Lifting support thread 2

[RayKray]

Just noticed I was the last to post on the lifting support thread as it went to 1k so here's another.

Original thread intro post here from
@Work2live

"Thought I’d start this thread as a few people thought it’d be a good idea.

"It might be a nice place to support each other and talk about lifting in general, ask for tips and advice on workouts, how to get enough protein etc.

"All levels very much welcome, from complete newbies to those who’ve been weightlifting for years! 💪🏼"

Thanks @RayKray , I think I doubt how far I can go because I've lifted weights on and off for a long time, so part of me thinks my 'beginner gains' are long gone. But then I haven't trained at this volume or consistency for a long time, and other things have come together for me (better sleep, better diet) so I think actually I'm unlocking newbie potential that I hadn't done first time round!

I realised that my recent PB was 1.5x bodyweight so that felt a bit more 'real' somehow, and I really hope I can keep going. I will always be comprised by having multiple goals at once which often conflict, but having the garage gym means the weight training is easier to be consistent.

That's well exciting about your progress. Remind me when your next comp is? Also curious to know how long you've been powerlifting specifically?

@Proteinpud tbh I never get the beginner gains thing. Sure when you very start you go from nothing to something pretty fast, but progress can keep going. Perhaps it's overemphasised because people don't all seek out good programming, or can't sustain working hard, or get bored so lots of people tail off. It gets harder so people don't make the gains, rather than the gains not being possible. But with really focused programming (which is never going to be for everyone) gains continue. I have friends who to me are next level, and they still make gains, but they also do SBD on repeat all the time. They share their training on insta and that's pretty much all they're doing (plus some accessories)

I've picked a random example off open powerlifting of a masters lifter who competes internationally now. You can see the continual gains. That's the pattern you pretty much always see, progression every competition. But not huge leaps.

www.openpowerlifting.org/u/genevievecollins

For sure it gets to where progression is small amounts of kg.

My deadlift is double bodyweight, which in the powerlifting world at my level isn't bad but in no way unusual. But that's single minded programming. I can't run, do cool cali things, do a hyrox or anything.

To answer your q, strength training just over 2 years, SBD proper 18 months, powerlifting less than a year. And next comp is a bit over a month away. So in the powerlifting world I'm a newbie, and I'm sure my gains will slow down. (And then I'll get older and go backwards but I don't want to think about that one)

Coincidentally I was just reading something about novice in powerlifting terms, and it was saying it's not to do with weights or time, it's where the amount you lift as a proportion of your potential capacity is low enough that you're not fatiguing your body beyond recovery. Thats when you can keep upping the weight. Once you're then a higher proportion of potential capacity it's harder as you fatigue more. So you have to programme differently rather than just keep upping the weight. Which reminded me of the concept of newbie gains.

That's really interesting @RayKray , thank you. Tbh when I first started doing weights I was so weak - I don't mean that in a negative way, just factual, I was small, skinny and not naturally geared towards lifting - that I didn't focus on the newbie stuff because whereas I'd see peers adding weight each week that was a lot slower for me. So I always focused on technique or time under tension, or learning a skill not just piling weight on. And with capoeira and jiu jitsu my eyes are always going to be drawn to different things (mobility goals, explosive strength, grip strength) not just lifting numbers. But tbh as long as it's all beneficial in some respect I'm not concerned that it might limit other goals, it's not optimum progression but I'm here for the journey not the outcome.

I didn't realise that's how long you've been powerlifting for, I would have assumed longer! Shows how well you can do when you're focused and consistent, and like you say, proper programming.

@Proteinpud exactly! It amazes me what you can do in a short space of time if it's your focus. And I agree re the journey - I'm just lucky I enjoy the powerlifting training process so it's no hardship at all to do it.

This was so interesting @RayKray!

Really interesting @RayKray , thank you! That style of training clearly really suits you, wow!

@Proteinpud I hear you about the journey and less than optimum progression. It might be different for me if I lived near a really good specialist cali place (there is one in east london but too far for me) where I could follow their programming and focus that way. But I am using a small local gym that happens to have some slightly random good cali classes but it does change all the time, shared PT in a park with different bars that is a bit weather-dependent, and a local boxing cub. So I have to work out what suits me and piece a programme together. I do progress but not on everything at once, and it is slow.

This is the thing I was reading. I don't know much about the source but it does say it was printed in T Nation previously

https://startingstrength.com/article/whowantsstobeeanoviceeyoudo?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR3jkOr5CFQeYzrSC3eBBAd5WUb0QjblftRUVjTBdBeoRIyOC8OpWxnwHIIaemAXEBmGg-Yp17I1PSzxF3wRyQXi-DNwVQ7RVBGh2vuRP6COlMaKTitZxQNALT-h0dCPa4Mc0qCsuBSvs4dOo5uesT#:~:text=A%20novice%20is%2C%20by%20definition,a%20short%20period%20of%20time

@MsMartini I think that's it for most of us, if we're in it for the long haul. Choice of what is available locally, what we can get to & afford, and that's before considering all the other things that affect consistency when you've got a life to run.

For me it's compromised more so by wanting multiple things - eg right now I want to improve my deadlift, but I'm also wanting to do cardio for cycling stamina because it's summer and I want to get outdoors. So my training is never going to be 'optimum' for one thing. I try and cycle through different goals so it's not too scattergun. I see it a bit like diet, I could aim for optimum for perfect health and be very bored, or get a balance of optimum and fun!

@proteinpud, yep exactly.

