Anyone want to join a thread about Eating Less.

[bumblingbovine]

I read this book by Gillian Riley a while ago and it made so much sense. She has a website here
www.eatingless.com

I may even go to a seminar but I think the book has most of whast you need in it. There is a chapter free on the website to get an idea of the tone


She talks about stopping overeating and says that focussing on weight is completely counterproductive. I really would like to try this but thought it would be useful to have some support.

I have been thinking about this for a while but issues with my ds have got in the way. The other thread on fat/overeating has reminded me

I will need to dig the book out agin but the key thing she talks about is setting some realistic limits on the what, the amount and when you will eat and then sticking to them.

The idea is to "stop overeating" not to "lose weight". In fact you can stop overeating much more easily than you can lose weight and it happens quicker.

So my food plan would be to

Eat 3 balanced meals a day (one portion only - no seconds)every day. This would be
Breakfast between 7am and 9am
Lunch between 12pm and 2pm
Dinner between 6pm and 8pm

To have a maximum of 1 snack a day which should be of a reasonable size and reasonably healthy

Dessert if eaten should be fruit or yoghurt during the week but can be something less healthy at the weekend for dessert if I want it

Success would be sticking to the food plan each day. Weight would not come into it.
everybody's foodplan would be different to suit them

We could check in every few days (or daily) with how we have done or if we are having trouble with cravings and wanting to eat more.

Does anyone want to try this?

[Italiangreyhound]

erebus I like the comments from IvaNighSpare about the ?fat? photo but before I read them and your reply I had already typed you a message erebus which said ?Does that ?fat? photo inspire you to eat well or does it make you dislike yourself? Just asking. I know the feeling of not liking yourself. I think liking - and indeed loving and valuing yourself - are key to eating well (I am worth nourishing and feeding well etc). Maybe try it both ways, a week with a ?fat? photo and a week of being more affirming about yourself.? Then read your comments so very glad to hear you have some affirming comments, do share them if you want to.

For me, either a photo or not will not get at the issues of why I over eat (if there are issues for others, there may not be for you but there are for me).
Whatever works do share it please.

Please do not think I am making any judgements, I have gone and eaten a whole bunch of jelly snakes tonight. I can honestly say that I felt compelled to eat them. I was not even hungry! I am still learning but I must admit I am feeling better as I am learning. I do still weigh myself but trying to do it only a couple of times a day instead of every day!

[Italiangreyhound]

Sorry that should be trying to weigh myself only a couple of times a week not a day!

One thing that they talked about at my New ID course is HALT. When you feel like eating you think to yourself HALT (maybe meaning stop and think, not sure if I am spelling it right!) but REALLY standing for:
Hungry
Angry
Lonely
Tired
And I would add Bored to that list.

So the idea is you see when you get the desire to eat whether you actually feel hungry/angry/lonely/tired (or my own one bored). I would also add habit in there too! So I guess after that you need to work out if you are angry you try and deal with that, lonely seek company or an activity that makes you feel better (no one need be totally lonely with mumsnet! ? no I don?t work for them!) and tired, well sleep! With bored or sad or unloved etc you might want to give yourself something nice like a warm bubble bath or a nice thing to do that makes you feel good rather than food. For me it was so much (is sometimes still so much) about what catches my eye. I am an impulse eater! When I see food I want to eat it!

bumblingbovine and IvaNighSpare Re dealing with comments about weight loss - I got one the other day and I did tell the lady what I was doing (New ID) because I did not want it to be all about me in a slimming club, as it is not. I know what you mean about it being a bit hard when people pay compliments but actually they won?t talk about it too much if you just accept the compliment (I think). I would recommend if you don?t want to talk about your weight that if you get a compliment you just smile and say 'thank you'. If you don't talk too much they won't either! at least I have found that. I have a colleague who does like to talk about weight a lot as she has lost a lot so when she comes near my desk i just get busy and I try and talk to her at her desk so I can leave when I want to! I might also say something like I am eating more healthily, looking at nutrition now or whatever rather than using the word diet!

IvaNighSpare lovely image of the boat.

[erebus]

Italian- the HALT (B) list is very useful, thanks.

With me, diet 'upsets' can come around because I simply forget I am supposed to be being mindful about what I eat! I sometimes draw a red 'No entry' sign on the back of my right hand so I glance at it as I reach for the fridge handle, for instance. I would love to have a symbol (or even 'HALT!') on a piece of paper stuck to the fridge, cupboards etc, but I'd also have to pin it to chocolate cakes in the staff room, etc but a) I try not to involve my family too much in my decision and b) I don't want my work colleagues taking the mick!! Having only lost 11 lbs of the 2 1/2 stone I intend losing, and the fact I effectively wear pyjamas at work means that it won't be obvious I've lost weight for at least another stone yet, I'd say- then I may have to politely fend off 'diet talk'!

