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Whether you're a permanent teacher, supply teacher or student teacher, you'll find others in the same situation on our Staffroom forum.

Glasgow spunks 300 million quid on ipads for schools

103 replies

noblegiraffe · 27/08/2019 21:11

www.tes.com/news/rollout-52000-ipads-begins-glasgow-schools

I hope they’re insured, have they never looked at the screens of the kids’ mobile phones?

What a total waste of money.

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Kazzyhoward · 28/08/2019 19:28

Pearson announces that it is moving to digital textbooks

Well I hope they've improved the digital versions. My son got really frustrated with digital versions as they're written portrait which are hard to read on a landscape laptop meaning you have to constantly resize etc to zoom in to read print far too small. Then you can't have two pages open side by side like you can with a paper book, so flicking forward/backward between pages. Very hard to do when there is a picture on the left page and the narrative/key on the right - again, easy with a printed book, a pain in the arse with a screen. No "hyperlinks" which is crazy, no "clickovers" for definitions etc. The ones he used were just basically a pdf version of the book. He got so frustrated he pleaded with us to buy paper versions from Amazon, which we did and he was happy again and never bothered with the digital versions again.

Kuponut · 28/08/2019 19:56

One of the academies near us does this for all kids Y3 upwards (parents pay so much a year rental to be allowed to have the iPads at home and basically at the end of their time at school they can buy out the iPad and have it to keep for nominal cost). I'm not a fan - used to have kids there and the number of messages I got about insisting X or Y app was deleted was nuts.

Mind you - DD2 takes her iPad into school to work on (it has a keyboard as well to go along with it) with agreement from the SENCO, Head and class teacher because she finds writing physically so hard. Was the best workaround we had considering the school is not the best resourced in the IT department and the IT working depends on whether it feels cooperative that day. Set up to be as simple as possible to use within the class and she prints it all out at home and takes it back in the following day... the long term plan was to use one of the school iPads but we're still waiting a year on for the central IT people to facilitate apps being added to them - so we just provide it, app it up, insure it, and truss it up in cases to within an inch of its life.

Phineyj · 28/08/2019 20:01

If it was really true you need to use tech at school to be competent with it as an adult, how do we explain that my generation can use it perfectly well? (I was born in 1972 and didn't use a computer in earnest till I was about 20). That's the thing about iPads - they're incredibly easy to use. School is surely for practising the harder stuff.

Phineyj · 28/08/2019 20:08

Kazzy, I feel his pain. I've been using a irritating resource on Hodder Dynamic Learning today. It takes way longer than flicking through actual paper journals. Pearson make great textbooks so I was sorry when I saw that announcement.

SummerPlace · 28/08/2019 23:32

I'd assume that figure included running costs, staff training, software, insurance etc?
Apple UK shows that the most expensive iPad cost less than £1000. AppleCare costs £129 - I presume that is that three years - and an Apple pencil costs £119.That leaves roughly £4 500/iPad for all the extras. Still pretty generous. And surely buying that many they would be able to negotiate a pretty good discount.

Kuponut · 29/08/2019 08:11

Apple UK shows that the most expensive iPad cost less than £1000

That's for an iPad Pro - you would NOT be having those loose in school - they're completely overpowered unless you're doing something high end like video editing and the repair costs for cracked screens are eyewatering (like £475 - I have one with a screen crack at the moment)... for a school you're looking at them having the basic iPad which is just under £300 retail cost (so probably cheaper through education discounts) and they use an older model apple pencil if you go down that route which are about £90. Also much much cheaper to repair because of how the screen's designed.

Not falling either way on the argument - just thought I'd clarify.

On a personal level I'm about to go back to uni for a career change away from teaching and I bloody LOVE e-book textbooks - I keep 'em all on my ipad and I can highlight, annotate and scrawl all over them with my apple pencil... however I appreciate that I'm a grown adult and for the average school kid the only use they're likely to put that kind of tech to is drawing penises all over and putting faces on all the sperm in the biology text books (because kids never change)

PumpkinPie2016 · 30/08/2019 17:56

I work in a large, English secondary and A have 4 sets of 20 iPads in school which we can book. It's a standard comprehensive.

To be honest, I tend to avoid using them - too many issues with wifi, passwords, pupils going on games when they should be doing research or whatever.

I very occasionally due either iPads or laptops in lesson -generally speaking, far more effective learning takes place using other methods!

I do set some homework online though.

Ligresa · 31/08/2019 00:02

however I appreciate that I'm a grown adult and for the average school kid the only use they're likely to put that kind of tech to is drawing penises all over and putting faces on all the sperm in the biology text books (because kids never change)

Nope. Dds school uses them like you do. Students have no interest in drawing penises. Not ipads, Microsoft Go or Pro. Bloody brilliant.

herculepoirot2 · 31/08/2019 06:45

Haven’t schools learnt from Accelerated Reader yet? Give students two things they could be doing, one difficult and not thrilling and the other easy and a little more thrilling, and what will they do?

noblegiraffe · 31/08/2019 08:42

Students have no interest in drawing penises.

Girls school?

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CarrieBlue · 31/08/2019 09:12

Nope. Dds school uses them like you do. Students have no interest in drawing penises. Not ipads, Microsoft Go or Pro. Bloody brilliant.

You’ve been in every lesson and seen every child’s ‘book’?

