The circle of wealth

[TarasChoc]

Can anyone please explain where this circle of wealth the Royal family enjoys comes from.
We know that William and Harry received inheritances from Diane and the Queen mother, who would also presumably left generous amounts to other grand and great grand children. I'm assuming phillips will was similar. What about Princess Margaret?
Will Camilla and Catherine also have vast sums to leave? Where will they have acquired them from? I'm aware Diane herself inherited money but surely she must've had income also to have been able to leave behind such signifigant inheritances?
It just seems the Royal family has grown a lot in recent years, 4 children and spouses, 8 grandchildren, and around a dozen or so great grandchildren so far, possibly more to come, plus a beloved niece, nephew and their children.
If history is anything to go by they'll all get an inheritance from the queen.
What funds all of this, we hear about the queen's personal wealth been different from taxpayers funds but what drives each royals personal wealth and how are they growing it enough to leave ample behind for the future 2nd and 3rd generations to live very privileged lives off?

I don't know much but the crown generates a lot of income. The crown estate, the duchy of Cornwall etc gross millions. I bet I could retire comfortably for life on just
load of royal wedding gift.

I reckon Diana was gifted a few things at marriage or by inheritance but was also given a settlement as part of the divorce too.

In a nutshell…land. The Queen owns vast land through…the land and makes a fortune from it through the Duchy of Lancaster. Charles is similar with the Duchy of Cornwall. But these two Duchies are linked to the title holders and pass along…so if she has anything to leave them I don’t know. The Queen mother rumour has it left money…don’t know where she got it. Never paying bills May have helped. Diana got her money from her divorce settlement and died not long after so vast amount then went to boys.

They have been grabbing land and wealth since 1066. Members of the royal family have also shown a great talent for marrying other rich aristos to get their hands on eg the duchy of Lancaster. That’s why they are all a bit inbred, poor things.

...and the rich are very good at growing wealth. Diana's money will have grown hugely in the quarter century since she died.

There will be private gifts and financial help from friends, I'm sure.

They pay no or minimal rent on crown property / property owned by the Queen or duchies etc. They have enormous private wealth which isn't used in the service of the crown, its just for them (but they only have this by virtue of being part of the royal family, the duchy of Lancaster being a prime example and there's a strong argument it should cease to be private to them).

There's a book about it by a journalist...think his name was Robert something? Could be wrong svout the name. Worth reading though.

Not to mention their vast collections of art, prized jewels, antiques, rare texts, carpets and pretty much anything else you can think of.

The Queen may like to use an electric fire in the Buck House hearths, but none of them are hard up, believe me.

They don’t just shove it under the mattress and pass on what’s left over when they die.

Vast sums of money, carefully managed and invested over generations, will always continue to grow.

The book Leafy mentions is ‘And what do you do?’ by Norman Baker, and it’s a great read. I defy anyone to be a monarchist afterwards. It’s really well-researched: he’s a former Lib Dem MP and member of the privy council.

Thank you!

So not Robert at all then😆

...or a journalist for that matter.

Maybe I need to read the book again!

I see this all the time on MN, this misunderstanding that you have to earn wealth or do something for it.
Investments make their own money! Interest and dividends on a few million invested well by experts will provide easily enough income to live on.

I don't have problems with investments etc, I do object to the unique secrecy around royal finances however.

The one rule for us and another law for everyone else. I object to them hoarding wealth that was crown wealth and public wealth and the efforts they go to hide their vast finances. Particularly at this time.

Mainly this. Very wealthy people, royalty included, don’t keep money in bank accounts, it’s all carefully invested, in very long term investments, often in things most people who don’t work in wealth management are unaware even exist. Have a read about the work of a Family Office and how they ensure wealth is preserved for generations.

land and sound investments.
start by googling someone simple and uncomplicated such as the duke of westminister then you will be able to envision they dynamics on a larger scale.

@GobbolinoTheWitchesCat various experts invest in various ways. warren buffet is a good example as he vocal on how he manages his funds.
and the rules really are "the same" for everyone. it's legal to invest off shore, it's legal to minimize the taxes you pay, it's legal for various banks to offer wealthier clients better deals for investing with them.
and besides the queen there are multiple wealthy families with long histories: the walton family of walmart fame, the johnson's of johnson and johnson, the rothchilds (very interesting history there).

