Confidence Lost while horse shopping

[riderriddle]

Ive been looking for a while now and currently have a loan horse who I get on well with - we clicked pretty instantly and have never fell off her despite her being not a kick along and her napping and mini rearing out on hacks, spookiness at the indoor arenas. I found sharing a bit limiting due to them not being able to jump and want the flexibility to just have my own routine. With finances in place and stable reserved, I started hunting for a cob type excited to be able to do more activities, fun rides away, competing and jump again etc which is not possible with the current loan horse - I felt ready. This would be my first horse as a adult so not wanting anything green or big or forward .

However I've since been to see several horses advertised who were not as advertised - too forward / lame, bolters, broncers, no brakes, kickers, biters, bombproof 'wont move' types .. Now I would consider myself a confident novice but with all these bad viewings I'm beginning to lose the 'confident' part to the point where I'm terrified to get on anything new now even if I watch someone else ride first. Should I pack in my search or keep going or under horse with a complete plod despite having enjoyed something that doesnt need nagging? Is it meant to be this hard?

Always better to under-horse yourself as a novice as that way you will have the confidence to do more things. Buy for the rider you are now rather than the rider you want to be ie if you are jumping 60cm now don't buy a horse that is currently jumping 1m+ on a regular basis. See it so often, first time /novice owners buy something that is too much for them and then 6 months down the line they dare not get on the horse.

I now only buy from word of mouth eg instructors/friends etc who can vouch for the horse/seller. So many sellers lie unfortunately. Always take your instructor with you to view a horse and get them to ride it first.

Can I ask what your budget is? I wonder if that is a factor on the type of horse you are viewing. Also, whereabouts in the country are you (you can PM me) as I know of two sales liveries (Surrey) with excellent reputations.

@Trevorton please could you PM me (or post on here) the sales liveries you refer to? Thanks

@twistyizzy I agree with underhorsing but don't want one that needs a kick for every single stride. It seems like they are green happy hackers or quirky show jumping types nothing in the middle. I have an experience person from the yard come with as my instructor runs a yard so doesnt have time to come on viewings though does send links to appropriate looking adverts

@trevorton in the north west so a bit far from me. 7k budget which I thought was reasonable but perhaps not? Ive seen a couple of novices on yard buy inappropriate horses and watched it go wrong so think this could be adding to my anxiety.

Been to view a few friend of a friends horses come for sale - but a couple of those didn't work out either (turned out was fat and been sat in a field for 2 years and had no fitted tack to try it and another evaded the bit and was so nappy was awful to ride)

@riderriddle you need to write down your non-negotiables and then learn to read between the lines in adverts. So "needs some schooling/green in school" = either a plank of wood that can't bend or freaks out and naps. "Forward into a jump" = tows you into a jump and needs a Waterford bit etc etc.
Look at the photos of the horse being ridden, ask for videos and pay attention to the tack the horse is wearing.
No horse will be perfect so you do have to compromise but do not stray from your list if non-negoriables.
Temperament is more important than breed/colour (unless it is a chestnut warmblood mare 🤣🤣🤣). For a novice I would always go for an older horse ie 12 yrs + and don't write off older horses.

From my experience £7k won’t get a decent horse now. I hate trying horses and had to spend more than I first thought to get mine. But my trainer came with me and he knew the dealers.

@TodayInahurry prices are ridiculous now. I got my current one 8 years ago for 3.5K. 12 Yr old ex-racer who had been to Floors Castle, GYS and evented at PC Champs in the Open Novice. In today's prices he would be 15K minimum

Yep, I've seen a lovely green one which my friend was all for but I don't think someone of my skill level should be taking on something unbalanced and needs teaching how to ride in a straight line and bend when I'm already feeling a bit fragile. I can certainly work on upping my budget by holding off 6 months which I'm tempted to do as I'm half way to refusing to get on another unknown nutcase as this experience has really knocked my confidence. Everyone is telling me not to give up as I might miss a good one but Its taken its toll on me

Don’t get a green horse @riderriddle - bide your time and something will come up. I speak as someone who bought something very big and very green (but lovely temperament) as their second - it’s harder than I thought even with lessons!

And don’t get on anything at a viewing if it doesn’t feel right. I would poss only view stuff where you have a connection to the seller or recommendation maybe and take a professional with you.

Buying horses sucks though, big sympathies.

