Toning up - what's realistic

[NancyBotwinBloom]

I am hoping for some advice about weights, what to lift, how many reps.

How important is diet if your working out? Do I need to have mostly protein?

I want to look strong but not manly.

I have about 4 stone to lose.

I don't want to do shakes. I want to change my diet. I know what's healthy and what isn't but I don't know anything about eating to make my muscles strong and strip fat.

How much cardio should I do weekly?
How many weights days should I have?

What are the best cardio excersises for weight loss?

What are the best excersices for toning muscle?

I have equipment at home I can use if we get locked down again.

I want to see results and I don't want to fuck about with slimming world or fad diets.

Has anyone done the above from being a novice and is now ripped? What's a reasonable time frame to get visible results?

Any advice would be appreciated.

I'm not fussed about what dress size I end up and I'm not bothered about how much I weigh. (I'm a 16 to 18).

I just want to look healthy and fit.

Losing fat and building muscle are separate functions of the body. Bro science will tell you that you cannot do both at the same time. That is bullshit, as I have done it. BUT it is a SLOW process. Faster if you are new to weight training and have a fair bit of fat to lose, so it sounds like you are OK on this front. If you want to do research check out "body recomposition".

I have lost 5 1/2 stone over the last 4 years and been training pretty hard. I am not ripped but have only got more seriously into progressive weight training in the last 18 months or so. Before it was more bodyweight conditioning exercises plus kettlebells and boxing (both of which are excellent for torching calories and giving you a cardio workout that is not boring). I am noticing muscle development now, especially on my back, shoulders and arms) but my body fat percentage is still too high to make me look even vaguely ripped. I'm in my early 50s and contending with peri menopause and don't care if I look ripped, I just want to be strong and feel fit.

Step one is to lose a good chunk of the weight you want to lose while maintaining as much muscle as you can. I can't speak to what exercise you should do, save that it should be something you enjoy and are prepared to work hard at. Personally I go to the gym every day for an hour. I typically do four days of weights, two days of more cardio type stuff and one day of stretching and core work.

To lose the fat but preserve muscle you don't want to be in too high a calorie deficit. Don't aim to lose more than 1lb per week (which is roughly a 500 calorie deficit per day). As you start getting closer to goal I'd reduce the deficit to no more than 250 per day. Make sure you eat plenty of protein. A low-ish carb diet has worked for me, even though bro science says you must feed your muscles with carbs.

If you want to research macros then you will come across all sorts of recommended splits. The one that works for me and keeps my appetite sated is about 40% protein, 40% fat and 20% carbs. Unless you have issues with dietary fat, don't be scared of it. My cholesterol is the best my doctor has ever seen in anyone over the last 15 years, so clearly fat is not my enemy and it may not be yours.

Thank you spodge that is really useful advice.

I'm hoping to have three months off soon and this will become my new job to
Fill in the time previously spent with work.

Or I will just get fatter and lazier.

I will google what you have suggested tonight. The split with protein fat and carb sounds doable for me.

I'm going to start walking tomorrow and continue with that as I enjoy it. Building up to running. I'm going to do couch to five k again as running does shift the weight off me but I've never really enjoyed it.

I think I will start with that and some spinning and weights.

Can I ask how you get 40% protein. I struggle to get 20% even though I'm relatively low carbs.
And also trying to avoid processed foods.

Eggs for breakie or in a salad, protein powder in porridge, chia pudding, smoked salmon, peanut butter, roast chicken thrown in a veggie soup or whatever....these sources of protein help me get to the right macros. Hope this helps.

Each individual will respond differently to food and exercise, so you need to find what works for you.

As a general rule, if you want to lose weight, don't over exercise. Learn the proper form to use weights with light weights, and once you master the movement without compensating with your back, lift as heavy as you can but not for long because working out will increase your appetite even if you don't think so, and your body will perceive the increase activity and maintain reserve.
I am heavier when I work out than when I am on holiday.

