body shape and weights

[BarrelOfOtters]

OK, I'm quite new to this. Started a 3 day a week weights programme. It's 12 people a time and free weights. I'm in my 50s and what I'm noticing is that a lot of the women who have been going a while and are my age can lift an approximate fuckton, Their body shape is frequently a big tummy.

I'm interested in getting rid of the tummy and gettng stronger and not particularly gettng muscly.

So these women are very strong, I'm impressed and a little intimidated, but look fat basically.

What's the best routine for getting rid of the fat....

It's more about your diet than exercise. Ultimately to lose fat you need to be in a calorie deficit and have enough protein in your diet. You can't spot reduce fat. So you can't just aim to lose fat from your tummy, it'll come off all over.

People can train to be strong and lift loads but unless their diet is in check they can still be fat.

It's very difficult for women to get super muscly so I wouldn't worry too much about that.

Weight lifting doesn't give you a big tummy. I don't have one and never had. However you can build muscle on your abs and have body fat on top of that.

The other trick lol is to build your shoulders and quads so your waist looks smaller.

I agree it's diet too. I'm in a calorie deficit and starting to see abs.

If you want to lose fat off your stomach you'll need to reduce your calorie intake. If you want to get stronger, you need to have a higher than usual calorie intake. It's very difficult to do both, and most people can't do both effectively.
Complete beginners can show strength gains while on a calorie deficit but that's usually more about CNS adaptations than because they're putting on muscle.

The thing most people want to do is cut calories and lose the fat. In the long run though, that can be difficult to sustain

The most likely sustainable way of doing things would be to focus on getting stronger and not worrying about weight yet. Eat enough to fuel your workouts. As you build muscle (don't worry you won't look noticeably muscly) the amount of calories you burn every day (is just by existing) will increase. That means I'm future it'll be much easier for you to calorie reduce. 'dieting' on 1800 or 2000 calories a day is a lot, lot easier and sustainable than it is if you're having to drop to 1200 or 1400 to lose fat.

It's likely the women in your class aren't bothered about losing weight and are focused on strength. It's easier to get super strong if you allow a bit of extra padding, that's a different goal and it's fine.

I find this post really confusing. What is the connection between the women in your gym being 'fat' and your own goals? Are you concerned getting strong will make you 'fat'? Or that you want to use it to not be 'fat' and are wondering why they are? Or you wonder why they are in a gym if they are 'fat'? Or something else?

Being 'fat' or not has nothing to do with strength. For example if you look at powerlifters there are weight classes for everyone, some of the super strong lifters are 'fat'. Some are also tiny. As others posters have said if you don't want to be 'fat' nutrition is key.

It may well be the strong women you see are focused on being strong rather than meeting society's body image standards so don't want to cut weight as that limits strength gains. It might be lifting has given them the confidence to give zero fucks about it. It might be they are trying to reduce fat in a slow and sustainable way. Who knows. It doesn't impact on you and your goals though.

Just be aware too that women in their 50s post menopause will have a shift in fat distribution. So fat that was previously stored on thighs will now be stored on stomach.

It’s still possible to have a flat stomach but will take tweaking calories.

Weightlifting won't make muscles magically appear - ask any body builder. It's hard to build muscle and will take a looong time.

You can't burn fat in specific areas. It reduces everywhere.

Abs are made in the kitchen/you can't burn off a bad diet.

The fastest way to burn fat is weightlifting BUT you must do something you enjoy. For example, if you can happily go for a walk that burns x calories every day but would only weight train once a week, the walking has more benefit... if that makes sense.

Hope that answers most of your questions.

It's pretty much all diet to get rid of fat round the middle. I do feel like heavy lifting makes it harder in some ways because if you're trying to get stronger and are really pushing it in gym then you often get hungry and need a lot of discipline not to eat more to compensate. I have a fair bit of fat there at moment but eating in a strict enough deficit to lose it is v v hard without sacrificing strength gains and I'd rather be strong because it's more useful than being skinny.

Doing heavy back squats has given me abs of steel (I squat my bodyweight of 70kg). So you don't need to carry a lot of weight to lift weights, although some people say "It takes weight to lift weight" and I can definitely lift more when I'm heavier. But you can be lean & lift heavy.

