The Press & The Royals: a discussion

[Whaeanui]

As we were just having a great discussion on this topic I’m going to try again to continue it on a thread of its own. A previous thread highlighted two particularly prolific ‘royal reporters’, but the same is true for all. They often manufacture stories to create divisions between the women in the family, more often than the men. The public seem to feed off this and none of the family get treated very well except the monarch. So do we think it is possible for the royal family to stay relevant and in the publics mind without their unhealthy relationship with the media? Can social media replace this? What do you think they can do to make positive changes that would reflect an understanding of the mental health challenges the media intrusion results in? Also their role in charities that deal with mental health and misogyny, mistreatment of women etc could be impacted by this too. Thoughts?
Please do not derail this thread by discussing your personal dislike of particular members or if they deserve it. I would like a discussion on how the royal family could change the relationship with the press.

I so agree with this.

The difference between the two statements William and Harry gave about their Mum's Bashir interview was very stark.
William calling his mother paranoid was a step too far for me. He icily focussed on her being tricked into the interview, as opposed to the content of it. It was quite uncomfortable to listen to.
Harry's statement was the complete opposite.

I found it interesting there wasn’t much of a reaction to William calling his mother paranoid, something both Charles and the press had been saying to her for years. It was sad to see him say it. She wasn’t. She was absolutely bang on.

Interesting through, how Harry gets a free pass to tell his truth because it’s his recollection through the lens of his childhood experience and trauma, but William is criticised. William was older and was probably Diana’s closest confidant at this time. He may have witnessed first hand her “paranoia” at thinking she was being bugged or rejecting a security detail that she felt was spying on her. I can totally see why he saw the interview itself as a trick and a betrayal and doesn’t want it to see the light of day again. Not saying necessarily that she didn’t tell her truth in it. He probably felt the exploitation of her to get the interview affected her mental health and had possible further consequences to her ongoing security/safety.

i just see them coming from different perspectives, Harry sees all this “truth telling” as freeing while William is wary. Harry wants to have everything out in the open for the public to hear from the horses mouth, William is very guarded about personal/private feelings. There is a possibility at some point in the future (and with the benefit of time and hindsight) that Harry may regret some of his interviews too - whether he feels he has over shared, possibly as the result of intensive therapy and/or psychoactive substance use.

William is criticised. William was older and was probably Diana’s closest confidant at this time. He may have witnessed first hand her “paranoia” at thinking she was being bugged or rejecting a security detail that she felt was spying on her. I can totally see why he saw the interview itself as a trick and a betrayal and doesn’t want it to see the light of day again. Not saying necessarily that she didn’t tell her truth in it. He probably felt the exploitation of her to get the interview affected her mental health and had possible further consequences to her ongoing security/safety.

Oh come on, you know the damage of calling the late Diana paranoid, her own son. It’s dismissing all her legitimate concerns. Using the word paranoid is deliberate. He can say what he wants, his truth, and i can criticise it. I don’t think she was paranoid at all. She had concerns that were based on real things the palace did.

As for ‘psychoactive substance use’, do you actually know anything about ayahuasca? It doesn’t appear so.

There really are so many new posters today! @MrsMaxDeWinter @Roussette we were right about that other thread and PBP!

Honestly, I've been here too long. I just sense it. You know those sniffer dogs at the airport.... MN ought to employ me as a human one of those to sniff out PBPs 😂

Something was off about that poster :)

I hope you all read the link posted by @Roussette

It's a brilliant analysis.

This popped out at me.

A problem for Harry and Meghan right now is that their allegations of racism, misogyny and tabloid treachery make so many Brits feel awkward.
But perhaps the reason Camilla will not be badly damaged by the allegation of courting the tabloids is because it’s largely true. A willingness to play their game, often on their terms, goes a long way towards explaining why she’s been the recipient of good press.

Those on the royal beat reckon she makes a point during public appearances of establishing friendly eye contact with reporters from the Daily Mail, the mouthpiece of Middle England. Over the years, she’s developed a close friendship with Geordie Greig, an Old Etonian and former editor of the Daily Mail. Late last year, Charles and Camilla tapped another Mail executive and old Etonian, Tobyn Andreae, as their director of communications. “She took the decision to walk towards the gunfire,” says Peter Hunt, a move which ended up reducing the hail of bullets coming her way. For their part, Palace insiders vehemently deny that Camilla traded stories in return for favourable coverage, Harry’s most damaging allegation.

