I think people (politicians and others) saying 'transition' being the reason y6 should return first haven't thought this through!

[DrMadelineMaxwell]

For so very many reasons.

I posted similar on a recent thread, but in a nutshell..

Most of the 'rights of passage' stuff just can't happen if you have not got your full class/cohort in and have to have any kind of social distancing. Show - no time. Residential - can't travel. SATS - cancelled so no wind down after. Leavers' service - can't get people together in large numbers to can't have all parents in anyway.

Seeing friends they are in primary together is a flawed argument if you have to start talking about rotas of kids on days or sessions, or splitting the classes into smaller groups that stay more isolated. And then they can see their friends but not actually go near them....and that's IF you can get all their friends in one group, which you probably couldn't because their friendship groups change like the wind sometimes.

Actual transition activities - a chat by the main high school's teachers to the children going there could potentially happen. But the main visit days won't happen if the high schools aren't open yet. And won't be really meaningful if they are only open to very few kids as they will still miss out on seeing their new classes in their entirety to meet new friends and they won't see what the busy high school actually looks and feels like.

So why keep touting 'transition' as a reason?

Surely it's not about all the leavers discos etc, and more trying to make sure they've not been out of education for almost 6 months before they have to stay afloat in a new school, where they need to be more independent and take on more responsibility for themselves? As well as potentially having to catch up a lot of missed time at the same time.

The staffroom is looking a little like the playground.
I am sure bith primary and secondary teachers are using their professional experience to do their best

I'm probably just a cow who doesn't know my job.

No, but a lot of Y6 parents are currently seriously worried about their kids having to rock up to secondary in September having been unceremoniously dumped out of primary 5 months previously.

Your comments about how much had been done already don’t apply here because the kids will have been out of school for 5 months. In lockdown. In a global pandemic.

It’s not a great stretch to think that those already facing a stressful transition (and as a secondary teacher I know it isn’t as plain sailing for them all as you are making out even with a proper transition timetable) might need special handling by people who they know well.

Acknowledging those concerns would be a start. Saying ‘we would love to get Y6 back in for some support with transition’ would be appreciated. If you know how important the secondary visit days are, then get on their backs about it to see what can be done about it.

Don’t say ‘why are parents suddenly concerned about transition when they normally fuck off to Center Parcs anyway.’

Since September the things I have done to ensure they are "7 ready".
Children now have their own pencil cases and equipment instead of schools.
Children are responsible for all equipment and kit.
Year 6 are streamed and move classrooms for maths, english and topic.
Children do jobs - sports leaders, play leaders, milk monitors, assembly audio and visual equipment etc. Again, responsibility.
Form and house captains.
September residential.
Pshe on changing friendship, change and continuity, time management and peer pressure, drugs and alcohol, road safety.
Stepped back from micro- managing friendship issues and encourage self- solving.
Bikeability.
Budget management of classroom pupil budget all year.

There's probably more. My point is they are more ready than you might think. And we are still educating. I am still setting lessons every day.
The biggest issue is that i cannot honestly think that the emotional support several seem to think should be paramount can be delivered to rooms of few pupils who can't get near each other, or me. And that they can't visit the secondaries. Mine are used to a week there in July and it really is the magic bullet in soothing any lingering worries. Particularly for the more needy.

My friends' school is trying to organise an "early week" between the primaries and secondaries in their cohort of schools for the 6/7 in September / end of August. I think that's a good idea and i'd be up for that but I don't think our Academy Trust will be.

My point is they are more ready than you might think

And my point is that I’m not talking about pencil cases and bus timetables or even times tables but mental and emotional transition. Support with coming out of lockdown and all that entails, a closure on the old world and a looking forward to the new. Time to debrief.

I’m not asking for the kids in for weeks from June doing busywork I’m asking for some consideration for the emotional well-being of kids who are going through two massive upheavals at the same time. In March they weren’t focusing on secondary (most had only just found out where they are going, some still don’t know), they were gearing up for SATs. They weren’t even remotely in the right headspace. To expect them to get in the right headspace at home, alone isn’t fair.

And that they can't visit the secondaries.

Well that’s not settled, is it? But if it’s not happening, then primaries should be stepping up more not shrugging their shoulders. They are still your kids.

And I don’t see why you can’t fit a class into a hall (or the playground), socially distanced. SEN meetings could happen.

