New pony.. what would you do please

[Lucie390]

We recently bought a very sweet little mare 6 years old. I have many years of experience owning horses but since having children not had a horse in past 15 years. Daughter has been riding on and off since little but only a year ago got back into it properly.
An opportunity came up for livery very local to where we live (very scarce, very few vacancies ever come up) we visited a few ponies wvtb and ended up getting a little 12hh mare via a dealer (read reviews of dealer, contacted others who had bought).

Daughter is v petite 13 year old and liked that mare was easy to handle for her, also should say we loaned her for month to get to know her before purchase.

I realise it probably sounds impulsive purchase but daughter is having some issues and is looking at home schooling I thought this would be great benefit to her life.

Long story short is mare is very green, daughter is a novice. Dealer said she had had sufficient schooling, basic school work would be fine but would need some work for anything more. I thought ok great we can work with that. We rode her whilst on loan and whilst she was quite nervous, we put it down to being new, she was easy to handle and quite laid back. even took her out on roads on lead reign and I felt confident she’d be fine.

Past 4 weeks we’ve done no more than lunge, lead reign and bare back whilst we have been waiting on saddle. Pony was calm but nervous no problems. Today she’s pretty much bolted and my daughter had quite a nasty fall. It was terribly windy and I know she doesn’t the wind but I’m worried we’ve taken on more than we can handle here. We are having to lunge before riding everytime to get rid of the freshness, even then I’m finding she’s still to fizzy to ride calmly.

Im really upset, for one I feel I was mis sold her, today shook me up seeing my daughter really hurt and but also my daughter is so attached to the pony, been going to turn her out religiously and doing everything for her.

I feel so stressed that we’ve made a massive mistake here.

I asked a riding teacher to take a look this afternoon and she said she’s just very green, whilst I’m ok with working on her and spending time doing this properly, I don’t want my daughter to be the one to do this. What are my options here ?

I’ve been very honest and said it’s more than we can handle and exactly that I’ve misjudged this.

she said no

@Mafelicent she bolted and my daughter was dragged upside down along a fence.

Did steady lungs today and bolted again.

I think hard food was criticised first in case it was making the pony fizzy. Balancers are fed in tiny amounts. I like to give vits and mins to 6 year olds.

I don't think anyone in Pony Club would swap a much loved schoolmaster for an unruly, tiny, 6 year old cob that bolts.

That sounds horrific. What sort of stirrups do you have? Or was she held by something other than her stirrup?

@Greatly I’m aware how balancers work, I use them where appropriate. I too give vitamins and minerals to everything in the form of ad-lib forage. And I’m also aware plenty of people use them when they aren’t necessary without any detriment but I don’t think ops situation is the ideal one to be experimenting with whether hers is one of them.
Well no, of course nobody is going to exchange ponies. That’s why I didn’t suggest it. But it’s fairly common for competent dc to want a challenge long before they are ready to move on from their own safe pony. That’s why I said part time riding swop, meaning some of the time a child that might like to ride ops and her dc ride theirs.

Admittedly it was pre h&s but as a child I was always more than happy to get on anything unruly, and as teens we would argue for the privilege. Unless kids have changed in the last 5 years at that age my dc and many of their friends weren’t any different, just better supervised. And if I’d had one dc and a single safe pony on livery that they’d outgrown ability wise I’d be extremely keen on the idea.

When you say she's bolting on the lunge, do you mean true. panicked, would-run-through-a-fence blind bolting, or pissing off uncontrollably - I'm not one to argue semantics but there is a difference between the two and if it's the former and she's doing it in the arena, on the lunge, with nothing obvious to frighten her, I'd be very seriously concerned for her health - the only reason for a horse to panic themselves to that extent in a familiar, calm environment is serious pain or something neurological. Either way I'd get the vet to take a look at her - I assume nothing came up when you had her vetted? Was it a 5-stage with bloods taken and have you had the bloods analysed?

