Slow titrating & sub dosing chat/support

[SubDoser]

Thought it would be good to have a specific thread for those of us who are using sub doses to titrate more slowly than average due to managing side effects (or simply preference). If there is already a thread going though please point me in the right direction!

Sounds good @Dunkou - managing side effects and losing weight - sweet spot!

@Pandora71 Glad it is going well starting on the lower doses!

Weekly WI just now and I have lost weight this week so things are finally moving again - lost 2.1 lbs last week and 1.2 lbs this week (after two months of almost no weight loss - average of 0 lbs/wk last month and 0.5 lbs/wk the month before).

I am also tolerating 6.7 mg with no problem (no side effects - although I won't hit peak levels until this evening). I guess my body is now tolerating MJ way better than it did in the days when I was progressing from 2.5 mg to 5 mg and maybe I don't need to be quite so cautious now with the speed of titration (definitely won't titrate up if I have good suppression and definitely sticking to titrating up in sub doses though).

I am glad I mentally gave myself 2+ years for this journey from the start. Worth noting that I feel great now compared to what I did at the start through, and look so much better.

@SubDoser glad the scales are moving again, it can be a bit disheartening when they don't.

Are you measuring yourself as well? The scales have only moved about half a pound in the last 2 weeks for me but I've lost half an inch from my waist and inch from hips in the same time. I tried on a pair of trousers that I bought in November, with the cardinal sin of meaning to 'slim into them'. The button was about 2 inches from doing up and zip half open. I managed to actually zip and button them today, though they are still a few pounds away from actually being wearable.

Success with those trousers @Dunkou ! 😀

No, I'm not bothering to measure myself [yet - I think I will when I am down below where I got to in my 2019 weight loss campaign, and that will take a while]. I just don't want to see the numbers, even if they are going down!

As this isn't like a regular diet I'm not disheartened like I would be if I was putting in loads of effort - it just ticks along in the background and I accept the time it took to get the dose right/being under suppressed over Christmas but maintaining. It is lovely to wear clothes that I haven't fitted into for quite a while and now discard clothes that I couldn't fit into when I first started and are now too big!

After 5 weeks on 3.75mg it's no longer as effective for me.
I want to go up but I'd prefer to wait until half term week to take the full 5mg, when I'm not working (in case of side effects).

So I'm increasing in steps:
3.75mg last week
4.2mg this week
4.6mg next week
5mg the week after next

I'll then stay on 5mg for at least four weeks to give the levels a chance to increase and stabilise.

Sounds like a good plan @JunoRoma - hope it works out well for you. That's almost how I planned to go from 2.5 mg up to 5 mg (bonus (3.2), 4.2, 4.6 mg - going from 4.2 mg to 4.6 mg was a problematic step for me and it took a lot longer!) but I didn't do the 5 weeks on 3.75 mg first.

I've just started my first 7.5 mg pen (55 clicks so 6.9 mg) - I was tempted to just go straight to 7.5 mg as it seems I am tolerating the increases now way better than I was several months ago but thought better of it. I may do it next week though when it is half term if I still don't feel suppressed enough on this dose either.

Pen 1 (2.5 mg) - 2.5, 2.5, 2.5, 2.5, 3.2
Pen 2 (5.0 mg) - 4.2, 4.2, 4.6, 2.5, 4.2
Pen 3 (5.0 mg) - 4.2, 4.4, 3.3, 3.75, 3.75
Pen 4 (5.0 mg) - 3.75, 4.2, 4.2, 4.2, 4.2
Pen 5 (5.0 mg) - 4.2, 4.5, 4.6, 4.6, 4.6
Pen 6 (5.0 mg) - 4.6, 5.0, 5.0, 5.0, 5.0
Pen 7 (5.0 mg) - 5.8, 5.8, 6.3, 6.7
Pen 8 (7.5 mg) - 6.9

Bolded - side effects too much (with hindsight I was over suppressed on 4.2 mg and shouldn't have gone up - did two weeks on 4.2 mg as I was on holiday the second week and didn't want to risk going up (so glad I didn't!)).