A willingness to play their game, often on their terms, goes a long way towards explaining why she’s been the recipient of good press.

I absolutely think this is true. Both the press and the public actually admire this about her.

Absolutely, when William called Diana "paranoid" in my opinion it was a betrayal and disrespectful to her memory.

This thread reminds me of an old Malcolm X quote:

"The media’s the most powerful entity on earth. They have the power to make the innocent guilty and to make the guilty innocent, and that’s power. Because they control the minds of the masses. The press is so powerful in its image-making role, it can make the criminal look like he’s a the victim and make the victim look like he’s the criminal. This is the press, an irresponsible press. It will make the criminal look like he’s the victim and make the victim look like he’s the criminal. If you aren’t careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed and loving the people who are doing the oppressing."

We are being fed a steady stream of specific narratives, to influence how we feel. Some people accept the stories uncritically, whilst other realise they're being manipulated.

everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but all I’m saying is William was there. He can choose his own words, as can Harry. Both men are probably deeply messed up about what happened to their mum, while Harry was retracing her journey in Paris and is triggered by flashbulbs… William may well blame the process which alienated Diana from the security/protections of the RF. I don’t see a conspiracy here, just two men who see things differently.

And no, I don’t know a lot about non-prescription drugs (I am from a medical related profession) but it is well documented that marajuana can affect mental health including paranoia.

@BelleHathor I love that quote by Malcom X! He’s so right isn’t he? The press control the masses, it’s so clear and obvious.

@Toomanycaketins the largest study so far has shown marijuana can induce short-term paranoia in some people that leaves the body- 50% of those injected with THC & 30% in the placebo group. It can have positive affects on mental health too, and is legal in California and other states.

@BelleHathor So agree with your post

It all depends, doesn't it, on whether you believe everything you read. Or whether you think 'hang on... this doesn't ring true'.
And I apply that to some of what H&M say also, before anyone jumps in saying this.

I mentioned before about a podcast I'm listening to, one episode has been about witness statements, and how memories of what happened change with time, with outside influence, with what you want to believe, or don't want to believe.

Oh come on, you know the damage of calling the late Diana paranoid, her own son. It’s dismissing all her legitimate concerns. Using the word paranoid is deliberate. He can say what he wants, his truth, and i can criticise it. I don’t think she was paranoid at all. She had concerns that were based on real things the palace did

Absolutely. I got a real heart sink when William said that - gaslighting her. Also confirmed in my mind we'd well and truly lost him to the institution. A well entrenched institution man now.

Oh my gosh yes. I'm so glad you said this. Because I thought exactly the same at that moment. And the contrast between their two statements (W&H) was so stark.

@Whaeanui @Roussette Yes, I love that quote, and once you "see" the Media in action over whatever the decided narrative of the day is you can't unsee it.

The truth is not many people are able to see that they're being manipulated and nudged into thinking or believing certain things. Whereas others are able to assess the facts.

It's emotional thinking versus logical thinking. By using certain words you can evoke an emotional response whereby critical thinking goes out of the window and the media excels at this as their survival is dependent on it.

Noam Chomsky wrote a book on how the media works to "manufacturer consent".

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=34LGPIXvU5M&pp=ygUibm9hbSBjaG9tc2t5IG1hbnVmYWN0dXJpbmcgY29uc2VudA%3D%3D

Just as a side tangent… does anyone know if there were any allegations of underhand tactics with bashir getting the Michael Jackson interview?

I totally agree with you. You'd think it was only Harry who lost his mother that terrible night. Direct your ire against Martin Bashir who obtained that interview with dodgy and I think criminal means. William was Diana's much loved son and I doubt she would have approved of most of the rubbish written on here about him

I totally thought this too.

Also, Diana was repeating the same things she had told Andrew Morton, so this was so unnecessary.

Don't know how William sleeps at night, he surely was told to say this.

everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but all I’m saying is William was there. He can choose his own words, as can Harry. Both men are probably deeply messed up about what happened to their mum, while Harry was retracing her journey in Paris and is triggered by flashbulbs… William may well blame the process which alienated Diana from the security/protections of the RF. I don’t see a conspiracy here, just two men who see things differently.