If all if well with her physically, it does sound to me as though this is a mismatch - can you try again with the dealer and see if a deal can be struck where she takes her back on a sales livery type arrangement and/or sells her on a commission basis? Whilst it doesn't sound like a total mis-sell like others have said, and you could probably get this pony to the point of being a fun all rounder with lots of time and professional help, it is a slow and frustrating process, needs lots of patience and willingness to spend plenty of time on ground work and basics, and an acceptance that there will be 2 steps forwards 1 step back, at 13 your DD quite reasonably probably just wants to get out and about and have fun, not spend hours long-lining and walking steadily around. Plus there's a very real risk that just as the pony gets to where you want her your DD will have outgrown her. So hard as it is I'd cut your losses, find the pony a nice home with someone with the time and experience to bring her on properly, even if this means selling at a substantial loss or even long-term loan. Then look for another pony for your DD, maybe an older teen pony that's been there done that - even then you'll have to expect some regression when they move home (always unsettling for them) and for the pony to be considerably sharper than the riding school plods, but like others have said 'green on green makes black and blue' so you def need an experienced pony to show your DD the ropes. For her second pony you could maybe look at something younger/less experienced to bring along together...

This is a disaster waiting to happen unfortunately. Don't let your DD ride her again, send her to a DECENT sales yard to sell her on (I know a fantastic woman if you are anywhere near Lincolnshire). For not only your daughter, but the pony too. She is too much for a novice and she deserves a home that is capable and experienced. Your DD obviously needs something bulletproof she can get confidence on.

I agrée with PP that there’s a difference between proper bolting and pissing off. True bolting
is pretty rare IME.

Yes totally agree. I’ve been bolted with once and the horse ran through post and rail.

I’ve had my brakes fail many a time, or a horse shoot forwards in a fast canter for 10 strides when scared, not the same thing!

It’s very difficult at the moment with horses, cold, windy and wet. Even our team rider had a bad fall last week. You child should not ride unless in a school.

have you got a lightweight rider who could ride a couple of times a week.

the days are getting longer and weather will get better and only will be more settled

This is excellent advice OP 👍(particularly the selling part - she's young, which is a real positive in terms of selling).

It sounded more like pony got a fright and unseated the dc who unfortunately got her foot stuck, was further frightened and shot off as a result. Agree this doesn't make the pony a bolter and is a pretty expected reaction of a young nervous pony to this sort of circumstance. I'd get someone more experienced on board OP rather than keep putting ddd back on and both having negative experiences over and over.

To answer Q’s… she definitely bolted during lesson but was more out of control pissed on lunge.

We have decided to put pony up for sale.

others who were there at weekend agreed, bad combo of lack of training and experience on Daughter.

Dealer will not exchange or take pony back and is now saying pony was 100% safe when sold so this is down to me.

Good plan. Try and buy or loan something older and more experienced. A good 14.2 will cost the earth but if you are buying then get something about 13.2 at least (dd1 and 3 were on a 17hh at 15!! We already had him so they had no choice not recommending that you go this big!)

Novice mum plus novice daughter plus novice pony was never going to go well. You say you’ve got experience but riding a nervous pony in high wind was a really silly thing to do and the fall could have been avoided. That’s not on the dealer or the pony.

having said that have you tried one of the dodgy dealer groups on Facebook to see if the dealer is actually right in refusing to take the pony back? Depending on the circumstances you could have recourse against them

I'm an instructor for our local pc. Swaps and loans are regular occurrences here. I suspect this particular pony is likely to be incredibly green and potentially not long broken. Schooling on a lunge rein in the wind with a bouncy, uneven rider who hasn't mastered riding between hand and leg isn't going to end well.

The other point I'd make in general (not aimed at you OP) is that very many people, including those who buy and sell horses for a living, seem to automatically expect all cobs, including these little 12-13.3hh mini cobs to automatically be quiet, bombproof, sound types - well I've owned two in my time and can tell you they have just as much capacity to be hot, sensitive, nervy and injury prone as any warmblood or TB. Just because the pony's got plenty of hair and bone, please don't assume that equates to a ploddy mindset!

