Page 4 | Does Camilla have to curtsey to Charles?

SenecaFallsRedux · 13/12/2022 23:16

Where the queen is of royal blood (regnant) there can be no king, therefore a queen regnants husband is titled a prince.

Well, that is not precisely true. There have been circumstances in which the husband of a Queen regnant has been given the title King. The husbands of Mary I of England and Mary Queen of Scots both had the title King.

Queen Victoria wanted Albert to have the title King Consort, but there was considerable opposition to that, so she had to settle for Prince Consort.

It's true that generally speaking, the title King is considered higher than Queen, a relic of the Salic law that prevailed in most European countries and that prevented women from being monarchs. But there really is nothing except tradition to prevent a Queen regnant from having a husband who is titled King. He would be a king consort.

SammyScrounge · 05/01/2023 14:36

pinneddownbytabbies · 12/12/2022 16:47

Oh honestly.

Yes, I'm sure they have to bow and scrape to one another all the time, otherwise it's off to the Tower with them, and a flogging to teach them the error of their ways.

I was moved to tears when Princess Anne curtsied to her mother's coffin. Just a quick dip but it said.so much.
Compare with Meghan's exaggerated curtsey and her buffoonish grin in the documentary. Come to think of it Meghan always falls short in comparison with real royal ladies.

Thisistyresome · 05/01/2023 16:24

Pinkrosesbloom · 12/12/2022 16:34

...and Kate to William?

saw this in the news, and it seems protocol requires girlfriends to curtsey to royals.

“When I was researching my biography of King Charles, I discovered his female staff were running a competition to see who could perform the deepest curtsey without falling over.

A former girlfriend of his also confided that protocol demanded she curtsey to him, leading one evening to a clash of heads when he mistimed an attempt to kiss her.”

did Camilla and Kate curtsey to Charles/William when they were dating?

And does it stop after they marry?

and what about the children, do they need to curtsey to their royal father? Or are they exempt because they are born royal?

does anyone know the protocols?

No, though that is probably different if she were to be awarded some kind of award and he was presenting it to her at a formal engagement, when she would do so as part of receiving it.

The blood thing is nonsense, the HRH title matters for protocol (hence why some royals are stripped of the title for public events but technically have it for private engagements).

Oher · 05/01/2023 16:27

I met Will & Kate at a work event and they’d asked their staff to pass on in advance the message that they were very informal and that it was entirely up to us whether anyone wanted to curtsey/bow or not.

So I can’t imagine the family is particularly formal in private.

AngelinaFibres · 06/01/2023 19:54

Pinkrosesbloom · 12/12/2022 16:52

That’s a good point. What happens if they don’t do it. Do they get reprimanded? Cold shouldered?

the research I quoted was from a recent book on Charles, so I assume these traditions are still in place?

I was intrigued by Charles girlfriend having to bow to him because of protocol...and wondered what happens when they get married...

Diana had to call Charles sir until they were engaged. Then she could call him Charles. So very, very odd. She was a virgin until the wedding but can you imagine, in your own life, having to call your partner sir whilst in bed. Eeeeeewwwww

AngelinaFibres · 06/01/2023 20:01

Topseyt123 · 12/12/2022 19:36

I find curtseying cringeworthy, outdated and just plain odd. Like fuck would I ever curtsey to my DH, or expect him to bow to me.

The mere thought is hilarious. 🤣🤣

I think it definitely looked less odd when women's legs were covered by long skirts. Now you can see the mechanics of it it looks so weird and outdated

Andsoforth · 06/01/2023 20:20

Diana had to call Charles sir until they were engaged. Then she could call him Charles. So very, very odd. She was a virgin until the wedding but can you imagine, in your own life, having to call your partner sir whilst in bed. Eeeeeewwwww

I wonder if Camilla did too?

I need some brain bleach now.

moonflower76 · 24/02/2023 10:29

It should be changed to a nod of the head now.

purpledalmation · 24/02/2023 16:03

moonflower76 · 24/02/2023 10:29

It should be changed to a nod of the head now.

Yes, just a bit of respect, no more curtsying.

vera99 · 28/02/2023 16:50

Who the hell does he think he is the King or summat ... in Thailand they crawl on the floor and his mistress was elevated to Royal Consort whilst married to his 3rd wife and when he fell out with her had her put in prison and then taken out again and currently she has 'disappeared'. Andrew would love it there - in fact he often visited.

BadgerB · 07/03/2023 15:25

thebellagio · 12/12/2022 16:40
I'm sure it was in last season of the crown when Diana walked into a room and forgot to curtsy to anyone, and Charles had to tell her to look around the room every time she enters a room.

Are you sure this wasn't just an episode of The Crown? Diana had been around royals all her life and knew the protocol

BadgerB · 07/03/2023 15:30

pinneddownbytabbies · 12/12/2022 16:47
Oh honestly.
Yes, I'm sure they have to bow and scrape to one another all the time.

I wonder what "Scraping" involves? Does ones scrape the floor? Or the paintwork? Surely not the royal personage!

pinneddownbytabbies · 07/03/2023 15:36

BadgerB · 07/03/2023 15:30

pinneddownbytabbies · 12/12/2022 16:47
Oh honestly.
Yes, I'm sure they have to bow and scrape to one another all the time.

I wonder what "Scraping" involves? Does ones scrape the floor? Or the paintwork? Surely not the royal personage!

Apparently, having just looked it up, the scraping refers to the scraping noise of your foot on the floor as you bow or curtsey.