Despite not being convinced...I've just joined WW online (for the GLP-1 programme) - hoping that it will provide me with the kick to get some more habits changed. Food planning and prep for a start. Also seriously considering taking the plunge and going up to 7.5 mg next week. Now time to do some of that food planning and prep I talk of...

That's interesting, I didn't know they had a specific programme. My meals are getting very repetitive!

I think it is really just an optional different way of tracking - so you can ditch the points and concentrate on making sure you are meeting protein/fruit &veg/water goals. I'm just hoping it makes me prep/plan better and be more mindful about what I am doing as things have slipped quite a lot and, yes, being very repetitive!

Been brave again and gone up to 7.5, as symptoms will hit at half term if they do. Plan to stay here now for another three weeks (unless ott symptoms or it really isn't doing much). If that goes ok then maybe it is time to go up in half doses when required rather than smaller increments. I've got another 7.5 mg pen after this one but think I'll order 10 mg next as the same price and I think I'll be needing it at this rate. Quite a change.

Pen 1 (2.5 mg) - 2.5, 2.5, 2.5, 2.5, 3.2
Pen 2 (5.0 mg) - 4.2, 4.2, 4.6, 2.5, 4.2
Pen 3 (5.0 mg) - 4.2, 4.4, 3.3, 3.75, 3.75
Pen 4 (5.0 mg) - 3.75, 4.2, 4.2, 4.2, 4.2
Pen 5 (5.0 mg) - 4.2, 4.5, 4.6, 4.6, 4.6
Pen 6 (5.0 mg) - 4.6, 5.0, 5.0, 5.0, 5.0
Pen 7 (5.0 mg) - 5.8, 5.8, 6.3, 6.7
Pen 8 (7.5 mg) - 6.9, 7.5

I'm just keeping this thread alive in case it is useful to someone in a similar position...

Stuck at 7.5 mg this week. I had planned to go up by 0.05 ml (to 8.1 mg) but I ate and drank badly the day before (night out) so wasn't feeling 100% on injection day (Thu). WI day is Sat. Going to focus on making more positive changes in my diet/food prep and upping the exercise instead. I've got another 7.5 mg pen after this one and then I have a 10 mg pen, I'll just take whatever dose I think is appropriate out of them though but clearly more cost effective to start buying 10 mg now.

Pen 1 (2.5 mg) - 2.5, 2.5, 2.5, 2.5, 3.2
Pen 2 (5.0 mg) - 4.2, 4.2, 4.6, 2.5, 4.2
Pen 3 (5.0 mg) - 4.2, 4.4, 3.3, 3.75, 3.75
Pen 4 (5.0 mg) - 3.75, 4.2, 4.2, 4.2, 4.2
Pen 5 (5.0 mg) - 4.2, 4.5, 4.6, 4.6, 4.6
Pen 6 (5.0 mg) - 4.6, 5.0, 5.0, 5.0, 5.0
Pen 7 (5.0 mg) - 5.8, 5.8, 6.3, 6.7
Pen 8 (7.5 mg) - 6.9, 7.5, 7.5

Hope everyone else is doing ok?

Final post from me (under this username anyway), as leaving MN for a while (wasting far too much time under many usernames!).

Regret not going up again now but hey ho, I did what I thought was right! Definitely will next week. Weight coming off now that I am making better decisions though and just trying harder. Good luck all!

Good luck! Thanks for sharing how you progressed.

After almost 5 months taking a reduced dose because of severe anxiety symptoms in my first week, I've finally moved up to 2.5mg today!

Feeling a little apprehensive, but hoping it will help restart my weight loss as things have definitely stalled the last 8 weeks.

I’m pleased I found this thread. I have also been micro dosing. I did 2 weeks at 1.25, then 3 weeks at 1.67. For my sixth shot I tried 50 clicks of the pen so just over 2 and I wonder if it was too much for me as I feel really wiped out and have had symptoms of low blood sugar. I think I am going to go back to 1.67 (40 clicks) next jab.
I have lost 18.5 lb in the past five and a half weeks. It gives me the willpower I need to avoid binge eating
. @crumbsonmyface i hope 2.5 is good for you and that you get some good results.