My overeating is 'interesting' (to me, anyway! ) in that I am finding it hard to identify triggers , which is a good reason to use HALT (B) as that may force me to ponder why exactly I have idly picked up that mini Swiss roll. I can stop at 2 biscuits, I don't feel an urge to eat the lot, for instance BUT I do tend to clear my plate and be the first to finish.

I started treading Gillian Riley last night. I know I must read it all before 'passing judgement', so I won't yet!

Anyway, carry on the good work. all!

[IvaNighSpare]

Here's a curious one, I've just thrown away a pot of strawberry custard, which, if you knew me, is very out of character.
The reason being was that I had set my TIME to eat what I thought was a pot of strawberry rice pudding, which I had made the CHOICE to eat.
I opened up the tub took one spoonful, and realised that it was custard, I'd picked up the wrong pot. Normally that wouldn't have phased me and I'd have finished the pot regardless. I love custard.
However after the first spoonful it struck me that custard wouldn't satisfy in the way rice pudding would have. I had psyched myself up to committing myself to my CHOICE. After that I couldn't face eating the custard, it didn't feel right.
There was no option to go and get any rice pudding, so I had a banana instead.

Of course, it would probably would have been better to have had the banana in the first place but I had PLANNED to eat the rice pudding.

I think this means I am on the right track, but I would be interested in hearing your views.

[Italiangreyhound]

erebus you work in pajamas, can I ask what you do, are you the sandman???

IvaNighSpare, yes I think it means you are on the right track, you are making a choice. I went to a service station for petrol yesterday and I decided I wanted a Fry's chocolate bar which is balck chocolate and mint. They did not have it. They had nothing like it so I avoided all the chocolate unheard of before) and bought a packet of mints. Now I did eat the mints in one sitting (habit) but I didn't buy a chocolate bar even though I kind of gave myself permission to if I wanted but decided I did not actually want what was on offer (beleive me I am not normally fussy' and there was a lot on offer!).

So, yes, I think progress.

[bumblingbovine]

Hi All

Lots of really good stuff here. I have had a very busy day/evening and am getting a cold so I will only post quickly tonight.

Italiangreyhound
I had a look at tha newid stuff and it looks great. I loved the hole in the road analogy that you posted earlier too. Also I know you have a Christian view and I did do quite a bit of asking for help with this recently (in desperation) and here I am being given the strengｔｈ．

Ivanigspare


Ｉ　ｔｈｉｎｋ　ｔｈａｔ　ａｎｙｔｈｉｎｇ　ｔｈａｔ　ｍｅａｎｓ　ｙｏｕ　ｄｏ　ｎｏｔ　ｊｕｓｔ　ｅａｔ　ｓｏｍｅｔｈｉｎｇ　?ｊｕｓｔ　ｂｅｃａｕｓｅ　ｉｔ　ｉｓ　ｔｈｅｒｅ?ｉｓ　ａ　ｖｅｒｙ　ｇｏｏｄ　ｔｈｉｎｇ

　The boat story describes my struggle with overeating almost exactly. As I have said I spent years dieting and putting on weight. In my last big diet which I did around 4 years ago I lost 5 stone in 6 months on the lighter life diet. I put all the weight back on in around two years. AS this was around my tenth "successful diet" in 30 years I reached what they call "rock bottom" in OA. I had failed yet again to maintain a weight loss.

In the last couple of years I have given up any attempt at dieting. I also have not weighed myself in that time. The problem is that I have slowly gone up yet another size in that time. I had given up any hope ｔｈａｔ　Ｉ　ｗｏｕｌｄ　ｅｖｅｒ　ｓｔｏｐ　ｏｖｅｒｅａｔｉｎｇ　tbh and actually started to think that being dead would be better than how I felt - i.e as someone with no control whatsoever.

I have in the past done quite a bit of therapy, several years of eating related therapy as well as few years of more general therapy. I also did hypnosis, and a number of other alternative treatments to get my eating under

Yet now I feｅl like I am actually walking the walk. I talked the talk for a long time and the talk did helo in that I am using the things I learned but somehow I have never been able to actually just start doing it before．

[bumblingbovine]

I am not sure what happened to my text there but I had also written to ivanigspare that any time we avoid eating something "just because it is there" must be a very good thing.

[Italiangreyhound]

bumblingbovine really hope this will work for you. Are you exploring any issues that could be making you overeat?

