Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

The litter tray

Join our community of cat lovers on the Mumsnet Cat forum for kitten advice and help with cat behaviour.

Flip

1 2 3 4 5

Original poster

Spay my kitten or let her breed in future?

117 replies

LimeLemonOrange · 07/09/2020 12:00

I have two adorable kittens, one male and one female. The male is definitely getting 'done' so he doesn't spray and fight.

I'm in a dilemma with the girl. I like the idea of letting her have at least one litter of kittens but I have no experience of this and have a few worries about it.

When I was a child we had a kitten who got pregnant immediately and then rejected her kittens as she was too young. If cats are outdoor cats and my kitten comes on heat, I assume there's no way to prevent this? Unless I notice when she's on heat and keep her indoors at that time? How easy is that, do they give visible signs when they're on heat?

And what are the challenges of having a litter of kittens? I think my biggest challenge would be rehoming the new kittens when I've called in love with them all! But I'm sure there are other challenges too.

I'd love to hear your thoughts and experiences.

OP posts:

thecatneuterer · 07/09/2020 13:43

Plus of course, OP, sex is truly horrible for female cats. They are chased over long distances (quite often so far that they then can't find their way home, or they get hit by cars as they are chased across buys roads) by many males cats and then effectively gang raped. Plus the males' penises are barbed, a bit like a christmas tree, so it slides in easily enough but then all the barbs stick in as it is withdrawn, and it's the pain that sets off ovulation. Imagine!

ChickenwingChickenwing · 07/09/2020 13:43

Your updates about your existing cat suggest getting more cats was really not a good idea.

thecatneuterer · 07/09/2020 13:45

@ChickenwingChickenwing

Your updates about your existing cat suggest getting more cats was really not a good idea.

I'm not sure that's fair. Her existing cat isn't particularly friendly but she's looking after it reasonably enough by the sounds of things. It's fine to also want some more affectionate cats.

RightOnTheEdge · 07/09/2020 13:48

A lady local to me posted only this morning that she has taken in 100 unwanted or feral kittens since April.

I'm not having a go at you OP just with you asking where all the unwanted kittens are.
(Market town in North Yorkshire)

Original poster

LimeLemonOrange · 07/09/2020 13:48

BovaryX judge away, I don't mind!

I got her when she was 5 years old. I do love her but she is to use JorisBonson's word - an arsehole!

I posted here on MN when I was trying to decide whether it was the right thing to do to get more cats and everyone said yes.

I don't have much cat experience (rescue was my first cat) so I come to MN and take the advice from those more knowledgeable than me.

In hindsight, having seen how the older cat has reacted to the kittens, it wasn't a wise decision and probably not fair on the older cat, but I made it with the information and knowledge I had at the time and it is done now.

It is a joy to see my children becoming cat lovers with the kittens, and now I've converted them to cat-loving I hope they will adopt cats when they grow up.

OP posts:

BovaryX · 07/09/2020 13:48

Why is it irresponsible to buy kittens from Gumtree if the charities / shelters don't have any?

Because you are encouraging people to breed cats for money. When there are so many badly treated, abandoned cats. Why would you give money to people doing this? Buying a kitten from Gumtree is a vile thing to do. Cats can live for 20 years. How many of the people buying a kitten from Gumtree consider that? Kittens seem to be in demand from people who have a momentary desire for a fluffy toy and zero consideration about how to take care of an adult cat. For 20 years.

ChickenwingChickenwing · 07/09/2020 13:50

I'm not sure that's fair. Her existing cat isn't particularly friendly but she's looking after it reasonably enough by the sounds of things.

It lives in the garden mostly and its fur gets matters regularly. That's not 'reasonably enough' at all.

There is a huge lack of understanding of how to take care of cats, some airy fairy 'fertility' nonsense and a rescue cat that has been replaced because it doesn't fit the bill.

I think it's entirely fair.

Rigamorph · 07/09/2020 13:53

A few things.

Many cats prefer to be solitary although often in a large house they will tolerate each other, And if they have grown up together or are siblings.
PP are right, sex and reproduction are pretty harrowing for female cats!
Neutering can almost double the life expectancy of both males and females (average life expectancy of entire male approx 10 yrs, some live to 20yo+ with neutering)

thecatneuterer · 07/09/2020 13:54

Yes well I've had cats that were long haired and impossible to brush. I too had to periodically have them booked in for sedation and shaving - just as the OP does. And some cats do prefer to live outside - I'm presuming she has shelter.

Original poster

LimeLemonOrange · 07/09/2020 13:55

SBTLove why is it so surprising or weird that I'd have empathy for animals?

Yes I know they're not human and don't have our capacity for thought, but they are still alive and have feelings... they will go for that op and they will hurt afterwards - from something a human imposed on them!

And - while I am still going to do it now I understand all the wider implications - it is still doing something pretty damn major and unnatural to an animal that it hasn't asked for or hasn't had any say in.

Why is that such a hard point of view to grasp? Christ on a bike to you too for not being able to understand how other people think! Grow some empathy!

OP posts:

Original poster

LimeLemonOrange · 07/09/2020 13:56

ChickenwingChickenwing I'm all ears if you'd like to tell me how to look after my adult cat?

Please give specific instructions.

Thank you.

OP posts:

Original poster

LimeLemonOrange · 07/09/2020 13:59

For those worried about adult cat - she sits outside all day in all her favourite places in our large garden. She comes in if it's raining, she comes in at night, she comes in for food.

Sometimes she comes in to see what's going on, growl at us all, then go out again.