Not sure what you are getting at exactly. But William also took the trip down the tunnel and has also compared the treatment of KM to Diana in the past.

There is a strange story today about a letter written by Meghan to Charles. It reads like a leak from BP, but of course Meghan will get blamed for it. If this came from BP, I hope Harry just throws up his hands and skips the whole thing, because I am so exhausted reading it, I can only imagine what it is like to live it.

I also don't understand the letter story.

This letter is coming out after 2yrs from the palace. So recollections don't vary then. I remember MM saying she was writing letters.

The media really pushed the narrative Diana was mentally unwell, for years and years, including that she was paranoid so that her various claims of poor treatment and struggle could be easily dismissed. Obviously we know that mental health issues don’t necessarily mean someone can’t be trusted or is completely without rationality and logical thinking but you wouldn’t know that the way both media and many people talk. Harry is getting similar treatment, Dr Jess Taylor talks about the pathologisation of Harry, I’ll try and find it because it’s interesting and relevant to how media frame mental health when they’re writing about certain people. It’s a way to discredit people, especially the use of paranoid.

Here it is:

*Update on the deliberate public pathologisation of Harry - just listened to radio interview in which they said he’s ‘delusional’ and ‘paranoid’ because he ‘takes drugs’ ‘smoked some weed’ and there’s ‘evidence that people who take drugs have mental health issues.’

He is unfortunately, the next famous person to be publicly positioned as mentally ill in order to silence/discredit/humiliate them.

This pattern is becoming incredibly & unashamedly obvious.

I know it annoys people, but this is why I talk so much about pathologisation.

This is why I’ve said for years that the ‘end mental health stigma’ narrative isn’t real. Mental health can and will be used to position you as unstable, deceitful, manipulative, dangerous, abusive, attention seeking and non-credible as soon as that is required.

We can keep pretending we see ‘mental health the same as physical health’ and we can keep pretending that ‘no shame in mental health’ but be under no illusion:

If someone needs to shut you up, the first port of call will be to use mental health and disorder against you.

And don’t even get me STARTED on the issue with the argument that Harry taking Class A drugs or having a joint is making him ‘unstable’ and ‘delusional’ when we know many MPs and senior leaders in our country and the world regularly take drugs.

Watch as they take every single thing they ever heard about him, from this one thing he said when he was 14 to that time he looked sad on a photo to infer things about his mental health, his ‘delusions’, his ‘personality’, and frame him as disordered and non credible. You watch

This is what happens to people who break a rule, leave a family, talk about abuse…

Character assassination ALWAYS includes mental disorder accusations and distance diagnosis - because the entire field of psychiatry and MH relies upon stigma to differentiate and label people.*

Dr Jess Taylor, Psychologist

It's quite odd that Harry is applauded for telling his truth but people are against William for telling his - he has had first hand experience of his mother's feelings, fears and yes, paranoia. Why is he not allowed to say that? He had a mother who leant on him emotionally when he was a boy. He was there - he knows how his mother felt, behaved. He also knows how any feelings of paranoia she had affected him.

People got a 'real heart sinking....'

I have the feeling Diana probably did her fair share of manipulation, including of her eldest son, and I absolutely think he has every right to make his statement and is the person who had as much insight, probably far more than pretty much everyone else, into his mother's fears. In his statement he says the press 'played on her fears, fuelled paranoia' - I can't see how this is anything but the truth.

Of course, it's just being used as yet another big stick to beat him with. Why is this ok?

@Coxspurplepippin who is using a big stick to beat him? Harry’s every word is heavily analysed and criticised on these boards, why can we not have a comment on William’s criticism of his deceased mother? He is using an often repeated media line about his mother to further damage her, in my opinion. It was completely unnecessary for him to say. Everyone understands what BBC did was wrong and he’s got every right to speak on it. His words on his mothers paranoia, I think, were unnecessary and contribute to an unpleasant unfair narrative. We’re not starting several threads about it and going on about it for two years so relax, a few comments are not a ‘big stick’. Is there anything about the media and how they behave you’d like to comment on?