I like the athlean videos (the male one, I find the female one totally uninspiring) athleanx.com/video-gallery

Food wise, I believe deep down you know the food that put you where you are. You didn't gain 4 stones by eating celery and tomatoes.

Grab a big plastic bag, go to your fridge and cupboards, and ditch all the processed food you have, from biscuits, rice cakes, savoury, crips, healthy whatever, the drinks, the jars, the sauces, .....
Create a cronometer account for free at cronometer.com, and put your food in the food dairy .
I don't really think in term of macronutrients. I focus on fresh and fibre but I do avoid that contains

• sugar anywhere on the label, no matter the amount
• flour no matter if whole or white
• too much oil, even if healthy

There are these wars now between keto, paleo, longevity, .... everyone is right in the first 6 months, everyone is the same after 6 years.

Whenever you buy a food item, ask yourself, if this is the food that will give you the body you want. I am French and try to follow our rules.

We don't eat in front of telly, we don't eat walking in the street, we don't have food in our handbag or car, and we don't eat children snacks or party food.

I didn't get here by eating celery and tomatoes! No one ever got fat eating salad.

I got here eating buttery crumpets and seeing food as a treat and making unhealthy choices too much for to long.

In a comfortable relationship, meals out drinks out takeaways.

I am trying to change my mindset that these things are not treats, not for my body anyway. They are the opposite. A treat is healthy and is good for me.

Each individual will respond differently to food and exercise, so you need to find what works for you.

This absolutely. Exemplified by the fact that exercise and weight loss absolutely do go hand in hand for me. Exercise reduces appetite for me, increases calorie expenditure (obviously) and (presumably) keeps my BMR higher than it would otherwise be.

Thanks for the protein ideas Dangermouse17. Is the protein in the chia pudding the milk? - so any milk pudding might suffice (leaving aside the sugar issue!).
Not sure I can stomach protein powders or even chia seeds though will check the latter out.
I think I'm just getting bored with eggs, chicken and salmon (fresh not smoked as trying to avoid processed stuff). Peanut butter I love but have avoided so far as assumed it was very calorific and I always have it on bread .... I'll have another look at that too.

@NancyBotwinBloom I think you misunderstood me, I didn't mean to hurt you. What I wanted to say is that often people want to lose weight but still eat the food that got them there.

As you say, it is a change of mindset. Having a crumpet on Sunday morning while reading the Sunday paper is fine.

We have lived in several countries before being posted in Australia and I really don't get the expression " treat" as a justification for an unhealthy behaviour. In other languages, treat is only the verb, yo treat a disease, but here, it is the excuse people use which gives food a power for reward and comfort.
If one wants a piece of chocolate, just have it without making some mental play about it, but have a piece not a chocolate bar.

I don't believe there is a magical ratio between protein-fat-carb and excess protein is converted in fat in the same way as carb, and one still must consider the increased risk of cancer with excessive proteins, so be natural about the food. Not too much of it, real food, mostly plants as it is well known.
When you look at the science of protein preserving muscle, we are talking about grams, not kilos, so a high protein will save 400 gr of muscle when losing over 15 kilos of fat, that's the difference between normal protein and hyper. The body also has a limit of how much protein it can use. Over that amount, it has no use of it, and will store it as fat.

Identify the habits you have created such as munching on something while watching tv. Instead of swapping a bad snack for a good snack, cut the snack, break the habit. Make it a rule, you only eat at the dining table, nowhere else and with no screens. So if you fancy a biscuit, you would have to take a plate, sit down, and eat it and only focus on it.

Try to cut takeaways until you have lost 2 stones. It is greasy, sugary, artificial. The takeaway culture is another uniquely British culture element.

@MiddlesexGirl - my protein comes from powder occasionally - I use it in coffee. Otherwise it is far too sweet for me. Chia seeds themselves are pretty high protein as seeds go. I eat them soaked with some oatmeal and then topped with Skyr yogurt (plenty of protein in that) and some berries. Cottage cheese, prawns, fish and chicken are my other go to protein sources. Oh, and eggs.