Fancy that. Every day is a school day on MN!

BadgerB · 07/03/2023 15:38

WomanhoodIsABirthright · 12/12/2022 17:03
I'm sure she expected people to defer to her once she got her title (staff said so), so she really should have followed the protocol.
I think a lot of her strop back to America was because she couldn't stand coming second to Kate.

I've read somewhere (I think on MN) that Meghan's staff tell her visitors that they should curtsey to her and call her Duchess. Of course, it may not be true, but it would be interesting to know. She surely wouldn't expect it from A listers she's trying to smooze, but maybe from job applicants?

BadgerB · 07/03/2023 15:48

Bernadinetta · 12/12/2022 17:41
Anyone remember the scene early on in The Crown where a young Elizabeth sees her grandmother, Queen Mary for the first time since becoming queen and the elderly Queen Mary curtsies to her granddaughter, the queen.

PlaitBilledDuckyPuss · 12/12/2022 17:44
Inaccurate - she wouldn't have to. Queens don't curtsey to one another.

She would - and did. A Queen Consort curtseys to a Queen Regnant. Certainly in Queen Mary's day - she was a stickler for protocol

SenecaFallsRedux · 07/03/2023 23:23

BadgerB · 07/03/2023 15:25

thebellagio · 12/12/2022 16:40
I'm sure it was in last season of the crown when Diana walked into a room and forgot to curtsy to anyone, and Charles had to tell her to look around the room every time she enters a room.

Are you sure this wasn't just an episode of The Crown? Diana had been around royals all her life and knew the protocol

Exactly. She grew up on the Sandringham estate and her father was equerry to the Queen.

I think that scene was from the movie Spencer. I remember thinking it was highly unlikely.

Novella4 · 08/03/2023 08:10

vera99 · 28/02/2023 16:50

Who the hell does he think he is the King or summat ... in Thailand they crawl on the floor and his mistress was elevated to Royal Consort whilst married to his 3rd wife and when he fell out with her had her put in prison and then taken out again and currently she has 'disappeared'. Andrew would love it there - in fact he often visited.

I pointed out that Thailand is one of the few countries other than the UK to persist with coronation.
Royalist posters said I was culturally insensitive ( paraphrasing) re Thailand
Hmmm

MrsMitford3 · 08/03/2023 08:25

Obviously not necessarily 100% historically accurate but just re-watching the wonderful Victoria and her small children do bow and curtsey to her when they enter the room.
Prince Albert asks Vicky if he does not get a curtsey and she said "but you are not the Monarch Papa"

I suspect there is some truth in this-fascinating.

vera99 · 08/03/2023 08:25

Novella4 · 08/03/2023 08:10

I pointed out that Thailand is one of the few countries other than the UK to persist with coronation.
Royalist posters said I was culturally insensitive ( paraphrasing) re Thailand
Hmmm

Show quote history

He is an absolute monster in every sense of the word, whereas his father was much loved (though killed his brother accidentally as a teenager and was covered up) but anyhow you disappear or go to prison for a long time making any criticism of the monarchy. The 'institution' is used as a bulwark against true democracy and underpins the armies entrenched many decades long total power.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8681577/Thai-king-pardons-concubine-flies-Germany.html

vera99 · 08/03/2023 08:36

That said, the British Royal Family is no equivalent - we have executed 2 monarchs to keep them in check. Rightly in my opinion with a moral time machine and a Republican bent !

.

Novella4 · 08/03/2023 08:46

Yes none of the remaining coronations are exactly the same but they ALL difffer from inauguration
All coronations invoke a higher power to bolster and reinforce the idea that tue 'king' is there by right.

I'm a Republican and even I feel the sight of Camilla being anointed and on the throne will be extremely jarring . The closer we get to the coronation,the more people are reminded of Diana

vera99 · 08/03/2023 09:27

It would appear the David Icke/anti WEF/anti-vax / conspiracy theory nuts have taken to protesting against the Royal Family as they are seen as satanic agents of ancient reptilian bloodlines and the like. These are well nuts, but post covid they very vocal and are now protesting openly and vocally against the Royal Family. Charles has spoken about the Great Reset - looks like a genie is out of the bottle. There is a danger of competing anti-monarchical interests conflating at the Coronation, and we go 'Full France'.

EdithWeston · 08/03/2023 10:17

Novella4 · 08/03/2023 08:46

Yes none of the remaining coronations are exactly the same but they ALL difffer from inauguration
All coronations invoke a higher power to bolster and reinforce the idea that tue 'king' is there by right.

I'm a Republican and even I feel the sight of Camilla being anointed and on the throne will be extremely jarring . The closer we get to the coronation,the more people are reminded of Diana

Not British ones.

The Divine Right was abolished in the revolution of 1688 (something that the conspiracy theorists really can't seem to grasp)

The reason we have religious ceremonies is because the Church is Established. That's not part of buttressing the monarchy, it's a separate issue (you can have an Established religion in a republic, you can have monarchies in countries with no Established religion).

FinallyHere · 08/03/2023 12:21

The traditional answer to the question 'does the Queen curtesy to the king' is "only in the bedroom"

BadgerB · 08/03/2023 13:42

Novella4 · Today 08:46
I'm a Republican and even I feel the sight of Camilla being anointed and on the throne will be extremely jarring . The closer we get to the coronation,the more people are reminded of Diana

You may be. "People"? I don't think so. The woman has been dead for decades. Move on. Tragic accidents happen.