I absolutely hate having two children

[letshavepink]

Separately, they are great children and very enjoyable to be around and I love them. I’m a lovely mum to them individually.

Together they are fucking awful. They seem to bring out the absolute worst in one another, fizz one another up into unmanageable excitement and stupidity, have opposite tendencies and qualities (so one is charging ahead and one is lagging behind; one goes to bed later than I’d like but sleeps quite late in the morning while the other is the opposite) and generally are just thoroughly unpleasant to be around when sibling is present.

I’ve tried to address it of course but little if anything has changed.

Truthfully, I feel so unhappy and hate life as it is. I’m overwhelmed and fed up of noise, mess and shouting. My home is tumultuous and dysfunctional. I can’t give my best to either child and always end up resorting to anger because unfortunately the techniques pushed in books and websites have no impact on them whatsoever; they ignore them and me, and then I feel awful. I feel like we’re going to have a terrible relationship.

That is an extreme solution!!!!!

Is there any possibility the second one picks up on this sentiment and copies the older one as a result? You might want to speak to a child psychotherapist.

as a minor and superficial measure, would you get some Loop earplugs to at least reduce the effect of the noise of the mania on you? They reduce the decibels without making you unable to hear so really helpful for noise situations which fray the nerves

@WhatNextImScared it is hard to know. I don’t wish one of them away but when I look at friends with just one their lives seem so calm and to be honest enjoyable.

Like you, I feel that my eldest doesn’t get anywhere near enough one to one time. He’s a bit behind at school and I’m doing my best to help him but then the two year old comes crashing in and he starts with the uncontrollable giggle and that’s that.

I’m not totally clear what you mean @Ecstaticmotion . That my two year old is picking up on the fact I don’t enjoy parenting them both and is silly and wired as a result? And needs to see a psychologist? Or I do?

Same here - I try to do it after the youngest has gone to be (mine are 8 and 5) but by then she’s too tired to concentrate. Plus I work over 35 hours a week too so I’m exhausted every evening. I need to find a solution to this before she goes to secondary as she’s the kind of child that will need a lot of scaffolding to get homework etc done.

Are they getting enough time outdoors to run around and be silly? I think all kids need that at those ages, but especially boys, and especially especially when there's more than one boy. I definitely get what you mean about being manic. I've found any rules about how to behave inside have to be balanced with an outlet for their energy. I mean like getting them physically exhausted. My DH takes our DC out for runs with him (from about 5 years and up) as well as lots of playground visits and lots of playing sport. It is harder with two but it sounds like they're going to be good friends as they age.

Did you grow up with siblings op?

I could have written this. I’ve 6 year old twins, and all they do is wind each other up. I can’t leave the room without a squabble starting, which turns physical.

Everyone says “oh twins, lucky you, you can leave them to play together”. As if! They compete over everything and always want the same toy at the same time.

I’m a sole mum, so never get 1:1 time with either child, so they just see the annoyed, shouty, exasperated mum.

I think you are overthinking normal kid stuff, and really need to re frame. They are meant to run around and be silly. The fact they get along is great!

Mine are exactly the same @letshavepink and the same ages. Mine love each other and don't generally fight outside of typical sibling stuff but the constant mania when they are together is infuriating! I find its somehow even worse to deal with when we have spent time with them individually because the second they come together it starts again!! I don't have a solution but I do get it 💐

@WhatNextImScared that’s our problem too. I don’t know what the solution is: ideally the younger one would leave us alone but she two so …

@Wearealldoingourbest I would say so. Ds is in reception so still very play based (this will change in y1 I know.) They spend a lot of time in the garden; I take them out a lot.

@PilatesAndLattes yes, I have a brother.

I identify with that @Apollonia1

@LameBorzoi it isn’t nice silliness though. It’s the sort of silliness that’s wild, where at the breath of an ant someone is going to burst into tears.

Thanks @Alltheusefulitems , it’s a relief it isn’t just me.