I'm 8 weeks in now and still hovering around 1.25mg and 1.6mg. I started at 2.5mg and it was too overwhelming. Even 1.6mg feels like a lot. It's working though and I'm losing so am happy to stay low until it stops working.

Thanks @Finallydoingit24
So far the 2.5mg has been great, no issues since my jab on Thursday.
When is your next jab? Are you thinking of going back down slightly

My next jab is Monday. I think I will go back down to 40 clicks so 1.67 as I’m not liking the dizziness I’m getting this time around. I checked on my jab app and the concentration of the drug in my body this week is the highest it’s been since I’ve started and I think my body is reacting a bit to it. Hopefully lowering the dose a bit will sort it out.

I didn't mange to stay away from MN for long 😳!

Finally managed to creep my way back up to a dose that is right.

I took the dose on Thu evening and I was very supressed yesterday - definitely wouldn't want to be more suppressed. I heaved a lot this morning (to the point of being slightly sick - but fine after a few minutes) when I got up so that is my sign that I am close to being over-supressed so to stick now. I will remain a sub-doser (when/if I need to go up again) - 9.5 mg not enough but 10 mg right on the edge of too much.

It is also an 'official' dose (10 mg) so hopefully I can stick here a while and actually lose some weight (1.1 kg this week - I think mainly due to not eating much yesterday but I'll take that after weeks of basically STS). Unfortunately taking this dose from a 7.5 mg pen at the moment, so not the most cost efficient but never mind. I've got the next two pens already.

Pen 1 (2.5 mg) - 2.5, 2.5, 2.5, 2.5, 3.2
Pen 2 (5.0 mg) - 4.2, 4.2, 4.6, 2.5, 4.2
Pen 3 (5.0 mg) - 4.2, 4.4, 3.3, 3.75, 3.75
Pen 4 (5.0 mg) - 3.75, 4.2, 4.2, 4.2, 4.2
Pen 5 (5.0 mg) - 4.2, 4.5, 4.6, 4.6, 4.6
Pen 6 (5.0 mg) - 4.6, 5.0, 5.0, 5.0, 5.0
Pen 7 (5.0 mg) - 5.8, 5.8, 6.3, 6.7
Pen 8 (7.5 mg) - 6.9, 7.5, 7.5, 8.1, 8.8
Pen 9 (7.5 mg) - 9.5, 10.0
Pen 10 (10.0 mg) -
Pen 11 (12.5 mg) -

I can't believe I am on 10 mg now and was tolerating going up so quickly given how long it took me to make it from 2.5 mg to 5 mg!

Nice to see you back @SubDoserII ! I guess I'm just curious about why you went through and past 7.5mg so quickly, considering your history. In hindsight would you have stayed there a bit longer, or was it just not working for you?

I've been on 8.83mg for about 10 shots, but will probably move up to 9mg next week as that's how the clicks will work due to a different strength pen.

I've been on MJ since July, so could easily have been on 15mg for a long time already. However, I'm taking it every 5 or 6 days now, as I feel it works better for me.

In case anyone is interested in the comparison, I attach a GLP1 plotter graph (pink) that I made in December showing what my estimated levels would have been according to the official dosing, with moving up every 4 weeks. The peaks would have been almost 25mg and lows about 9mg.

My Shotsy graph (blue) up to March estimates my current peaks are approx 14.5mg with lows of about 8.5mg. So, although I'm taking it more frequently, my levels are a lot lower and more even without the dramatic peaks and troughs, which I prefer.

I can hardly believe I've lost 84lbs, 36% weight loss and at BMI 24 from 38. I need to lose a bit more, ideally 15-20lb, as still overweight according to mixed ethnicity, but can almost see maintenance on the horizon, hopefully within the next few months.

I hope everyone is doing well.