@BigHorseLittleHorse I really don't want anything green but they seem to keep finding me as people play up what they've actually done can't trust people at all. I nearly cancelled on my last viewing out of pure anxiety. Would it be completely ridiculous to wait until something found me?

This ! Personal recommendation always. The few times I have gone against this , travelled many miles sometimes only to find a horse that in no way fits the advertisement. It can take a while to find the right one but it will be worth it .

@riderriddle that’s exactly the right thing to do! And you may find when it does find you, it might not even quite meet all your criteria for whatever reason but you’ll know… if you’re thinking of pulling out or it doesn’t feel right, that’s not the horse to risk it with. You’ll get there 🙂

If you're looking for a nice steady cob around the 4k ISH mark and above, the best person is a dealer called Emily Chambers at EJC Equine. She comes highly recommended.

You have my sympathies, horse hunting is really really tough at the best of times, the huge financial outlay (not just on the horse itself but the commitment to keep costs etc), the emotional involvement and ups and downs etc. It's all very well saying underhorse yourself but then you do put yourself into the very crowded marketplace of suitable first horses that will do a bit of everything which is pretty much what everyone wants. Plus I've turned up at plenty of viewings for horses described as super quiet, novice friendly, schoolmaster type, dope on a rope etc to find either absolute nutters their owners are terrified to ride ("he's never done that before" says apparently perplexed seller, scratching their head as horse decks their 'test rider' crash dummy) , a baby so green and wobbly it's got no idea how to even move forward with a rider onboard never mind piss off or spook, or something clearly sick/doped/lame, it does get quite discouraging after a while and when you are already looking for the easiest/quietest possible horse there's no way to go further 'under' unless you by a rocking horse (which I've been tempted by in the past I have to admit ) - I do think sellers take the mickey with horses clearly marketed for the less experienced end of the market thinking people won't notice the obvious - and perhaps they are right as I've seen plenty of clearly unsuitable purchases made by acquaintances over the years and even made a couple myself so who can blame them for chancing their arm!

Plus personally I never feel I ride anywhere near my best at viewings due to nerves and knowing that people are watching/judging etc, plus the whole strange horse/strange environment thing - where at home I might be perfectly happy to ride quite firmly/positively on a friend's horse or whatever, on a strange horse you never know if they're going to freak out and you def don't want to upset/fall off a horse that isn't yours so probably ride a bit defensive/passive, horse gets more wound up or behind the leg or whatever and it's all a vicious circle. I've ended up crying on the way home in the car more than once thinking I must be a crap rider since the apparently 'perfect schoolmaster' wouldn't even canter a 20m circle for me so I know how you feel!

I do think £7k whilst a decent budget, and there will be something suitable out there at that price point is probably bottom end for a real gem of an all rounder amateur's horse but top end of the chance-your-arm brigade hence why you are seeing so many duds.

All I can suggest is either expand your search criteria a bit, either be prepared to travel further afield or look at horses that are a bit older or different types (don't auto rule out TBs or sports horses or native types perhaps even if a cob would be ideal) or that have small management issues or blemishes or vices, just to expand your possibilities a bit (but like a PP said be v v choosy about what you actually go and view)? OR expand your budget a bit and/or go to a very reputable dealer, yes you'll pay a premium but stand a better chance of getting what you want OR give yourself a few months off, start enjoying riding again, maybe get some lessons at a good school or go out for some nice hacks and just enjoy a good blast around, get your confidence back up, let it be known you are on the market so you don't miss out on the word of mouth stuff but properly start looking again with new energy in the spring?

Honestly I think I’m the current market, £7k is ambitious for a forward enough to be fun but safe enough for a novice type.
I see them, with confirmation faults/14 years old/dodgy loaders etc easily making £10k+.

Dont go for green if you yourself are novice-y green and green = black and blue. Especially if you’ve lost confidence, even the sweetest horse will need a bit of guidance and reassurance when green. Nervous horses and nervous riders can become a pretty horrendous spiral pretty quickly. I do a bit of instructing and see so often a rider who’s too scared to do anything but walk and trot, only in one end of the school, while the nervous horse gets increasingly frustrated, acts up more because it’s bored shitless and rider does less and less, horse gets worse and worse.