@LeGrandBleu

Aww no I didn't I wasn't being snappy when I said about salad it was meant to be a joke .

I was laughing to myself when I typed it thinking I should of been eating salad 🥗

Thank you for your advice.

It's the night time snacking and working from home that's made me develop bad habits around food and exercise.

@NancyBotwinBloom working from home is terrible. If there was a counter on the fridge door that showed how many times I opened it just to give a peak despite knowing perfectly well what is in it....

It won't be of consolation to you, but it is not your fault. This snacking culture is imbedded and starts as babies. Sometimes on the weaning board, I question why people praise baby crisps or melty puffs (Cheetos for babies) as great first finger food which will give baby a preference for ultra-processed snacks and I am always trashed. It is a culture, snacks are everywhere and many advertised for that precious relaxing moment in front of TV.

Write it down and put it on the cupboard door.
- No more snacks --
When you crave them, do 10 burpees, and while you are doing them, you will realise how ridiculous it is to be jumping on the kitchen floor and that some guys in a lab and office have made a great job at hooking you to a perfectly engineered irresistible crappy food, get angry, stop your burpees, get up and put the kettle on for a nice herbal tea.
Depending on where you live, go for a walk after dinner. You need to break the habits and behaviours.

Do lift some weights, but not for long, 20 mins per day to start with and observe how your body responds. Maybe having a restricted feeding window can kickstart your weightloss, eat between 7am-7pm and once established, make that window smaller.

It will take time, and it so unfair, it takes nothing to put them on, and forever to lose!
My advice is focus in diet first and later on weights, as it can play against you losing pounds.

I totally agree about snacks.
If I must have something unhealthy (pesky kids baking cakes again) I have it as part of my lunch to avoid falling back into the snacking habit.
I do also largely restricted eating to between 2pm and 10pm.

I agree with most of the advice above. Start with smaller weights and make sure your form is correct so you avoid injury. Try to lift weights / do bodyweight exercises 3-4 days a week. You build muscle on days you're not lifting - your lifting days are the way you tell your body "I need more muscle to do what I need to do!" and with the protein you eat, your body will build that muscle in response on the next day. It's a slow process, don't worry you aren't in any danger of looking like a man - you'd need to approach bodybuilding like a job in itself in order to get that bulky! Your female body resists putting on muscle and shedding weight (unfortunately!) so there is no risk of suddenly being too muscly. Keep up with the walking, as much as you can in the time you have. It's a great way of losing fat as it raises your heartrate but doesn't flood your body with cortisol like running does. Get as much sleep as you can, this is more important than most people think. I'd use the calorie calculator on James Smith academy website to work out your calorie target and protein target. Roughly 1.5g of protein per kg of your present weight. So mine is 90g per day as I'm 60kg, and this protein is best spread over the day rather than a big steak in one sitting to help your body absorb as much as possible. If you're on Instagram I'd recommend @soheefit @katiecrewe and @aliceliveing for good weightlifting advice for women. They post different workout ideas which you can save so I have a collection of saved posts I'll go back to for ideas of exercise combinations.

Do you exercise at the moment? I think I'd focus on the weight for the first 6 months, calorie count, do the macros if you want, and wee most of the 4 stone go. Up the amount you move, so aim for higher amounts of steps, do 3 short workouts a week. Then, once most of the weight has gone you could change your focus to building muscle.

The reason I say this is that as app mentioned, doing both together can be slow going. Personally I struggle to stay motivated, I need to see the fat coming off to keep me going.

I'd do bodyweight exercises, walking, yoga etc and really prioritise protein in your calories. If you lose a lot of weight without doing those 2 things, you will lose muscle as well as fat.

I lost around 13kg over about a year at age 59. I wasn't hugely overweight and I was always pretty active - gym 3 days a week, run Couch to 5k, dance studio 3 days a week, and I walk everywhere. But ... it was food. Comfort food, and my portion control was not good.