I'm a believer of course that child/novice friendly horses are made not born in any case, but I actually think you could have started with much better raw materials than my two girls who were in fact indiscriminately bred, conformationally unsound and had been rather poorly started, probably under the assumption that because of their type they'd be easy and could just have saddles slung on and ridden away. I'm also convinced that (in the UK at least) to get a small but still thickset/cobby type with extravagant front leg movement a lot of people add in a good dose of welsh to the cob/draught blood and that can be a really bad mix as Welshies can, in the wrong strains and with the wrong handling can be really temperamental and sharp. I quite like welshes myself, in fact my aunt and uncle used to breed them and they made great kids ponies but always needed a certain careful way of handling, it's funny to me that so many people proclaim to hate them whilst probably their beloved cob has at least a few welsh ancestors! Anyway my point is you can never make assumptions about the temperament of your horse based on type, you need to actually have evidence of the horse/pony doing the job you want them for or to assume you will have to train them from scratch yourself (you may get lucky and get an easy one but these horses are certainly the exception not the rule!)...

This is a real shame, especially as your daughter has bonded well with the pony. I will say that we had an amazing 13hh cob for my daughter and he tended to go a little bit crazy in the winter months due to a lack of turnout. It is the time of year when ponies/horses will misbehave as they are in more, it's crap weather and dark early.

Our cob needed 24/7 turnout and it stopped him from being wall of death to his normal happy self.

Also some ponies don't lunge well.
I have a young 15.3hh maxi cob at the moment and he does not lunge very well at all. he will bomb off and not pay the slightest attention to you. I'm doing more long reining with him but he is currently having 3 months off whilst I concentrate on other horses.

I was always taught green on green makes black and blue as a child. I assume you've had the saddle checked as you mentioned that he's put on weight. He will also change shape if the amount or type of work.
Changes.
I would stop all hard feed and get the usuals checked as well as making sure that you invest in as many lessons as possible.
Obviously make sure that your daughter is wearing professionally
Fitted hat and body protector.
When my daughters youngster was really playing up she found a handle fitted between the d rings gave her confidence

You still seem to be blaming the dealer but what have they actually done wrong? You bought the pony knowing it's age and experience levels and put a novice rider on it in strong wind. You've basically set the pony up to fail.

You didn't buy a suitable pony for your daughter. The dealer didn't drug the pony, or misrepresent it. You knew it was a 6 year old green pony. The dealer isn't going to turn down a customer who says the pony is what they want. You even had a months trial loan. I can't see what they've done wrong.

You're doing the right thing in selling her.

That said, I don't think the dealer necessarily did anything wrong. They were honest that the horse was green and at 6yo she was never going to be hugely experienced or calm.

You chose to get her anyway, knowing your DD was a novice and that you hadn't owned a horse in years - that's not really the dealers fault. It's also not the dealers fault that you chose to lunge her with a novice rider on her back in high winds.

I hope that doesn't sound too harsh but you're incredibly lucky your daughter wasn't badly injured if she was really dragged along upside down by a bolting horse - that could have been fatal.

I think chalk it up to experience and find a decent sales yard which will take her on. Most people who have had horses long enough have bought a mistake. At least no one human or horse is badly hurt.
She's probably not a bad pony. I suspect she gave herself a hell of a fright when your daughter came off and between that and the moving around, her confidence is shot. She might come right with a few weeks of professional schooling but I can see why your dealer doesn't want her back.
Perhaps with wonderful hindsight riding in wind/rain wasn't ideal but hey ho what's done is done. No point beating the OP up over it. It's fear inducing punishment enough watching DC come off even at silliest reasons. However, my view is test of a good horse is one who gets on with the job in all weather. If it can't then it's probably not the right one.
Good luck. For what it's worth it is a million times harder to find a pony for your child than it ever is for yourself. We haven't found our unicorn yet. We haven't bought a mistake but had a couple of near misses..... I have almost lost the will to live.

Thank you for the helpful messages and for the not so helpful. Can someone advise me how to close this thread now please.

I have explained above what I’m doing, please no more replies. Some of you aren’t so kind, this is difficult enough.

I’m sorry I don’t think you can close threads on Mumsnet (unless it gets up to 1,000 replies). If you don’t engage it will just drop down the page by itself.

Good luck with selling the pony and I hope you manage to find a suitable pony for your dd in future.