I had to check the username to see whether this was a post I wrote a while ago! You’ve described my experience. Together - beyond chaos! I can’t even describe it, so fizzy it’s like they both are acting like they are desperate for the toilet, dithering, falling over, making bad decisions!
Alone they are calm. Together it’s just manic. And I hate it. Also, any parenting strategy doesn’t work - the amount of times I say (shout!) ‘why does it always have to reach the point I shout!!’
Mine are 9 (girl) and 7 (boy). Last night during dinner my son managed to drop his dinner on the floor and get yogurt in his hair - all from being silly.

I think we’re the strictest parents from those I know, if we relax it’s even worse. It’s like we’re running a military camp with untrainable soldiers!! Sometimes I start the day thinking ‘today I will be calm and let them get their energy out without criticising’ but by the time they’re climbing lampposts on a walk somewhere (maybe after running headfirst into it!) all my good intentions go out the window.

I suspect ADHD (it’s in the family) and that they’re just massive sensory seekers.

Well, it felt good to get that out 😂

I’d have a third. Then you will find that two of them will get on at any given opportunity and it’s only a fight when all 3 are together

To add to my post, mine don’t really fight, they get on great so it’s not squabbling.
I think it’s like when they say don’t get 2 puppies from the same litter as they will be untrainable. They’re like 2 untrainable overexcited puppies!

I have one DC, she is now an adult. I have never regretted having only one and it was a choice.

I always wonder why people have children so close together. Is it to get it done? Or feelings that children need someone to play with?

I have a sibling close in age to me, we didn’t get on as children and are now mostly NC. She doesn’t like me, I came along 2 years after she was born and stole her thunder. I get it.

My daughter has 2, one 15 and one 8. They are wonderful together. They do fight and wind each other up, but it is so much easier to tell a 15 year old to leave an 8 year old alone, than a 5 year old and a 3 year old.

Children need space to grow up as individuals as well as siblings.

OP I really sympathise. Very similar story with my 2 when they decide to be silly but they’re a bit older so it isn’t all the time. For what it’s worth, it definitely improves as they get older, a bit easier when littlest is 4, then again at 5 etc. My two together sometimes drive me utterly insane and I feel like I could honestly hit them (i don’t ever actually do so, it’s just how I’m feeling!) but they’re love each other so much I don’t ever regret having 2

Mine are the same, it’s sibling rivalry. I have 5 children the older ones are 22 and 18 they are just starting to like each other. The younger ones are 10 and then twin 6 year olds. They tear through the house like a tornado. The mythical twins you see on Instagram are probably only children or it’s a snapshot of a manic day! I only just about cope and have a lot of family support and medication! Have you got any adult support?

I only have one because my sibling and I never got on and I couldn't inflict that on my own child. I think in part our personalities are very different and partly because we are too close in age (22 months) so I was never just me from being a toddler, he got shoehorned into everything. However, my mum did try to give us 1-1 time and we both had an excellent relationship with her. Yours are still very young, so things may change.

Mine were like that growing up. I used to envy others who had clode families. But as young adults they have a remarkably good relationship.

Do your best to maintain calm and set boundaries. Give them incentives to get along and be explicit in the behaviour you want to see. Role play it for them with your partner if need be. Eg - this is what it looks like to be kind etc. It will make everyone laugh but it’s a good way to show and reinforce what you want. Reward every small win and don’t create a narrative that they start to see as their story eg- “these two can’t get along”.

look after yourself to help yourself have the patience you will need for a bumpy time

@Avocadoo i’ve wondered about my older one having adhd but would it show only round his sibling / certain children? Surely not … he’s lovely alone and with some friends. I don’t know.

And yes to strategies not working. You try to be calm but they can’t even fucking hear you!

I don’t know if people think they are being funny with ‘have a third’ - if it’s a joke it isn’t funny, please stop. If it’s serious - we can’t afford a third, I don’t want a third, we don’t have space for a third and even if none of that was a problem my age (46 in August) almost certainly is.

