Are teachers paid for their holidays?

[sarararararah]

Hi 👋
I’ve been teaching for 15 years. Today office staff and TAs were saying that teachers are paid for their holidays but they aren’t. It’s often cited on here that we are paid IN the holidays but not FOR the holidays and are only paid for our contracted 195 days. Does anyone know where I can find out if that’s actually the case online? I’ve looked at the burgundy book but I can’t see anywhere where it says either way and would like clarity one way or the other - mainly so I don’t spout incorrect information! Thanks for any help.

This is one of these “only on Mumsnet” scenarios. Teachers get paid for holidays. Support staff get paid for holidays.

A teacher’s salary is quoted for the year. If she is in a school for September to July, she should get the same pay as someone who is permanently employed.

You are paid across 12 months. So you get 12 full months NI, pension, etc. They are paid term time only so they only get 36 rather than 52 weeks NI, pension etc.

So for example, my mum worked for school in an admin role for 10 years but only has 6 years contributions from that.

CraftyGin
This is one of these “only on Mumsnet” scenarios.

Nope its one of those "people think that they know things that they don't" scenarios.

Does this help? Supply Teachers Holidays and Holiday Pay England - NASUWT <a class="break-all" href="https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=www.nasuwt.org.uk/uploads/assets/uploaded/cdafaeab-563f-4f0a-b92c8e168924bbbb.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjG9LTf2PjhAhVKQRUIHTkcCJIQFjABegQIDxAE&usg=AOvVaw0-AdMW0eQXJEu1FbAJ0jP6" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=www.nasuwt.org.uk/uploads/assets/uploaded/cdafaeab-563f-4f0a-b92c8e168924bbbb.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjG9LTf2PjhAhVKQRUIHTkcCJIQFjABegQIDxAE&usg=AOvVaw0-AdMW0eQXJEu1FbAJ0jP6

Sorry, I read my posts back and it wasn’t clear. Regardless of how many days you are paid at what rate for, the vast majority of teachers are on whole year contracts. This means that although you might claim your pay would be £x more if school terms were longer the pay you get is treated as full or part time whole year pay and attracts NI etc as such.

The vast majority of admin and TAs are on term time only contracts. So while they might have their pay averaged across the year and thus be paid the same amount each month they are being paid as if they are only work 36-38 weeks a year and thus attract proportionately less NI etc.

It’s been a bone of contention for years as the argument often gets people taking at cross purposes.

Your salary as a teacher is for 195 days.

This means you have a daily rate. When I was on supply for a school I got my salary/195 as a daily rate but nothing for holidays.

So I "earned" more in working months but not paid in holidays. I had to move money to save it for summer etc. But overall, I actually earned the same as I would've done on a contract.

So teachers don't get "paid" as holidays are non working. Reality is not that, obviously but that's the official line. But if I do Easter holiday revision days I get paid my daily rate as I am prepping for and teaching a day I am not actually being paid for.

If teachers were paid the same as other jobs and with 6 weeks holiday a year we'd get paid loads more. I am up for that, obviously

Teachers are on whole year contracts based on 195 working days.

But then surely the day rate for a teacher is an enormous sum if you get £30k plus for just 195 days work. Have I got that wrong?

195 days or 1265 hours is merely the current limit on the hours which the headteacher may direct (tell you when to do) your work and is usually taken up by mostly teaching and then meetings.

You are paid to carry out the duties specified in your contract and therefore expected to work as many hours outside the 1265 as necessary to fulfil your role, as all salaried posts.

BackOnceAgainWithABurnerEmail

Teachers would get paid more if terms were longer because the hours contracted for are 1265, in crease the hours increase the pay.

Its fairly simple.

See

MsRabbitRocks

those directed hours must be within the 190 days that pupils are in school and the five days for training as this is about holidays I have never seen nor has anyone been able to produce from either of the published books anything about paid holidays.

Daily rate is calculated salary/195.

Yes it's a decent rate, based on that. Bear in mind teachers (esp secondary) have degrees, postgraduate qualifications and a qualifying year....so like other professionals.

My solicitor charges a buttload more than a teacher gets.

If you were to strike, you'd lose 1/195 of your salary.

I think @backonceagain has it. We’re definitely talking cross purposes. So in effect, we’re both right. I mean that we don’t get paid for the holidays, but clearly we do get NI, pension etc. And she means that support staff don’t get that so aren’t paid for the holidays in the same way. We’re both right!

Thanks for your help everyone!

Teachers are salaried, so they are paid to work the specified term dates and the holidays are as stated, they are paid the same each month thus teachers get 13 weeks holidays plus may bank holiday, TA's often only get paid term time and by the hour, very different.

If you go on strike for a day you lose 1/195 of your pay. You are therefore paid for 195 days...

When you go on strike (dim and distant past) you lose 1/195 of your pay

If you were to strike, you'd lose 1/195 of your salary.
Now that's interesting as I'm an academic and we recently had a case where it was ruled that we could not be docked 1/261 of our pay for a day's strike (or similar) and it has to be 1/365 because otherwise we can not be asked to work weekends (open days, conferences etc).
I assumed that teachers were the same, you can be asked to do things over the school holidays (usually that you have chosen or at least chosen the timing). You could do those at weekends and you will also have e.g. Saturday school events, trips etc.

No, if you strike you can only have 1/365 deducted because of regulations around strikes, which have nothing to do with teachers pay and conditions. They were quite clear about this last time we did have a strike.

Well, you live and learn!

Just double checked and it’s in the burgundy book that strike deductions are 1/365.

Oh 🤔