Personally I’d speak to a dealer called Juliet Clarke. She’s incredibly straight talking, but a rare good dealer. She very much targets the market you are looking for - people wanting a safe sound sort that isn’t a tedious plod.
A few people I know haven’t liked dealing with her but I know 2 people who bought from her unseen during covid and were delighted. She might be able to find you something for £7k…

@Nonononomaybe I have just sent you a PM. Hope you get it ok.

I wish you had been looking about 8 months ago when we were selling my daughter's lovely cob. She was exactly what you're looking for - absolutely lovely 11-year-old first pony and who's been doing Pony Club with my daughter, is a low-level all-rounder but also very responsive to the leg, great to hack out alone and in company, great to load, has been to loads of shows. We sold her within about 2 days of being advertised and had loads of interest - I was wondering if we sold her too cheap (£4.5K) 😂 given then responses on this thread. She went to another child PC home and is a sweetheart there as well. I would have been a bit embarrassed to charge 7K for a cob, but we probably should have. We only sold her as my daughter bought a SJ competition pony. If the new owners ever want to sell her I'll let you know.

There's a nice looking cob advertised in Macclesfield, just seen on Quality Horses Uk on fb
www.facebook.com/share/shr3n1timVaNum5Q/?mibextid=K35XfP

Not mine, saw this thread as awake early and then scrolling social media!
We found our most recent pony on horse quest but of two before that, one was mine on loan first and I offered to buy him, and my other pony belonged to a friend. It's a total minefield!

Horse buying is a bit of a minefield at the best of times. I’m currently looking, consider myself to be a reasonably experienced horsewoman, and am finding it mad out there. There seems to be no correlation between the actual ability and quality of horses for sale and the price being asked for them. From what I have seen, it is possible to find a nice happy hacker for your budget. But they are mixed in with a lot of dross and horses with issues. One thing I have really noticed is the number of small time dealers getting in on the act. When I last bought a horse, which was only about 4 years ago just before Covid, the majority of horses I was looking at were privately owned and advertised. Now, most horses I’m seeing seem to be on selling livery with a dealer running the shop (and taking a hefty percentage.) They are driving the price of average horses up, without actually bringing much to the table. I’ve called a lot of dealers recently, and they don’t really know the horses they are selling - they are hoping to make a quick profit on a fast turnaround. This is different to the sellers of old, who were either owners wanting to find the best new home for a beloved horse, or proper old fashioned dealers with a reputation to maintain and a desire to match a horse and rider.

If I have learnt one thing this time round, it is to run every name you are buying from through the Dodgy Dealers Facebook page. Also, don’t assume the horse is yours until you have your name in the passport. I’ve had several disappointments and am still searching for my next horse. It should be fun having a pot of cash and going horse shopping, but I’ve found it soul destroying and tedious this time round.

Good luck in your search!

I am currently horrified by the prices that horses are fetching in some circles, and yet in other areas people are virtually giving them away due to cost of living. There really are the haves and have nots in the horse world, of course.

Anyway, if I may offer an opinion...I suggest easing up on your quest while you get a bit more money behind you, get thee some more lessons at a decent riding school - that way you'll regain your lost confidence and ride a variety of horses - and if the right one pops up in the meantime, be open to it.

Although- the 'right one popping up' often means a person chooses with their heart not their head, and still ends up with an unsuitable ( and for some reason usually young) horse, which means they then end up missing out on the fun while a professional schools it.

Another experience of mine - a 'kickalong' can be retrained to sharpen up a bit. Have a read of the book 'Cobs Can' and see what my one time colleague Omar achieved with his lovely cob mare Ketchup. His methods work particularly well with cobs, who actually often are very shut down as a response to being expected to know that leg aids mean go forward, without ever having been taught this. I was able to lighten up a whole team of apparently dead to the leg ponies at a riding school, just by explaining it to them.

I do hope you find what you are looking for 😊

I've just talked myself into buying a project pony....

I agree with @Oddestofsocks it’s pretty easy to sharpen up a kick along. Really.. mist kickalongs are usually a schooling/fitness issue or they’ve gone a bit stale. So many of them are actually just very fat… and a bit of weight loss, plenty of hacking rather than going in the school all the time, and you’ve got a different horse.

It’s much harder to take the fizz out of a hot horse

It's much harder to take the fizz out of a hot horse

Yes, definitely! It's fun retraining a steady Eddie - you can stay safer while you're doing it too. I recommend in-hand work and pole work, fun hacks as suggested above, and working on your own riding skills so you're not blocking them as well.