I'm here plodding away, only half a stone away from maintenance now and on 3.5mg. I had toyed with increasing to 3.75 or maybe 4 as the food noise was starting to creep back, but I realised I was still losing 1lb a week and that seems plenty when I'm so close to goal now. I've also noticed hair loss so started taking some supplements.

My main concern now is how to achieve maintenance when I get there. I have a call booked with Oushk in about 6 weeks time. But I know they can't recommend sub dosing, and being on such a low dose doesn't leave me with many options to titrate down. I'll possibly go down a little and make a conscious effort to eat more calories each day. I'm averaging 1200-1300 and losing 1lb a week, but fitting in 500 more calories seems a lot - a whole extra meal! I'll have to spread it throughout the day. Nice problem to have

Hi @Swissrollover - nice to see you too! Amazing that your BMI is 24 now! Well done! 💫Hope you continue to lose well and get to your goal without issue!

It wasn't working at 7.5 mg - well it was for maintenance but not for weight loss. It is always my goal to be on the lowest possible dose that works for weight loss - I'll stay on 10 mg for as long as that works and then go up in smaller increments again until I find the next right dose - that could be 10.5 mg or 13 mg I'm not fixed on getting to an 'official dose'. It is a titration after all - and it is best to go drop-wise near the end point just as if it was an acid-base or redox titration. Pity the end point keeps changing though! I won't rattle up quicker than 2.5 mg/4 weeks even if it isn't working.

I made the right call this time I think - glad I didn't stick at 7.5 mg, my body is tolerating it better now and I need to adapt to that. I stuck at the 4.6 mg/5.0 mg too long before that really. Probably. Who knows! Just happy that after all these weeks I seem to have hit a dose that feels like it is working again, and it makes me feel more motivated towards trying harder from the conscious end of things too especially now spring is here.

@Cocoaone - how exciting to be just half a stone away from goal now! I guess you can titrate down like you titrated up and either buy 5 mg or 2.5 mg depending on where you are on that path. Is it your intention to come off it completely by titrating off or maintain with MJ for a while at least?

I've only lost 40 lbs in 40 weeks (not much of that has been in the last few months though) but it has made a massive difference to how I feel - not bad really considering I am at the later stages of perimenopause. Need to lose another 40 lbs though - good job I've mentally given myself two years.

I increased from 2.5mg to 5mg in increments, including four weeks on 3.75mg to allow the levels to stabilise before moving up. It worked really well, with good suppression and satiety but minimal side effects.

The first three doses of 5mg were fine but the fourth has brought some unpleasant side effects which I hadn't experienced before.

I don't know whether to push through and try another dose of 5mg (but this time being much more cautious about what I eat on days 0-2) or whether to reduce it slightly (I'm using a 7.5mg pen so could do 35 clicks rather than 40).

That's a tricky one @JunoRoma - I've always gone with the cautious approach and dropped down a bit but whether or not that was the best thing to do is a different matter. How long until you need to inject again? I guess you could always try a different approach and leave it an extra day before injecting but stay at the same dose. I would definitely drop down if the symptoms are still around when injection day arrives again.

Been thinking more about injecting every 5 or 6 days when 10 mg stops working rather than going up @Swissrollover . I like that idea...

Make myself pre-prep healthy go to snacks and salads this afternoon. Genuinely prefer healthy food (most of the time) - it is the planning/prep/habits/consistency I struggle with. I've got to nail this!

@SubDoserII I've been injecting on Wednesday evenings. The unpleasant side effects lasted for about 12-18 hours in total, from Thursday evening to Saturday morning.
I don't think it was a virus: I didn't feel systemically unwell, and the symptoms included malodorous burps, which I've never had in my life before.
As you say, increasing the time between doses would also be an option.

@SubDoserII I can't remember if you have any extra pens, as dosing more often might cause a problem with how frequently you need to order, although it could help with using the 5th dose.

I have some extra pens and use a smaller dose than the pen, so it actually works out OK for me. So far, I've stuck with using a pen within 30 days, but I'm not against considering up to 35 days (8 doses taken every 5 days), as I personally always keep the pens refrigerated. Not advice though, just my thoughts.