Page 5 | Half a million on weight loss jabs

Lunedimiel · 05/01/2025 20:40

Queenofthejabs · 28/12/2024 11:26

well there wasn’t queues before the jabs so I doubt there will be queues now.

i think more and more people realise those clubs don’t work. Slimming world is appalling, telling people with weight issues they can eat unlimited pasta and potatoes for goodness sake,

weigtht watchers has a glp program, and has branded a drug in the us, so they are moving with the times.

slimming world are poo poohing them and declaring they don’t work long term, which is quite something when you consider 97 percent of their members regain the weight and then some, and it is evidenced people on mounjaro only gain and average of 14 percent of their body weight when coming off, ie 1.4 stone on a ten stone woman.

id assume slimming world will die out. Weight watchers got the memo and are acting on it.

Show quote history

That stat you are quoting on regaining on MJ isn't correct. Weight regain is similar to other methods of weight loss: eg the vast majority of users are expected to regain all weight within two years of ceasing treatment. Hence the interest in maintenance doses.

Queenofthejabs · 05/01/2025 21:38

Lunedimiel · 05/01/2025 20:40

That stat you are quoting on regaining on MJ isn't correct. Weight regain is similar to other methods of weight loss: eg the vast majority of users are expected to regain all weight within two years of ceasing treatment. Hence the interest in maintenance doses.

Show quote history

That’s not what I saw. Can you back yours up please?

Lunedimiel · 05/01/2025 21:49

Queenofthejabs · 05/01/2025 21:38

That’s not what I saw. Can you back yours up please?

Show quote history

Sure. This is an extract from NICE's technical guidance 2024, which discusses the manufacturer's assumptions. (Obviously the NICE discussion is about the threshold for NHS prescribing, but the section here on assumptions in respect of weight gain stands irrespective of this). BTW this is not an 'anti' MJ post, just sharing latest assumptions on weight regain once treatment stops.

Weight regain after stopping treatment
3.17
In its submission, the company's model assumed that after stopping tirzepatide, the weight that had been lost was regained at a steady rate over 3 years. At 3 years after stopping treatment, weight was aligned with where it would have been had treatment not started (in line with the diet and exercise support arm endpoints). The EAG explained that the rate of weight regain seen after stopping semaglutide treatment in STEP‑1 (see section 3.11) suggested that the time it takes for the treatment effect to be lost is closer to 2 years. The clinical experts explained that STEP‑1 provided relevant data to estimate the time that treatment benefits would be lost after stopping tirzepatide. They explained that for semaglutide, around two thirds of the weight lost while on treatment is regained within the first year after stopping. Some other benefits gained, such as reduced blood pressure, are also lost by this time. But they noted that there is no long-term data for what happens to weight after stopping tirzepatide. After the first committee meeting, the EAG updated its model to assume that weight would be regained in 2 years after stopping tirzepatide. The EAG noted that assuming either 2 or 3 years for time-to-weight-regain did not have a meaningful impact on the ICER. In response to draft guidance consultation, the company also updated its model to assume that weight would be regained in 2 years after stopping tirzepatide. The committee concluded that it was uncertain how quickly the benefits associated with tirzepatide would be lost after stopping treatment. But it preferred to assume that weight would be regained in 2 years after stopping, in line with the evidence for semaglutide.

3 Committee discussion | Tirzepatide for managing overweight and obesity | Guidance | NICE

https://www.nice.org.uk/guidance/ta1026/chapter/committee-discussion#tirzepatides-treatment-effect-compared-with-semaglutide

Jabtastic · 05/01/2025 22:25

Queenofthejabs · 05/01/2025 17:39

One of the main causes of gerd is being overweight, same as eating chocolate, spicy food, caffeine booze. So it is difficult to say it is directly due to the drug. As to be on it, you would need to be overweight if not obese. And may have developed it anyway, have you seen a doctor?

Show quote history

Yes I had GERD in the past but hadn't had it for a very long time. The jabs made my digestive system slow down as designed and this initially caused constipation but then turned to acid reflux, diarrhea and niggling gall bladder type pain - I'm basing this on other people's description of where they get gall bladder pain. Also awful fatigue. The other symptoms vanished after I quit the jabs but sadly the reflux has remained. I'm planning to go to the GP but it can be a challenge getting an appointment!

85reasons · 06/01/2025 06:27

Jabtastic · 05/01/2025 17:32

Thank you for your patience explaining! I really should fill in the yellow card scheme and it would be good if providers were made to send a link to everyone who stops medication so that it's easy to report side effects. This way there will be a lot more data available. Lots of people will just ignore it as they will simply be switching providers to get better prices.