For various reasons I changed gyms and got a couple of free PT sessions - I now pay for them (a lot!) but it's so worth it. The first thing the PT said to me: "You can't out-train a bad diet."

For some reason it really clicked.

I counted calories - I'd never done this before because counting calories always caused me to crave food. But for some reason, I got into a type of eating where this didn't happen, this time round - I guess because at 81kg and 166cm I knew I had to do something.

I do a kind of moderated Atkins/keto pattern of eating. I limit white carbs (so nice bread & butter is a treat on the weekend), and I eat a lot of vegetables (but not peas or potatoes very often). I upped my protein.

For a year, I used my FitBit app to map my steps. I found I wasn't as sedentary as I thought - about 12,000 steps per day on average, and at least 2 days a week double that - I've done 25,000 steps without really noticing it.

I put EVERYTHING I ate into the diet bit of the FitBit app. I was accountable to myself. I weighed everything, so I got a sense of what 100grams of cheese or muesli or whatever looked like.

And seeing the numbers really helped me to make better choices - calories vs. satiety vs. nutrition. So 0% fat Greek yoghurt with a teaspoon of honey - really delicious and very filling. Chicken breast - nutritiously dense protein for minimal calories. And as much broccoli, or tomatoes, or peppers, or spinach as I like. I put a tablespoon of mayonnaise on the broccoli, or soy sauce, and it's a quick easy filling meal.

I also try not to let myself get hungry because then I don't make the best choices. So I eat a 50 gramme chunk of cheddar cheese as a snack, for example. Again, gets me protein, is satiating because of the fat/protein combination. And although a chunk of cheese (no biscuit or cracker or bread with it, mind!) is not a conventional snack, why not? Conventional snacks can be bad nutritional choices for you.

The other thing I did was start training in heavy weightlifting. I now lift heavy once a week, and train in general strength and what's now called "metcon" metabolic conditioning - at least another one (sometimes 2) times a week.

But you could start with body weight work: squats, jumping squats, push ups, work towards pull ups, and so on.

It will take time, and you really need to enjoy it! So find a way that doesn't feel like permanent deprivation. Heavy weights help, but don't do it without some supervision or training. And take it slowly. Probably you don't need to take it as slowly as me - but I'm old. It took me about a year to get to a 75kg deadlift.

@ItalianHat - chunks of cheese! I swear by them. If I'm travelling anywhere (remember those days?!) I always carry some mini Babybels in my handbag in case I get stuck and hungry, since the stuff you can buy on the move is really not stuff I generally want to eat.

75kg! I'm younger than you (by a little bit) and can't get past a 22kg bench press!
I have only been going a month and may need to get some physio advice about my shoulder but still - I'm impressed with a 75kg deadlift.

And yes, another fan here of Greek yogurt (especially with garlic) and cheese.

It took me a year to get to 75kg, and 2 years to get to my personal best at 87.5kg. But I can barely manage to bench press 25kg.

Well I've got everything crossed for a job offer which should involve garden leave.

Then I've got around three months to fill with this.

I know I can't be in the gym all day everyday but I will create some good habits. Which I then won't ruin with eating crap.

I am going to walk daily with the dog which we will both enjoy.

I've got some podcasts downloaded ready.

I've been listening to Joan and jericha. Omfg so funny but they are terrible

Good luck @NancyBotwinBloom. Hope you get the job and the garden leave. Three months will be wonderful for a kick start.

@ItalianHat

It took me a year to get to 75kg, and 2 years to get to my personal best at 87.5kg. But I can barely manage to bench press 25kg.

Oh that makes me feel a bit better. I haven't started deadlifting yet and didn't realise there was such a big difference.

@nancyBotwinBloom Have a look at rebelfit.co.uk. On Facebook too. It's all about rejecting diet culture and working
towards being healthier both mentally and physically. You learn which path you want/need to take to get there - there are a few and one is a body recomposition path. I've just done one of their missions and it has been a bit if an eye opener for me. I'm just about to set off on the body recomposition path.