What is this Year 6 don't learn anything and it's only fun rites of passage at this time of year? Just because SATs have (usually) happened, doesn't mean they don't have things in English and Maths to improve before secondary school. Plus the foundation curriculum is ongoing.

We don't have Residential at this time of year, we use it for class bonding in September. It spreads the cost out for parents as our local secondaries tend to have their Y7 Residentials in September for the same reason.

My Year 6s are desperate to be back - they want that feeling of an end.

Please stop being pompous at me Noble. I'm not an idiot or a pupil. I'm fully aware that they'll have been out of school for 5 months. I don't think any of the year 6 teachers are not acknowledging your concerns. And the work we've done on personal growth won't just suddenly drop out of their heads - we are constantly referencing it in our online classroom. I'm pleased that lots of my class seem very organised.

Interestingly, when I was pastoral head of 7, the students affected most by transition showed no pattern and did not come from a particular group or feeder school, so it wasn't dependent on a particular transition programme by any of the primaries. Nor were SEND or EBD the ones more likely to be affected. Sometimes it was the most confident or the ones who were academically able. Size of the primary feeder seemed to make the most difference, or parental engagement. When I left we were about to merge to become an "all through" school but that didn't come off.

We have contacted the secondary. Year 6 are not currently a priority apparently but i'm waiting for the HOY7 to get back to me. At the moment prioritising the SEND /Ebd has been the focus.

We aren't being neglectful. At all. As we seem.to be disagreeing and I feel this has turned into a year 6 / secondary divide, i'll leave it here. Year 6 teachers are obviously worried and concerned and know the difficulties of returning with that year group so don't need to be made to feel bad for feeling that way on a staffroom thread. Myself included.

I’m posting on a thread where the title says that parents wanting Y6 back in for transition ‘haven’t thought things through’. Pomposity coming from the other direction.

The response to ‘Y6 are a priority because of transition’ on here seems to mainly consist of ‘Y6 mainly piss about all summer and god, do idiot parents really think that they’ll be back in to put on a play and go on a PGL break?’.

If the truth is that you are also concerned for Y6 and preparing transition materials and phoning around secondaries then that is great and this Y6 parent is pleased to hear it.

Primary schools’ hands are tied. We can’t do the sentimental send off at all. It’s a flat out impossibility. Our Y6 teacher is/ will be shielding so there’s no question of her returning.

We also can’t do much of the practical support that we would normally. We couldn’t address worries about the corridors being busy or going to the canteen, or getting lost because all these very real worries will be affected by covid.

I think secondaries would be better easing them in gently, rather than putting the guilty emotional ploy of ‘saying goodbye’ on primaries.

Well, this will probably be contentious, but "in my day" we didn't have any "transition" at all and we managed fine. We rolled up to the new school the afternoon before term started, went to our new classrooms and met out form tutor, got given a map and a timetable, job done!

I think they are using them as guinea pigs. All the data and statistics worldwide divide the age categories into 0-10 and 10-20. Using the year group with age 10 in, the government receives an upper end data point for the effects on 0-10 and a lower end data point for the 10-20 group. They get a lot more information from this single year group than from any other. Their reason will absolutely be based on a population level benefit rather than from any sympathy for the needs of a specific year group.

I didn't either Callme, and I was in a tertiary system so transition happened twice. We just had to rock up to the bus stop one day and get the bus to middle school! It seems odd now that it happened - my mum didn't even walk me there - just sent me out in my big blazer.

Lots of things wouldn't be allowed now though. Our bus driver chucked the whole bus off once and drove off and we all had to walk about 3 miles home. No mobiles to call home. I can't remember my mum even being bothered! She probably correctly assumed we deserved it!

I don't think Y6 will have the option of coming back to their 'normal'.

The reality is that, if we have them back for 7 weeks, we will first have to transition them into a whole 'new' primary school. Chances are they would be in a small group, in a different classroom, with a different teacher with totally different routines for drop off, break, lunch etc. No sense of being 'The Leavers' because nobody else will be there.

Then, once they have got used to their 'new' primary school, and probably grieved a bit for their old one, then we could start transition into a weird, temporary version of secondary school- probably without any actual visits to the secondary school as they have already decided to bin the transition program.