If anyone with experience of very grumpy cats who refuse to be picked up or groomed have any tips I'd be genuinely happy to hear them. I've had one groomer here and taken her to two other groomers and all three (well four as one groomer had two people) have said she's the first cat they haven't been able to groom.

OP posts:

BovaryX · 07/09/2020 13:59

You are not showing empathy to your cat at all. You are transferring your ideas onto the cat. You are also ignoring the fact that there are thousands of abandoned cats who die on the streets or are put down in kill shelters because of the irresponsible people who fail to neuter them. We have two cats. Both rescues. There are so many street cats, it is heartbreaking. People who add to this deserve criticism.

thecatneuterer · 07/09/2020 14:01

OP - that sounds absolutely fine for your adult cat. Some cats really are impossible to groom. Periodic visits to the vets are really the only solution.

Nikkit2017 · 07/09/2020 14:02

I'm kinda going to go against the grain because my girl did have 1 litter of kittens. She was an amazing mum. I kept one and other 2 went to a close friend who stays 3 doors down from me so I see them all the time. As soon as it was time I took both of them down and got them spayed so my youngest won't be having any litters. It's a shame actually because her mum mated with a Maine coon so she's got a lot of the characteristics of a coon😻. Ultimately It's your cat so your decision. You will 100% be able to tell she's in heat, she'll make a loud wailing and stick her ass in the air whenever you stroke her. She will also turn into a escape artist and will look for any open window, door etc to get out. Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

ApplestheHare · 07/09/2020 14:02

Well done for taking the spaying advice OP. There are hundred of kittens needed homes each year in our bit of Yorkshire. Hope the operation goes ok for both of yours.

userxx · 07/09/2020 14:06

They are chased over long distances (quite often so far that they then can't find their way home, or they get hit by cars as they are chased across buys roads) by many males cats and then effectively gang raped

This ^. The scumbags behind my house bought a kitten last year, they left her to roam, out all night and I had delights of hearing her getting regularly shagged on my drive way, it’s a horrible sound. I can only imagine how painful it was for a very young cat :(

As you can imagine she's now had kittens, I'm sure I will see them pop up on gumtree for £200 each, they actually leave mum cat outside meowing to get in to the kittens. I'm not a violent person but the rage I feel at these people is something else.

Gingerkittykat · 07/09/2020 14:09

@LimeLemonOrange

Why is it irresponsible to buy kittens from Gumtree if the charities / shelters don't have any?

Wouldn't the Gumtree kittens then be unwanted kittens with no home?

The fact that moggies are selling for up to £400 means that loads of people let their cats get pregnant repeatedly to make an easy profit. If you buy from a registered breeder or rescue you know the kittens have been looked after. All that buying on Gumtree dows is encourage kitten farms.

thecatneuterer · 07/09/2020 14:12

Why is it irresponsible to buy kittens from Gumtree if the charities / shelters don't have any? Charities/shelters always have them. They may not be advertised, and of course there are kitten seasons and there won't be many out of season, but shelters will always have kittens.

And, as above, handing over money for kittens encourages irresponsible breeding.

tabulahrasa · 07/09/2020 14:16

“I just felt very guilty sending two kittens that I love to have them operated on. I felt sad that I'm taking something away from them (fertility etc) and it's sad that they have no say in the matter.“

You’re taking stress away from them tbh though...

Cats in heat are not happy - and to have a litter and let her be fully grown, you’d be looking at having to lock her up through at least one, possibly two... and she’ll be desperate to get out because her hormones tell her to. It also physically takes a toll on them.

Then, mating itself can cause issues, it isn’t pleasant and there’s always the chance of getting injured in fights because of it. Cats can also get STDs btw.

Then the physical stress on her of pregnancy, birth and feeding a litter...

And after all that, you’d need to keep her in again to get her spayed as they go back into heat quickly.

And for what? Cats aren’t particularly social anyway, they don’t happily live in family groups left to their own devices... she’s not yearning for the company of children...

It’s not like doing something to an animal with higher reasoning against their will.

Original poster

LimeLemonOrange · 07/09/2020 14:17

userxx that sounds so awful, poor kitten.

ApplestheHare thanks, fingers crossed the ops will go well.

Nikkit2017 thanks for bravely being the only poster to suggest allowing a litter! I've decided to spay now though.

BovaryX in what way am I ignoring the abandoned cats issue now I'm having her spayed?

thecatneuterer thanks for your support and understanding about cats who won't be groomed!

OP posts:

cricketmum84 · 07/09/2020 14:19

Oh fgs. You "like the idea" of putting your young female cat through pain and giving birth. For what?? The cuteness factor?? Or the £20 per kitten on gumtree.

Stop being so fucking irresponsible and get the poor little thing neutered.

Spay my kitten or let her breed in future?

ilovesooty · 07/09/2020 14:22

Your friend might be "a very respectable solicitor" but she's still irresponsible.
And you seem to have some very strange ideas about cat ownership and welfare.

AintOverUntilTheCatLadySings · 07/09/2020 14:22

I'm massively pro spay and neuter, but just to support OP on one point: I live in a poorer area, but there's no kittens in our shelters or on gumtree etc (I'm not suggesting people use gumtree, it's bad, but I know this because I have a friend who was looking).

One of our local shelters has a three year waiting list!!

ilovesooty · 07/09/2020 14:24

@thecatneuterer

And, as above, handing over money for kittens encourages irresponsible breeding.

Exactly. And all this obsession with kittens when there are many young adult cats needing homes.

Flip

1 2 3 4 5

Swipe left for the next trending thread