Maybe those other people aren't bothered about 'looking fat' because their fitness is focused on other things.

Absolutely true, mass moves mass. I try to be lean but love food so am something like Eddie Hall at the minute when I'm in a successful deficit, I'm still strong but significantly less powerful.

Do you...think lifting weights has made them fat??
I am fat round the middle and lift heavy weights. The two things have a slight correlation in that I have a naturally muscular frame and a big appetite so run to fat, but in every other respect they are unconnected.
lift weights to get strong and healthy. Have a caloric deficit to lose fat. You can do both at once, or only do one, but they don't have much to do with each other in reality.

"lift weights to get strong and healthy. Have a caloric deficit to lose fat. You can do both at once, or only do one, but they don't have much to do with each other in reality."

Thank you - I think that was the reality check I needed that I need to get my diet in order!

Fat loss is all to do with calories. You can do 1000 situps a day and have the most amazing 6 pack but if your calories and fat % are too high, no one will ever see it. Please dont mistake any exercise with being able to focus on specific areas of fat loss. It doesn't work like that.

So you have started a weights programme. Good for you. Do you enjoy it? This is the single most important factor to discuss. Not whether its suitable for losing weight on your tummy. DO YOU ENJOY IT?

If you do then you have cracked 50% of the puzzle. It doesn't really matter if you lift and lift and lift, you wont tone up unless its done in conjunction with a structure to your diet.

Let me explain. If you do weights whilst in a negative carlorie intake you will not grow muscles. You may maintain muscles and you may, subject to protein intake be able to define your muscles but you will not get 'big'. You will have to work hard because you will also struggle with energy levels in calories deficit but it is entirely possible to enjoy weight training in a calorie deficit whilst losing weight and maintaining muscle. I know, ive lost 20kg in 13months and i can now deadlift almost 2 x my own bodyweight. Once i get down to my real target weight my plan is to then go to maintenance calories for a while and see what happens. Only once i am comfortable with that will i experiment with building muscle and increasing calories above maintenance. By then i will probably be 2 years down the road and have a full knowledge of what i can and cant do with my body.

My advise is look at your diet. Work out maintenance and get Myfitnesspal app and log your foods. Aim to be 300cal below maintenance whilst doing your weights. You should be able to do learn and increase your weights whilst dropping some body fat over a prolonged period. After 12 months my bet is you will look different, know a hell of a lot about how your body reacts and be able to put it all into practice whenevr you need it going forward.

it is entirely possible to enjoy weight training in a calorie deficit whilst losing weight and maintaining muscle.

Yes it’s entirely possible: it’s called “body recomposition “ or body recomp. You can Google it - and there are quite a few decent trainers on YouTube talking about this as well.

While it is true that you can maintain muscle while on a calorie deficit, it's very difficult to build muscle while on a calorie deficit. And if you haven't trained before, it's unlikely you'll have a lot of muscle (assuming you're not a genetic outlier!)

So it is likely to be best for you to focus on getting stronger/building muscle first - 6 months if you can - and only then, start cutting calories. Otherwise you run the risk of getting smaller but not necessarily being happy with your shape, and also finding the level of calories you need is very low.

For example, before I weight trained, in order to lose weight I had to eat less than 1300 calories a day.
These days I lose weight on 1800. 1900-2000 if I'm active. You can imagine which one is easier to stick to!

In my experience a lot of heavier women are good at weight/strength training because they’re heavy, not the other way round! Also gyms/classes that are strength focused are a more body shape inclusive environment than say spin or barre, so these women have found an exercise they can excel at in an context that doesn’t make them feel like ‘the fat one’, so they enjoy it and keep coming and keep improving. My strength to weight ratio is decent but I’m in absolute awe of the numbers my bigger gym friends can lift.

I was reading a research article on this yesterday, and their data showed that lighter lifters lift more as a proportion of their bodyweight than heavier lifters. It was one piece of research and has lots of other findings too, but I found that interesting.

I do CrossFit and there's a mix of sizes and fitness levels. When we pair up, people always assume I can lift loads because I'm quite toned and look fit. Like @RayKray says, I can probably lift more as a proportion of my body weight but the heavier folks in the class usually lift heavier than me.