But it's irritating to see people airily dismissing the side effects because it downplays them and means people are more likely to assume they are very minor. They really weren't for me and there are probably others like me. I still have persistent GERD 6 weeks after stopping Mountjaro though thankfully the other symptoms have vanished.

Show quote history

I don’t really understand your logic. Why will people switching to get better prices have any impact on reporting side effects?

I don’t see amyone glossing over or minimising side effects. For the vast majority, side effects are minimal or non existent. Yet we can’t escape the fact that for some people, they are too unpleasant and will need to stop taking the medication.

NewLifter · 06/01/2025 07:11

Laneylane81 · 05/01/2025 12:07

I can only speak from personal experience. I am a kidney patient and have diabetes caused by the transplant therapy and have been on Ozempic for glucose control for 3 years. Supply was always a tricky, then eased as manufacturers got on top of things briefly. In the last 6 months pharmacies have again stuggled to fulfil prescriptions and it is stressful for me. My kidney function is affected by poor glucose control, and dialysis looms.
I do not have a problem with people using it to tackle real obesity, or other medical problems, but it has become so trendy for people who don't qualify for NHS prescriptions to get it under the radar. I sympathise with anybody wanting to lose weight but until supply is assured they should consider how they are depriving people who need it more.

Hi Laney

We are having the same issues with my sons ADHD drugs but it never crossed my mind to blame people paying privately, I blame the NHS personally for not properly funding these things.

Private suppliers have no problem getting drugs, so why does the NHS?

It's clearly an issue with them, not the drugs.

NewLifter · 06/01/2025 07:13

Jabtastic · 05/01/2025 12:26

I had awful side effects on Mountjaro and they made me really unwell and miserable. I think a lot of us quietly quit and slink away rather than advertising it. They absolutely do need to do research into the side effects, including whether or not they will cost the NHS money dealing with them. It's a bit cynical to assume negative stories will be funded by the food and drinks lobby! I would just be a normal person who was badly affected by them. There are probably a lot more of us as the numbers trying MJ etc grow.

Yes people in the online groups get ahead if GPs decline them prescriptions of cycling etc to help with side effects or routine bloods that some users want to monitor changes whilst on MJ. I don't think GPs should have to pick up these things personally when a patient is availing of private care, except in emergency situations.

Lunedimiel · 06/01/2025 10:38

Jabbabong · 05/01/2025 07:13

How did you get into that state and what were you doing about it before the weight loss jabs?

Sorry but I personally think that those with kidney disease and diabetes should be given priority.

Edited

Show quote history

So you have your own moral code for deserving and undeserving life threatening conditions? Sounds unpleasant, and ethically and medically incoherent, so forgive us for not taking terribly seriously.

Queenofthejabs · 06/01/2025 13:20

Jabtastic · 05/01/2025 22:25

Yes I had GERD in the past but hadn't had it for a very long time. The jabs made my digestive system slow down as designed and this initially caused constipation but then turned to acid reflux, diarrhea and niggling gall bladder type pain - I'm basing this on other people's description of where they get gall bladder pain. Also awful fatigue. The other symptoms vanished after I quit the jabs but sadly the reflux has remained. I'm planning to go to the GP but it can be a challenge getting an appointment!

Show quote history

the drugs are completely out of your system now, and you’ve had it before, so isn’t it more likely it is caused by your weight?

jellycat · 06/01/2025 16:03

I think the NHS supply issues are linked to the PPRS (the pricing system for medicines purchased by the NHS). Basically, this system caps the price pharmaceutical companies can charge the NHS (it’s designed to limit the NHS’s drug bill and allow for budgeting by the NHS which would be difficult if the price of medicines was constantly changing). If there are any shortages the pharma companies will most likely prioritise markets where they can charge more than the price that has been agreed with the NHS. Therefore an increase in demand via private prescriptions could easily be having an effect on the availability via the NHS. Hopefully the manufacturers will be able to ramp up production of the products that have been in short supply, but that does take time.

I sympathise with @Laneylane81 , my DH has had huge difficulties getting hold of his Trulicity (dulaglutide). We assume some patients who have been on semaglutide have been switched to dulaglutide due to the shortages, and that this has caused a knock-on effect. It’s very stressful, but thankfully the supply problems seem to have eased in the second half of last year.

Jabtastic · 06/01/2025 16:47

Queenofthejabs · 06/01/2025 13:20

the drugs are completely out of your system now, and you’ve had it before, so isn’t it more likely it is caused by your weight?