What is up with you pc/laptop/phone and all the numbers!

anyone - one thing that has helped me, just one element, is to try and eat slower, I try and concentrate on the food a bit more, to try and feel when I am getting full up. It is weird because it is not a feeling in my tummy to say that I am full but rather a feeling about half way between my mouth and my chest! I also notice that I am not enjoying the food and am not so bothered about stopping! If I am talking a lot, of rushing to finish I miss it completely. I have noticed I often take about a third as much as I actually need! BUT I must say that for me this behaviour of over eating has been learnt over about 20 years so I know that I will not re-learn normal eating 'skills' overnight. So when I make mistakes like the jelly snakes and the peppermints, I just have to chalk it up to experience.

Blessings and good luck to all

[Italiangreyhound]

Sorry I should explain, I meant
I also notice that I am not enjoying the food and am not so bothered about stopping when I am full, when eating, I mean I do enjoy the food a lot at the start of the meal but by the end I am bored with the meal and so I know I am full!

[IvaNighSpare]

some really sound advice coming out here. This is rapidly becoming one of my all-time favourite threads

[Italiangreyhound]

IvaNighSpare what a lovely thing to say.

[erebus]

greyhound You ask why I wear pyjamas for work?

I'm a porn star!

No, actually, I wear operating theatre scrubs all day at a hospital, which are just like PJs!

[Italiangreyhound]

erebus wow you work in an operating theatre. That sounds exciting, yet a bit scary, too!

How is everyone?

I am doing good at the moment. Feeling positive.

Hope you all are too.

[bumblingbovine]

Hi All

Just posting quickly as I am having a manic day for various reasons. I will be away next week on holiday so probably won't be able to post, I am a bit nervous about being on holiday as historically these are always laden with food issues.

I am usually tend to be "off my diet" on holiday in which case I get gradually more unhappy at how much I am eating and come home feeling fatter/more bloated or else I am trying to keep to whatever food restrictions apply in whatever diet I am on at the time which ends up ruling the holiday as I need to have access to all the appropriate foods all the time.

Either way food end ups up ruining my holiday . I will see when I have come back whether I have managed to put food in it's proper place so that it doesn't take over my holiday.

Goog luck to everyone

[IvaNighSpare]

Checking in here too. All good, surprisingly. I've found myself the target of a Workplace Bully this week and it has been incredibly stressful, emotional, just plain awful. But I'm taking action and feeling empowered by it.
And the best news of all is that, despite everything I haven't resorted to comfort eating in any way, shape or form. Go, me!!!!!

Of course, it could unravel this weekend - I have an all-inclusive hen weekend coming up, now THERE'S a challenge

[Italiangreyhound]

bumblingbovine all the very best on your holiday. Please try and think positively, you can do this. Try and put food in its proper place. It is there for your nutrician and it is also nice. But it must not take over your holiday.

IvaNighSpare oh no, how terrible getting horrible attention from a work place bully. I really hope it will all get sorted out. BUT a big, huge well done for not turning to food to help you through it.

Today has been good. I had a special treat lunch, salad with burger and potato wedges. The lady in the queue ahead of me asked the chef not to put too many wedges on her plate and stopped him mid flow! I was so inspired, I did the same! I ate all the salad and then most of the burger, leaving about a large bite (it was not a big burger) and had about two and a half potato wedges (they were big ones!) then I was done and guess what, there was a bit if potato wedgey left on my plate. So I did have enough! For me, this fear of there not being enough food is the thing that makes me go for big helpings and special food. The thing about not leaving food, or not even thinking if I am getting full, also comes in because if I have a really full plate I just plod through food without thinking! Normally, that is, but the New ID www.newid.info/ course has been very helpful to me.

It is also helpful to be able to share things that are helping me re-think food so thank you bumblingbovine for your inspiration.

erebus how are you doing?

[mummyosaurus]

I read the book and went on Gillian's seminar about 10 years ago. It was very interesting and changed the way I think about dieting. I did lose some weight, I was very motivated because of wanting to get pregnant, but used other methods to help (Carol Vordeman Detox).

Now, I have two kids, and am heavier than ever. I am having some success with Paul Mckenna, he and Gillian Riley would agree on lots of things I think.

Good luck.

[Italiangreyhound]

mummyosaurus what does Gillian say about the reasons why people overeat, if you can remember? Thanks.

[Italiangreyhound]

I just watched Gillian's video at tvnz.co.nz/good-morning/s2010-e190310-gillianriley-video-3422956 it was very interesting and makes lots of sense.

bumblingbovine I hope you can watch it before your holiday and I will also say a little prayer for you to have a super holiday and not let food rule it. Have some nice things and some nuticious things and just enjoy your time. Get back to us when your are back from your holiday and I really hope it will have gone well.