Well I am 45 and we had transition from primary to secondary so don’t know what those others are on about. Good job too as going from a village primary of 60 kids to massive comp would unsettle the most confident kid

The reality is for our primary is that we would prefer year 5 back first, and year 6 at a later date. I think the majority of our transition activities at this point in the year normally now are up to the secondaries, with induction days and HOY meeting them.

Noble, it would be like parents demanding Y11 and Y13 back in until July, to help with their emotional wellbeing of not having proms, not doing exams etc.

I'm a parent, not a teacher.
My DD is in Yr8. All the end of yr6 stuff is nice, but actually for some kids makes the break from that environment more of an emotional wrench.
Every child in every year is being affected.
It can't be helped.
Starting afresh in yr7 when it starts will be fine. Primary school will seem even more distant for this cohort.
My DD's primary school held a little get together in October for the former yr6's. Which was lovely but rather bittersweet for my DD who wasn't yet settled in high school. She cried all the way home!
It's many years since I was at school but the end of primary wasn't hyped up at all then. I think on the very last day we were allowed to bring in games from home. That was it!
I'm sorry these kids will miss out, but once they get to high school it will seem much less important.

We will not be doing any year 6 taster visits and days. There is little point as they will not get a sense of what the school is really like. So not much transition from us from a secondary perspective.

We will not be doing any year 6 taster visits and days. There is little point as they will not get a sense of what the school is really like. So not much transition from us from a secondary perspective.

What about the practical stuff? Like how to order uniform if the shop and school are closed? Or info for parents (as the info evening can’t go ahead) and who to contact about issues - for example transport or special needs? Info about the school day and what to expect on the first day for the children? How to set up the parent pay type thing so they can pay for school meals?

I’m sure plans are in place behind the scenes and hopefully they’ll stick something on the website at some point.

When my son joined Year 7 this year, all of the practical stuff was done electronically anyway. No parent meetings and no transition activities. (The school has quite a lot of international students, so it's not very practical to have in-person transition events in advance of the start of term.) All the transition stuff was done in the first week of school in September. It worked absolutely fine.

Thanks. I’m sure it will be fine once we all get used to a new way of working. (And I learn to relax a bit.)

I agree! If they return to primary it's unlikely Y6 would get to take part in the usual rites of passage activities such as residentials and productions, signing shirts won't promote social distancing and nor will emotional goodbyes. If the idea behind bringing the Y6s back is to support transition then there needs to be no pretence that's something which can be best delivered in a post-lockdown primary school.

If by some miracle someone in the government is thinking about what would be supportive for this Y6 cohort longer term, an early move to secondary (one full day per week or half days?) is something I'd hope they'd come up with. Assuming Y7-Y9 won't be back at school and Y10 & Y12 won't be back until after primary schools are, the secondary buildings will be empty and should be able to accommodate the Y6s that will be joining in September. Any baseline testing could happen(!), the children would get to know the layout, some of the staff, where the toilets are etc. and hopefully any teachers involved will get the 'make a poster for my classroom display' homework out of their system so no Y7 has 12 to do in the first week. It would also be an opportunity to try out any new handwashing regimes, teach the Y6s how to read a timetable (even if there isn't any moving between classrooms when they're in) and as I've said on other threads, give them a bit of certainty in this really weird time.

I know lots of people feel it's vital for Y6 to have their ending at primary school and as part of my job I've been looking into Y6's worries about starting Y7. This year, just as for the past 20ish years I've been teaching, their worries are all related to detentions, getting lost and making friends. Not one has mentioned missing out on end of Y6 stuff. In contrast, every parent has said how worried they are about their child's transition to secondary school being undermined by missing out on the end of Y6 stuff. I find that really interesting and see this year as an opportunity to really address these worries and make transition much more driven by the children's needs and anxieties.

I think we need to step back a bit from fighting about which year group goes first! Everyone who has a child in primary will think that their child's year group should be first. They will have very good reasons why this is the case. The year group which has to wait the longest to go back will be furious with the govmt or the school that they have missed out. Parents of secondary age children in Y10 and 12 will be agitating that their kids should be workingtowards their exams. The fact is that it has been shit for all children. I have a child with SEN who asks me thirty odd times a day for school as she has no understanding of why she can't go to school and is lost without her school routine. I suppose I would probably plump for my child's year or for vulnerable kids to go first? The point being that you can make a good argument for any year group to be first.