The Line of Succession

[PrincessTigger]

I think the Succession to the Crown Act needs to be updated so that a) members can request their removal from the line, and b) anyone on the line who has become so compromised they could never actually do the job if called upon can be removed by MPs. If there were a series of terrible accidents, Andrew for example could never seriously become King.

I think the removal of primogeniture also needs to be applied retrospectively not just Charlotte onwards.

No matter how unlikely it is that they should be called upon, I think it’s ridiculous that they still get the perks of being in the line of succession while destroying their own credibility to actually do that role. Perhaps we’d have gotten better behaviour from certain Dukes of York if they’d known there was a chance to lose their place.

Doubt it. Most Daily Mail readers ( and the Royals themselves) seem to consider being mean about your family a worse crime than associating with sex offenders, possibly having sex with trafficked teenagers, lying on tv and avoiding FBI questioning by hiding in Windsor Castle.

And once again, the King (or Queen) has nothing to do with Acts of Parliament. It had nothing to do with "making Charles look like a man of action" - he had nothing to do with it.

Except he did:

King Charles asks UK parliament to allow brother and sister to act in his place | Euronews

That link doesn't go anywhere.

And as I said - he may have discussed it, but he can't make Parliament do it if they disagree with him.

I think, if the King asked fir them to he removed, there would be no reason for them to refuse his request. I suspect the truth is that Harry is his son, and he loves them and hopes to see his grandchildren. Its the tabloid press and people who are overinvested in a sad family breakdown who are baying for this. Or, failing that, hoping a marriage with two small children breaks up, and the children are kidnapped by the Royal Family, never to see their mother again. Or preferably the children are proven to be surrogates/dolls and are never seen again. I think Harry's relationship with William is over though, and he will have no qualms about asking Parliament to remove Harry and the children from the line of succession.

Harry's relationship with William is over though, and he will have no qualms about asking Parliament to remove Harry and the children from the line of succession.

I doubt that's a precedent William will want to set. For one thing, who knows what his children will get up to in future years.

Harry's relationship with William is over though, and he will have no qualms about asking Parliament to remove Harry and the children from the line of succession.

I don’t think he will remove them from the line of succession but I suspect he will remove their titles of Prince and Princess like the Danish Queen did a few months ago with her grandchildren apart from the ones in direct line. It wouldn’t surprise me if he also did the same to Beatrice and Eugenie.

On second thoughts I’m not sure he could remove the titles of Beatrice and Eugenie as they were born as princesses like Harry was born a Prince as grandchildren of a reigning monarch. Hopefully someone with better knowledge will confirm.

That link doesn't go anywhere.

Works fine for me but in any case here's another:

King Charles asks for amendment to Regency Act to ensure Princes Andrew and Harry never step in (telegraph.co.uk)

I don't think either Charles or William wants to start messing with the line of succession because it would set a precedent that could harm the Cambridge kids and any future grandkids.

The world is changing, society no longer accepts that there are dozens of random people who receive free houses and income simply for having "royal blood" without being working royals. Royals who are high profile but are not working royals (like Beatrice and Eugenie, and this is the position Charlotte and Louis will be in too) have a hard time, since they're so famous they have intense press interest and security needs, but still need to have careers and financially support themselves. A lot of careers aren't compatible with the level of press interest and scrutiny royals are under. Beatrice and Eugenie were trashed by the press for years starting when they were still very young girls for no real reason, other than being young girls who liked to go out and were used to having nice holidays, didn't always wear the most flattering outfits, and took some time to find lasting careers. Beatrice and Eugenie had public-funded security until well into their 20s, then when it was stripped from them Andrew had to take over paying for their security himself (which probably meant the Queen was paying, but privately). Will Charlotte and Louis get free residences, and public-funded security? Will they be expected to be full-time working royals to support George as there won't be many working royals around by then, or will they be expected to find careers of their own? Or both?

Lots of kids struggle to find their own paths in life, and Charlotte and Louis will have to navigate finding their own paths while under intense press scrutiny, and while having to balance the demands of being siblings to the King, with modern day expectations that royals not in direct line of descent work and have jobs of their own. They may stumble or go through rough patches (I don't even mean anything bad, but just periods of not knowing what they want to do in life, and let's face it, if Charlotte goes to a nightclub more than twice as a teenager the press will label her the party princess and trash her for it).

The last thing William wants is to create a precedent where anytime Charlotte or Louis go through any kind of struggle - whether real or invented by the tabloids - the press and public call for them to be stripped of their titles and stripped of their place in the line of succession.

He could do it. But I don't think he would because of the implications for his own children. At some point Charlotte and Louis will no longer be in the direct line of succession.

No matter what Harry or Andrew do and have done there's no chance, imo, of Charles or William starting to mess with the line of succession.

Look at how unpopular Charles was when Diana died, and at various other points. Then William was getting the workshy label.

They all know they could be next on the popularity hit list. And if not them their spouse or child.

If suddenly people know that it's possible to remove people from their titles and place in the succession then it becomes a normal thing to do when someone steps out of line. They can't risk that being a thing in case it's them that's next.