Show quote history

I am very sure the MJ triggered it, just as it triggered all the other symptoms I had. I find it a bit odd that you're telling me otherwise to be honest, given that you don't know me or anything about my health

It's clearly working well for lots of people and sadly I'm just not one of them. I had high hopes! But I think it's good to hear all the experiences people have on these jabs, they're still relatively new and it's important for people to get a balanced view as a lot of posts are from jab cheerleaders - understandable if they are working well for lots of people. It might make people like me feel less hard done by to know they aren't alone!

85reasons · 06/01/2025 16:52

It must be gutting to have to stop taking it @Jabtastic - I have a friend in early days and whilst she's pinned a huge amount of hope into these drugs working for her, so far they are not having any effect and she is gutted. She hasn't had awful side effects but I can still sense a panic in her that this option might not work for her after all.

Queenofthejabs · 06/01/2025 16:55

Jabtastic · 06/01/2025 16:47

I am very sure the MJ triggered it, just as it triggered all the other symptoms I had. I find it a bit odd that you're telling me otherwise to be honest, given that you don't know me or anything about my health

It's clearly working well for lots of people and sadly I'm just not one of them. I had high hopes! But I think it's good to hear all the experiences people have on these jabs, they're still relatively new and it's important for people to get a balanced view as a lot of posts are from jab cheerleaders - understandable if they are working well for lots of people. It might make people like me feel less hard done by to know they aren't alone!

Show quote history

When someone uses a question mark. This symbol “?”. It indicates a question is being asked of you. If I was telling you, as you’re stating then I would not use this symbol.

as such, what I wrote “the drugs are completely out of your system now, and you’ve had it before, so isn’t it more likely it is caused by your weight?”

This was a question, this was indicated by the use of the question mark symbol.

had I wrote, “the drugs are completely out of your system now, and you’ve had it before, so it is more likely it is caused by your weight”

then I’d have been telling you.

hope that clears up your “odd” feeling.

mollymazda · 06/01/2025 16:56

Sadteacher · 21/12/2024 09:04

Front page of The Times today! I wonder if we will be asked more how we have lost our weight now it is becoming more common! My friends still talk about them like they are something only celebrities use.

and? does it matter? its my understanding that its almost impossible to get them via NHS unless you are diabetic, which means everyone else is paying for them. what people decide to spend with their hard earned cash is their business surely?

at least people who are using them have accepted they need to do something about their weight and are doing it!

i wonder how many people pay for a gym or a PT instructor, are they to be shamed for paying for someone to help them in their fitness journey? the whole weightloss injection thing is getting pretty boring now.

ruethewhirl · 06/01/2025 17:00

Queenofthejabs · 05/01/2025 07:45

Given priority for what exactly? Maybe educate yourself before posting?

it begs the question though, how on earth did you get into this state where you post like that?

Show quote history

Agree with all of the above. 'Get into that state' is unpleasant and judgemental.

Jabtastic · 06/01/2025 17:32

Queenofthejabs · 06/01/2025 16:55

When someone uses a question mark. This symbol “?”. It indicates a question is being asked of you. If I was telling you, as you’re stating then I would not use this symbol.

as such, what I wrote “the drugs are completely out of your system now, and you’ve had it before, so isn’t it more likely it is caused by your weight?”

This was a question, this was indicated by the use of the question mark symbol.

had I wrote, “the drugs are completely out of your system now, and you’ve had it before, so it is more likely it is caused by your weight”

then I’d have been telling you.

hope that clears up your “odd” feeling.

Show quote history

I thought it was more odd that you asked at all as I wouldn't have posted it if I hadn't been quite certain. But I'll accept you were asking a genuine question.

I really did get hit very hard with side effects and either I'm one of the unlucky few OR there are lots more of us out there and we just don't really talk about it. I didn't tell anyone other than DH that I was on the jabs so I therefore don't talk about the side effects with friends and family. I really hope all stigma around using them vanishes as I think open conversation about them - good and bad - is really important.

Thank you @85reasons ❤️ It was disappointing for sure. I only have 2.5-3 stone to lose but I'm disabled so it's a bit tougher plus perimenopause! I'm sorry it's not helping your friend but she may just need a higher dose and if she's not having side effects she will hopefully be able to build her way up. I had 5 weeks on 2.5mg and one dose of 3.5 (I didn't dare take 5mg!) and by then I was feeling so miserable and ill I just quit. If someone has a lot of weight to lose I can see why they would be praying for it to work. I think they are refining it and trying to make a pill version so they may iron out the side effects too in time, fingers crossed!🤞

Jabtastic · 06/01/2025 17:38

I'm interested to know if anyone got on better with Ozempic if they couldn't tolerate MJ so I might have a search. Most people seem to have moved the opposite direction from Ozempic to MJ but it just occurred to me that I might be the anomaly who does better on Ozempic! Has anyone heard of this?