The Duchy of Cornwall accounts are published every year and you can see where the money goes. Not always on what though as they generally say a couple of million wheat to run Kate and Williams office for example. Most of the money the crown estate earns in a year goes to the government and they get a small amount back as the sovereign grant. But the amount barely pays Kates clothes for a year. Most of the money to run their royal lives comes from the Duchies…as well as the fact while Charles funds William…I think the Queen pretty much funds the rest for their office etc.

they get a small amount back as the sovereign grant. But the amount barely pays Kates clothes for a year

She’s spending a lot on clothes, then, because the sovereign grant for the current year is £86m.

But seriously, this is why there is so much (intentional) fudge and fuzz around royal finances. They don’t want us to know how much they have, or how much they are extracting from us per year.

As for the crown estates: they are ours, so of course some of the income ‘goes to the government’. One of the Georges - maybe George III - made that deal with the government of the time so that he didn’t have to pay for the army and other things from the income of the crown estates. He handed over the estates and got the equivalent of a civil list payment in exchange. The ownership of the duchies is a very shady area, despite the royals pretending that Cornwall and Lancaster belong to them. Norman Baker’s book explains the position well.

Thanks for the replies, its interesting to see how year on year they gain wealth while still living a very opulent lifestyle.
Why will phillips will not be published for so long? The queen mothers and Diana's were. What about the queen's father was his will revealed yet to the minions that are the general public?

She’s spending a lot on clothes, then, because the sovereign grant for the current year is £86m

No, it was over £100m this last year, £102.4m to be exact. Up 17% and so say, for BP renovations

I agree on the land being a driver for their wealth. The RF own a lot of land. A huge amount in central London, agricultural land, forests, sea beds out to 12 miles at sea, Ascot racecourse, Windsor Great Park, all of Regent St, 14 retail Malls and shopping centres, the UK's windfarms, prime estate in Park Avenue New York ....I could go on. It really is quite obscene

And as a pp said, a priceless art collection no one gets to see, jewellery, antiques and so on
Do read the Norman Baker book

The royals have the unique ability to seal their wills. Everyone else’s wills are publicly available. Why would you seal a will if not to maintain secrecy about how wealthy you are? That’s why we’re not allowed to see them, which is pretty scandalous.

www.royal.uk/sites/default/files/media/sovereign_grant_report_2021-22.pdf

Look on page 2. This is the annual report and accounts for the sovereign grant for 2021/22, but it is entirely possible that the numbers have been massaged. That excludes all the other things we pay for, by the way. If the sovereign grant has gone up from £86.3m to over £100m between one financial year and the next, that is truly shocking!

Yes. And on a thread about this after PP died, someone said..anyone can deal a will.
Strictly true but apparently it is one of the most onerous, challenging, expensive and difficult things to do. Near impossible for Joe Public. Not sure...but the decision might have to go to the High Court or something.

It's just to hide their wealth and they can pick and choose which laws they want to adhere to.

@Iamthewombat

www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-57559653

Here it is, in that article the £102.4m figure. Security costs are extra of course!

People have pretty large misunderstandings here of how it works. The Crown Estate income goes to the treasury for the tax payer, a proportion goes to the Crown to run the palaces etc via the Sovereign Grant. The Sovereign Grant isn’t just going into the queens pocket for her clothes. It pays for the upkeep of the palaces and staff. There has been a big increase in the Soveriegn Grant recently to fund the repairs to Buckingham Palace which is essentially falling apart.

The Queen has personal assets however which include estates such as Sandringham and Balmoral. She also has things like her racing yard and personal investments. These are large estates which generate income. I’ve worked in the family office as an Estate manager for families wealthier than the Queen for a while, it’s very easy to make money for them.

The Duke and Duchess of Windsor were apparently notorious for either underpaying or not paying at all. When she died, there was lots of jewellery that had been ‘borrowed’ from Cartier etc and not returned, and they couldn’t distinguish it from the things they actually had paid for. Staff were underpaid too - or just not paid at all.

I suspect they’re an extreme case but probably not completely unique…!

Colonialism and slavery are very lucrative.