Plus if you can start manipulating the line of succession based on worthiness then how long is it before people start staying "Well Princess Anne would be better because..." or "The Duke of Kent has always been hard working etc" which then just risks people wanting to pick someone, which would be the end of things for them.

Yes I think this is true actually. If you strip HRH's from the second and 3rd in line you have to do it for Charlotre and Louis. Personally I think we should just have monarch, spouse, heir and spouse as working Royals with HRH titles with the others expected to make their own way. The Late Queen should have done it before Harry married knowing Charles had a vision for a slimmed fown Monarchy but she passed the buck. Maybe Charles or William will do it, but I suspect the only thing that will make him do it is if there is an outcry over Charlotte and Louis being bankrolled when they are Jo longer cute toddlers but middle aged adults with their own issues ( which is unfair on them) The Royals know what they have to do to survive and will do what they have to to ensure their positions for as long as possible.

I think the fact she didn’t do it shows that Charles’ slimmed down version didn’t include any impact on his sons or grandchildren.

When the primogeniture change was made Charles was already heavily involved in the big future decisions so if he’d wanted it it would have been very easy to change the LP’s to only the eldest child of the eldest child to be HRH Princess or Princess. The younger children and any other grandchildren could be Lady/Lord Windsor. All of the grandchildren were just future people at that point, so no one would have seen it as a negative against one child or one grandchild in particular.

I don’t think Charles ever intended anything other than both of his sons and their spouses to be working royals and all his grandchildren to be titled.

Back when it first came up imo slimming was just that all of Andrew’s (then future) children and all of Edward’s (then future) children weren’t going to be working royals.

It would have totally been expected back then that atm the full time working royals right now would be Charles, his spouse, Andrew, his spouse, Edward, his spouse and Anne. With Charles’ children and their spouses stepping up more and more as the older generation of QEII, Philip, Alexandra, the Gloucesters and Kent’s started to step away.

He would not for a second have been expecting to have him, Camilla, Anne, Edward, Sophie, William and Kate. Especially as the age difference between him, Andrew and Edward will mean that they would be bridge for William until his children were older.

So he's just tinkering round the edges as usual? Slimming down shouldn't mean business as usual once we get to Williams generation when again my children will be bankrolling his 3 children to be doing not that much work. In 50 years, who is going to bother standing around flag waving while a middle aged Prince Louis opens a hospital? It is cruel to them for a start. If Charles was serious about slimming down he would do it now, so that Charlotte and Louis grow up with the knowledge that they will have to make their own way. He will eventually have to do what the European Royals have done. Other countries manage to not need 8 people fully funded to do State duties

Tbh I think the future for Charlotte and Louis is why William is so furious at Harry.

Obviously just my opinion, but I think they’d have grown up expecting to be similar to the Wessex/Edinburgh children (and Harry’s children would be the same) - around all the family events and relatively high profile whike young due to their parents, but expecting to have careers and only rock out at big events. George would have had the same light entry and chance to have military/family time like Harry and William did.

However, in 15 years when George is 25 chances are that the only full time royals will be William, Kate, Edward and Sophie as Charles and Camilla will be knocking 90. Also if Edward and/or Sophie are remotely infirm pensioners the slimming will be seriously slim and may mean the younger wales children end up being working royals and possibly considerably younger than when William and Harry had to do it.

But Williams children would be the equivalent of Harry, so if hed have stayed, they would have expected to be working Royals, so that hasnt changed. Archie and Lilli would be, the equivalent of Bea and Eugenie, but they wouldnt be welcome now I presume. Aldo, what, really is a ' working Royal? William and Kate do 100 engagements a year ( some that could be 10 minute phonecalls) and include things like ' going to Wimbledon' and 'going to a film Premier'. It's not taxing or time consuming. Their huge staff do all the prep and research yet they manage to work school hours, term time only for an average of one day a week. They have hundreds of patronages that mostly never see a Royal visit. Charities have been shown to get no benefit from having a Royal patronage. So much of what they do is ' busywork' and people fall over themselves to proclaim how hard they work and what a terrible life they have with no privacy despite having deals with the press that protects their privacy for 80% of their time, and living in several private Stately homes/palaces/castles. William, Kate and their children could easily step up and cover whatever duties they are needed for.

I think its more what @YetMoreNewBeginnings said. They don't want to start rocking the boat because they know that any of the 3 Wales children could go off the rails, and once they are no longer children, all bets are off. The experience of the last 3 'spares' has not been good. Not to mention Edward viii being an actual traitor.

But Williams children would be the equivalent of Harry, so if hed have stayed, they would have expected to be working Royals, so that hasnt changed.

I don’t think they would have expected Charlotte and Louis to be working royals if they also had Harry and Meghan.

I think that would have been the start of the eldest child only needing to do it and the younger ones being like Harry’s children and not working royals.

Full time William, Kate, Harry, Meghan, and older Andrew, Edward and Sophie - as the plan would have been - is very different from full time William and Kate, and older Edward and Sophie.

Overall though the family will never want the public to realise that getting rid of specific ones is possible (and probably easier than people would think) as they could be the next to make the faux pas (or major fuck up) that sparks the “should they be removed like X was…”