Technology in lessons needs massive amounts of support - the disruption caused by forgotten passwords, dodgy WiFi signals, too many logins to the network at one time across the school, malfunctioning software, broken hardware, etc., just make it far too difficult most of the time. Schools haven’t got budgets to pay it techs enough to attract people who can do the job properly or to replace equipment that becomes obsolete very quickly. A pp was suggesting using older model iPads. Great, except they have an even shorter working life as software moves past them - school can’t afford to replace do that’s what you’re stuck with. The richer kids have better tech at home, the poorer ones are disadvantaged yet again. Unless education is properly funded there is limited benefit from tech in schools.

SabineSchmetterling · 31/08/2019 09:49

I work in a girls school. We still get the odd willy drawn in textbooks.
iPads can have their place but I wouldn’t want kids on screens in my lessons all the time. As others have said, it’s so easy to underestimate how much time can get chewed up by forgotten passwords, dodgy WiFi and old equipment that just runs very slowly.
The Pearson announcement was also very poorly reported. They are switching from paper to ebooks for university textbooks for certain courses, all of which are at American universities and relate to the US arm of the business. They have no plans at all to go digital for UK secondary school books.

Ligresa · 31/08/2019 10:43

I hear what you are saying. Our experience has been positive, so that's all I can offer!

Kazzyhoward · 31/08/2019 11:57

I don't think the UK education system is ready for more IT. All I've seen at my son's school is a lot of time wasted in badly thought out initiatives that are soon forgotten. It's usually nothing but fur coat and no knickers. Teachers doing the same stuff, but using a computer instead of traditional methods. So, they'll still create a home made scrappy worksheet and email it out instead of printing it - but still the kids have to print or copy it to write the answers - doh! Likewise, online textbooks are often just pdfs of the paper one with no hyperlinks, no automatic marking included etc. Just one wasted opportunity after another. Then so many teachers just don't use the facilities they should, such as show my homework.

They should be using new teaching methods more suited to the IT available. My son has just done an open university module, all on his iphone - he could read a chapter whilst waiting for us shopping in the town centre - then before he could move on, he had to complete end-of-chapter texts, some multiple choice, some wanting specific single word or short sentence answers - all marked automatically so there was a running record showing his scores, which questions had to be repeated etc - all excellent for monitoring etc. No "human" intervention required by teachers etc. I thought at the time it would be ideal for schools as it leads, controls and monitors through each subject all automatically. In schools, that would give teachers a massive amount of extra time to help the strugglers if they don't have to do so much "hands on" work with everyone and let the more capable students study virtually independently.

CarrieBlue · 31/08/2019 12:08

They should be using new teaching methods more suited to the IT available.

The IT isn’t available, let alone the time to train to be able to use it (teachers or students), the maintenance costs, general IT back up. There is no money left in education, so a ‘scrappy, homemade’ worksheet that the teacher has had to spend time putting together to suit their students’ current level might be the best you will get. Please don’t blame the teacher ( which is how your post read).

noblegiraffe · 31/08/2019 12:15

They should be using new teaching methods more suited to the IT available

Why? Where’s the evidence that it gets better results than the scrappy worksheet made by an actual teacher who knows your child?

Students who have chosen to do self-directed learning with the open university are an entirely different cohort to a bunch of mixed ability Y9 kids who have to be in school, so even if it’s great for your DS, that doesn’t automatically mean that schools should be jumping on the (very expensive) bandwagon.

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Whatwouldbigfatfannydo · 31/08/2019 12:17

60 odd comments and not one consideration of the impact this will have on education for kids with additional support needs. Having worked in an ASN school (complex needs) with a class of non-verbal 7 year olds (some of whom were doubly incontinent) the apple tech was transformational for them. Some ended the year able to communicate through signing which was amazing. Naysayers think its a waste of money but you can't put a price of a child signing mum or dad for the first time

Ligresa · 31/08/2019 12:22

I don't find it all impressive that a teacher would have a 14 year old textbook tbh. Surely exams have been updated since then?

noblegiraffe · 31/08/2019 12:27

Maths hasn’t, Ligresa. It’s still the same old simultaneous equations and Pythagoras.

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noblegiraffe · 31/08/2019 12:29

Naysayers think its a waste of money

I don’t think anyone has suggested that ipads for children with severe SEN are a waste of money.

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Ligresa · 31/08/2019 12:29

Ah yes, maths! Sorry didn't think of that.

HarveySchlumpfenburger · 31/08/2019 12:33

What if the 14 year old text book is better than the modern one? The same applies to teaching methods tbh. You shouldn’t change the teaching methods to suit the technology. You should change them because they lead to more effective learning.

300million is a lot of money for some slightly dubious outcomes. There are a lot better ways of spending that sort of money.

Whatwouldbigfatfannydo · 31/08/2019 12:36

It was called a total waste of money in the OP. I just made the point that no one has considered the value to kids other than those in mainstream education, as is pretty common tbh...

Lyingonthesofainthedark · 31/08/2019 15:36

It isn't a waste of money at all. Children are the future of this country, and our future will need to be tech friendly if we are to complete in the world economy.

And your thread title is deeply unpleasant.

noblegiraffe · 31/08/2019 15:50

It was called a total waste of money in the OP

Yep. Your ASN base already has iPads. Schools generally already have tech. They are not giving iPads to a bunch of kids who have never seen an iPad before.

They are spending £300 million on giving an iPad to every child instead of e.g. making a significant investment in SEN education, which, if Scotland is like England, could really do with proper investment.

If I were a parent of a child with SEN I’d be pretty annoyed.

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