[Italiangreyhound]

Oh there is another one. tvnz.co.nz/good-morning/goodmorning-s2010-e120310-gillianriley-video-3411728

She is very good. I like her. I hope bumblingbovine having pointed us in her direction is listening to the good advice! It is very interesting.

I feel I am dealing with lots of compulsions in my New ID course //www.newid.info as well, one is that I stay up late and am a bit of an insomniac! So I must off to bed soon, but just wanted to say night night all and all the best, am away for a few days this long weekend so will check back in and see how you are all doing.

[IvaNighSpare]

I love those videos and she seems like such a level lady, no showmanship or schmaltz. Which instantly makes me sit up and take notice. Those "Dr Phil" types on Oprah and worse (Richard Simmons, anyone? Ew!), and even Paul McKenna (who in my opinion is an entertainer first) make me want to do everything they tell me not to!
Is there a third (initial) video in the series? Did a search but couldn't find it.
Well, I'm off for the all-inclusive hen-night. Going to try and navigate the thin line between enjoying myself and making choices I know I'll come to regret later.
bumblingbovine I feel your pain and thank my lucky stars that I only face temptation for one night. Good luck and be gentle on yourself. The day we stop making mistakes is the day we shuffle off this mortal coil.

[Italiangreyhound]

IvaNighSpare The day we stop making mistakes.....so true. Enjoy your hen do.

A third video is mentioned but I could not find a watch button.

Yes, I found her very level headed too. I like the fact that she thinks overeating is beatable. I also like the fact it is about choices. We must all makes choices. Following a VERY restrictive food regime takes away all choices and so that people don't feel they have to make them! Then when they get tempted they 'give in' and it all goes haywire! Probably because they don't know how to make good sensible choices and go a bit crazy and eat things that are a bit fattening OCCASIONALLY! I mean she points out if we ate what we wanted all the time it would not be good, and that is not real choice. For me that is compulsion!

Good luck to all.

[erebus]

Good links, thanks very much.

I have finally found the time to start reading the book and I'm finding it interesting.

I don't consider myself to be 'addicted' to food (I have never felt the need to eat a whole packet of biscuits or finish the family tub of ice cream, for instance), BUT I definitely fail to take on board the whole 'consequences of a given choice' when I make eating decisions.

I cannot forgo my scales- yet. I have been on a self-directed diet for a month and have lost 12lbs, from 13 to 12 st 2 lbs. I am thinking that when I hit a golden milestone (12 stone) I am going to try Gillian's method of mindfulness to a greater degree.

As it is I am not denying myself much- I had MacDonald's for lunch today for instance! But I needed to cut right back on the white wine as, to be honest, it was getting a leetle bit out of control. Now I drink one large glass twice a week. In that way I am restricting myself, however, I believe the last stone was pure Pinot Grigio and I'm sure my liver is enjoying the holiday, too!

For me I think it will be hard to ACTUALLY, GENUINELY be making free-will choices. As it is I think I am but I wonder if, when I say 'Yes, I could drink another big glass of wine/ have a big serve of profiteroles but as I am aware of the greater consequences, I choose not to'.....what I'm really subconsciously thinking 'I can't 'cos it's forbidden on my diet!'

[IvaNighSpare]

Well, back from the Hen Weekend, and we all had a darn good time. I'd love to report that I didn't overeat but if I did I'd be shot by the Truth Police on the spot! Damn you, unlimited free cocktails!!
But what I can report is that I didn't overeat as much as I normally would. Given the amount of fabulous food available on-tap I showed surprising restraint. Very proud of myself.
Erebus I totally understand your concern about being genuine in your sentiments for your thoughts of free-will choice, and that's a battle I too am embarking on. However, a couple of weeks into the 'programme' and I can feel a shift in my thinking, which came to the fore at this weekend. Yes, I did over-indulge a little, but I became acutely more aware of sensations of bloatedness and sluggishness that were a direct result from overeating. Feelings that would normally conveniently slip from my mind the next time food appeared. And as the weekend progressed I continued to pile up my plate at mealtimes, but found the memory of the previous meal 'hangovers' coming much more to the front of my mind. And I ended up leaving my plates uncleared in the knowledge that I didn't want to feel rubbish again. Unheard of in my world!
So it seems that the opening up of free-will and choice seems to be pushing away the power of denial of the consequences. I struggle to ignore the consequences once I admit to myself that those consequences exist.
I really do hope that this is the start of a long journey of discovery.

[foreverondiet]

I just bought the book and it has given me a lot to think about. I know I am thin now due to almost 8 months of dieting, but I'd love to stop weighing and plotting everything on MFP, and be normal! I am going to focus on the other aspects of overeating for me; IBS and indigestion (hasn't been a problem if I stick to my 1200 calorie a day diet), and also that my low carb diet keeps my pcos symptoms under control too.