For me the what is available locally makes me more likely to want to do other things (for me, boxing mainly atm). If instead of my little local gym yard that happens to have decent if slightly random cali classes with instructors who may or may not be about the travel the world teaching in a space that may or may not be about to have building works, I lived near the big outfit with multiple planned and co-ordinated sessions a week, big indoor rigs and space, reasonably secure future.....I might just go for that. I really enjoy group exercise as part of my programme so like to have something in my back pocket as it were that I can ramp up and down as needed....I also find I can train more days a week this way and as I enjoy it so much and the structure suits me, I don't mind the possible performance compromise. Completely see how it can be the other way for some people though. I find all this so interesting.

That's a good point actually, eg I have found it more natural to increase my weight sessions and keep that consistent because I can train at home whenever I'm free rather than drive 45mins to a class at a fixed time. If I was travelling to the gym but had classes more locally it would probably be the reverse!

I'm excited about the new SBTD programme, with perfect timing it's 'Deadlift Queen'! The last cycle was the first full cycle I'd done and it was more hypertrophy focused. Although I enjoyed the change I'm excited to be back to a full body split and training each big lift twice a week. Did the first session today and followed it with 40mins on the stationary bike (zwift) and now I can't feel my legs.

Yayyyy @Proteinpud , great use of a wet BH 😂. Love Deadlift Queen - we have several on this wonderful thread.

Powerlifting has a high attrition rate I believe. Lots compete once and never again. I think for some people they don't like being on the platform, it is a bit intense to be watched with lights on you, and scrutinised by 3 refs (I love it!). But I think also people get bored with the training cos it is repetitive. You're basically left with people who like repetition and being a bit anal about technique, and that includes a lot of neurodivergence. One reason I'd not like things like CrossFit is because of all the change and different things you do, and surprises. I can't do simultaneous goals. Well I suppose I have 3! - a heavier squat, bench AND deadlift.

Enjoy the deadlifts @Proteinpud

Yes @RayKray , that makes such sense and I can see how that focus could be so satisfying. Very interesting discussion.

Ah @RayKray that post resonates for me! I'm ND, only found out a year ago and didn't suspect it before then. Not sure why it's different but since finding out I've felt more comfortable with sticking to my routine, giving myself 'permission' to be more rigid than most people. But that made me laugh about CrossFit because I did it for a while in lockdown (local gym did outdoor classes) and though I did quite enjoy the endorphins I found the lack of planning in the workouts infuriating, WODs are just made up with no rationale or link to the previous or future workouts. Drove me potty that so little thought went into it despite the trainers clearly being very dedicated.

@MsMartini has your elbow issue cleared up? Meant to ask if you'd worked out what was going on.

@Proteinpud , your description made me laugh too 😀.

Elbow - think it is golder's elbow - I've remembered I had it last year on the other side and used Tom Morrison videos. It is in a very specific place, not spreading down the arm at all, and no sharp pain, so I am hoping I can cautiously train through it. I am mainly feeling it in everyday life, twisting lids off jars etc, rather than in the gym.....

I tentatively did a few RDLs with the bar yesterday and one (just one!) deadlift rep at 50kg to see how my wrist would cope. And it was fine! Actually the loading and unloading of the bar was harder!! Hoping to start putting some barbell bench and deadlifts back in pretty soon. I also did some fairly heavy dumbell work and it felt OK. Hopefully well on the mend!!

@Proteinpud me too! Lifting made me realise I'm also ND and knowing means being so much kinder to myself and letting me be the person I need to be. As much as I don't like the whole 'superpower' narrative it sure is for lifting training.

@RayKray 'be the person I need to be' articulates it well. I've had other people say things like 'why would you do a class that's every Tuesday and Thursday, what if you want to do something different on a Tuesday?' Or taking it to the extreme of 'it's unhealthy to do something that will cause you stress if you can't commit to it'. Whereas for me the routine is comforting, not an added pressure.

@everycowandagain that's great news!

@MsMartini in my experience the issue is never in the gym, always outside of it. I used to have wrist problems and the absolute worst was turning a door handle. Gym was never a problem though

That is very interesting about how the routines suit. That applies to me too (not ND afaik) - I really like knowing what I am doing and I love my early evening gym slot, then home for bath😀. I'll vary for important stuff but I think if you want to learn and get better at anything it does take consistency and an easy(ish) way to do that is have fixed, booked times at a local place - for me anyway. No headspace needed. Also, lot of people seem to talk about eg exercise routines being unhealthy or obsessive (and I am not saying they are never that) but no-one says that about going to the pub a few nights a week whereas I prefer the gym and a bit of sets or injury chat!

@everycowandagain yayy, brilliant news. You must be so pleased.

@Proteinpud yeah know what you mean. As you know cali involves a bit of turning and twisting so niggles do creep in (I couldn't risk flags with my elbow say as I rotate) but yes I am hoping to be able to do eg levers and pull ups just taking it slow and making sure I set a comfortable position at the start.

Yep I love and need routine. So that's what I'll have! I nearly put 'the person I want to be' but changed to 'need' as it's not just a want. Trying to pretend it doesn't matter takes a lot of energy. And yes people can be so weird about it. Thankfully at my gym they've been beautiful about it. As are the lifters I know.

And that's great news @everycowandagain . And I hope yours doesn't get worse @MsMartini

I did some gentle bench press today and my wrist felt OK, woop woop!!!

Unfortunately it felt pretty rusty and I have lost some strength, but I should be able to start building it back up again now.

Hopefully I can start to deadlift soon too. And the remaining gym thing that's still painful is a plank position, but that will come back eventually I am sure.

Taking off tight lids from jars is still painful though! 4 weeks in and it's all slowly improving.

Oh that's brilliant @everycowandagain ! It will all come back I am sure.

Really enjoying this right now, so thought I'd leave it here - think it might be good listening for you!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/brand/m001kh5r?partner=uk.co.bbc&origin=share-mobile