@MNLurker1345 there are two years eight months between mine so it’s not hugely close. In my case my age was a factor, but I’ve seen a lot of posts with people with older children and then struggle as well. I do wonder if some people are just well suited to life with one and I suspect I might be.

Thanks @Goodmorningeveryone26 . I just find life so enjoyable with one and so stressful and overwhelming with two that it’s difficult not to let regrets creep in.

I don’t really have any support so that of course impacts on my having two.

I have an acquaintance with twin boys who are very different and this is what they do. And they attend separate secondaries which are also very different.

Yours are really young though. I've been told the book Siblings Without Rivalry is good.

It's a long game. My sister had to work very hard with her two but she succeeded and at 18 and 20 they are close.

Mine were similar and they’re still chalk and cheese personalities. They are a joy separately, but the real parenting challenges were in their joint dynamic.

Do you play with them? Short games with structure, clear rules and fair outcomes. Monopoly Junior is great at that age. Orchard games have good ones too.

Have a look for 1960s era books on activities to do with dc for games ideas. You can set up competitive games to be cooperative. First instance, bean bags and a chalk target: they win an ice pop if they can reach a joint score. Set up spots for them to throw from - nearer for the 3 year old, and a little further for the 5 year old because “his arms are longer” (those distinctions make dc feel the differences and advantages of their age difference), encourage the 5 year old to use their advanced skills (it might be identifying the numbers, or adding up, or counting out each score from a bundle of sticks).

Play with them sometimes (letting them both be better than you, changes the focus from each other) but at other times be involved but outside the game like in the bean bag toss.

I have loads of other tips if you want. It isn’t an easy dynamic and it won’t resolve by itself.

I absolutely can relate to this. I have 3 and that certainly doesn’t help, so not sure what those pps are on about! What has actually helped (and I’m not advising this as a strategy but it just happened and has changed things!) is that when we were on holiday last year and all three of them were being absolutely atrocious I actually had a complete sobbing meltdown in front of them. I was so at my wit’s end. It absolutely shocked them. I told them I was utterly miserable and hated how they behaved. They were cruel and vicious to each other, they had no respect for the family, I was embarrassed by their behaviour and I just wanted to go home. They have rarely seen me cry, and I’m afraid I was very clear that THEY had made me this upset, that I had worked hard and saved to enjoy this holiday and their selfish, spiteful behaviour had ruined it, and that they were all making themselves and I utterly miserable. Not screaming and shouting but wracking sobs. That really jolted them out of it, and I think they realised for the first time how they were actually behaving.

Obviously this wasn’t planned, and yours are too young for this to sink in, but if you ever did explode one day, as I did, it isn’t the end of the world (my youngest was 6 at the time). I wasn’t proud of losing it, but there comes a point when children need to realise that their behaviour impacts other people and that unacceptable behaviour has consequences. They wouldn’t behave like this at school so it’s not like they don’t know what is/isn’t acceptable. It’s more like they had really entrenched negative patterns of behaviour when together which needed to be reset.

They have learnt to give each other more space, which essentially is the problem. If things get too much I enforce 10 minutes in their rooms to cool down. No exceptions, everyone in their rooms playing quietly. If they come out and start up again, back they all go again. Exhausting at first, but essentially they have to feel the consequence is real and non-negotiable.

Having children with different personalities is very challenging, especially when they bring out the worst in each other. Things may get easier when your youngest starts school, as they become more used to routines and expectations. Sending strength, it’s so hard.

At least they like each other, that's pretty great honestly.

I completely agree with the suggestion in the penultimate paragraph here. Sometime physically separating them even for a couple of minutes, can help calm things down. I remember at this age I had unrealistic expectations about listening from the 2 year old in a silly mood. I had to take his hand and take him to a different place. No amount of verbalising would get through.