestion and also goes towards feeding your gut bacteria.

Yak, I have read the Yudkin book, it's excellent, caused him all sorts of bother writing it though!

Thumb, all that seems to tie in with my own "common sense".

I am sure sugar is bad for you, clearly. But lentils? ! Come on.

I don't think it's that hard to do as a veggie so long as you don't do a crazy extreme version, most of what I eat on low carb is veggie, only eat meat or fish a couple of times a week, but then my idea of low carb = no refined and processed carbs

Thing is yak, that commercial wheat has changed so much in the last 100 years - it has been bred (sorry) to have far more gluten than it used to and this has probably contributed to the higher rate of problems among consumers. Also, the Chorleywood breadmaking process used commercially won't be helping the situation.
Some people who have problems with modern wheat are able to eat older, less mucked-around-with grains such as spelt or kamut - others are too sensitive to the gliadins in wheats to eat them.

But in the end, it's what works for you - and if your homemade sourdough wholemeal bread is ok for you, then that's you - but it still won't necessarily work for others.

(actually Chandon - lentils are incredibly bad for me - but that's just me! the pain, the noxious gas etc. I suffered while I tried to force myself to eat and like them was too much - it was a massive relief to give up again!)

I don't think calorie counting is helpful for most people.

I think it's weird how low-fat high carb eating ever became considered the most healthy way to eat. However, I very strongly believe that different diets suit different people. If I eat a carby diet it gives me a constant headache, I feel sick and dizzy, I want to eat ALL the time (compulsively), and I am absolutely BEYOND irritable. On a lower carb diet, I am relaxed, happy, and don't want to eat any more than I need to eat. My other half, on the other hand... well, I think that he would have to eat an exhausting amount of protein and vegetables to not get too thin... he loses weight at the drop of a hat (like, half a stone in a week just by stopping drinking alcohol, and he doesn't drink an enormous amount).

I don't think that one should cut out stuff like brown rice, oats and lentils altogether. I think if you are trying to actively lose weight then they are not so helpful, but if you are the weight you want to be, then small amounts are fine. To be honest, I think a lot of it is about moderation; not overdoing anything, and certainly avoiding the highly processed stuff.

When I first began my rebellion against the pyramid diet thing, I found The Schwarzbein Principle pretty helpful; there's also an accompanying vegetarian cookbook.

... and regardless of how 'good' you might think lentils are, they are still a carbohydrate, which means that you will still see a spike in your blood sugar, which means your body will release insulin, which means ... blah blah blah

Ghost, I'm a veggie too and I've found that my favourite way of eating is just to cut out sugar and processed carbs - low GI, effectively. For me, that means very little bread or pasta, the odd meal with potatoes or rice and no real restrictions on pulses (although I don't tend to eat many pulses anyway). I try and stay away from processed sugar in favour of fruit or the odd spoonful of agave nectar or honey.

I don't eat like this all the time (I'd probably be a lot slimmer if I did!) but I always feel a lot better in myself when I do.