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The litter tray

Join our community of cat lovers on the Mumsnet Cat forum for kitten advice and help with cat behaviour.

Who wants a live birth thread?

92 replies

TastingTheRainbow · 01/06/2019 21:52

I was watching the champions league but my little Bella decided to distract me by going into labour.

Here’s the first little arrival.

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24
Grinchly · 03/06/2019 17:43

Oh Sad
Hope the remaining three are thriving.

EAIOU · 03/06/2019 17:56

I'm so sorry to hear about the little one 😢

TinselAndKnickers · 03/06/2019 18:12

So sorry to hear about the little male. Sad

SunshineCake · 03/06/2019 19:06

Oh what a shame. How's mum coping without him? Sad.

TastingTheRainbow · 03/06/2019 21:13

The 3 girls are doing fab, have had their second weigh in today and all have gained good amounts of weight.

The male wasn’t right from the start but couldn’t work out what was wrong, he was less active than the others, seemed very weak and would latch on to feed and then fall off seconds later. We started topping him up with formula as we were concerned he wasn’t getting enough. That’s when we spotted the cleft palate and had to start tube feeding. Sadly he already had fluid on the lungs from the small amount of milk he had taken and his breathing deteriorated. We’ve buried him tonight under our cherry blossom tree.

Mum is fine, cats are much less emotional when it comes to losing a kitten. They often abandon or refuse to feed a kitten they don’t think will survive as they see it as a waste of resources that others could have.

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ladybird69 · 04/06/2019 00:12

Rest in peace little one, bless him for fighting and bless you for trying to save him, you must be so sad. X

mathanxiety · 04/06/2019 04:36
Sad

We all know things can go wrong but it's still hard. Hope you're ok.

TastingTheRainbow · 04/06/2019 11:48

Mum and the girls.

Who wants a live birth thread?
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Sakura7 · 04/06/2019 12:20

Sorry to hear about the little boy. The girls are adorable. Have you given them names?

TransFannyUltrasound · 04/06/2019 13:16

Oh that is so sad about the little boy gatito. So sorry.

TastingTheRainbow · 04/06/2019 20:13

We have named them yes, well temporarily just to identify them.

Blossom, Buttercup and Bubbles AKA The powerpuff girls 😂😂

If we have a lilac she will be staying with us and be called Lyra. 🤞🏻🤞🏻

Statistically 1 in 4 kittens will be lilac from this mating and the rest blue, so we will either have 1 lilac or none. Should be able to tell in a couple of weeks.

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TastingTheRainbow · 04/06/2019 23:44

This little one is just adorable 😍😍

Who wants a live birth thread?
OP posts:
agnurse · 05/06/2019 01:54

She sweet! She resembles a hamster or a little bear with her tiny round ears!

TastingTheRainbow · 08/06/2019 20:46

One week old today and all have doubled their birth weight 🎉🎉

Who wants a live birth thread?
Who wants a live birth thread?
Who wants a live birth thread?
OP posts:
agnurse · 08/06/2019 20:55

They pretty little girls! I imagine their eyes will open soon.

TastingTheRainbow · 08/06/2019 23:00

Yes in the next week they will start to open, long haired cats open theirs a little later than short haired cats strangely.

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TransFannyUltrasound · 08/06/2019 23:05

Sweeties!

HJWT · 08/06/2019 23:06

So sweet 😍

MamaOfBothTeams · 08/06/2019 23:14

Oh 😍

EachandEveryone · 09/06/2019 07:18

Gorgeous. How often do they have kittens and when do they stop? Sorry but posh cat’s fascinate me as I’m only used to moggies and how to adopt them. Where does the dad come from?

sashh · 09/06/2019 07:28

Squeeeeeeeeeeeee

Such lovely looking cats and the kittens so sweet.

TastingTheRainbow · 09/06/2019 13:48

@Eachandeveryone

How often they have kittens depends on the breeder really. They are physically capable of having litters much more often then is healthy for them but sadly some breeders do mate them on every season.

For example Bella’s last litter, she was calling again when her kittens were only 5 weeks old, she could have been mated then but she would have been feeding kittens while pregnant and giving birth just 2 weeks after her kittens left, no time to regain weight or condition at all.

The GCCF (that’s who registers pedigree cats) won’t register more than 3 litters in 2 years from one cat to stop breeders doing this. I like mine to have around a year gap so 2 litters in 2 years as this gives them a nice long break to gain their weight back and recover.

They stop at around 5 years old, depending on the cat, but their fertility starts to decline around then so they have smaller litters and can have more problems. Ragdoll’s have an average litter size of 4, as they get older that will reduce to maybe 2 kittens in the litter and that’s when it’s time to stop and neuter them. You want to avoid them having a litter of 1 kitten as a) that kitten ends up HUGE and the cat can struggle to deliver it and b) they tend to get bored of only raising 1 kitten and will often abandon it. That tends to mean maximum 4-5 litters from one female, assuming you are leaving the appropriate gap between litters as they don’t start breeding until 12-18 months.

Finding the dad is much harder than people think.

First of all your female has to have all her health tests and DNA tests depending on the breed. So Ragdoll’s are know to have a genetic heart condition called HCM. Cats can either have 2 copies of this gene (which means they are positive and will get HCM and should never be bred from), 1 copy of the gene (meaning they are a carrier but won’t get HCM) or 0 copies of the gene which is the ideal.

If your female has 0 copies you have more studs open to you, but if your female has 1 copy you need to find a male with 0 copies as a male and female each with 1 copy can produce a kitten with 2 copies that will develop HCM.

After that you DNA test them to see what they carry in terms of colour. So my girl Bella is blue, she carries chocolate. That means I had to find a stud also carrying chocolate to have a chance at chocolate or lilac kittens. My girl Indie is seal and carries nothing so no matter what colour male she goes to she will only ever have seal kittens so she can go to a wider range of males.

Then once you’ve FINALLY found a male that has the correct HCM status and the correct colours carried you need to make sure they are not related. There is very clever software that you input the pedigrees into and it looks back across 10 generations and calculates how related they are, this needs to be as little as possible as too closely related and you will have problems with the kittens. It can be hard to find a none related male with the correct colours, especially in rarer colours like lilac as Ragdoll’s were imported not natural to the UK so keeping the genes diverse relies on breeders importing new cats every now and again, which is VERY VERY expensive.

Once you’ve got a male lined up you wait for your female to come into heat and take her to the male. The stud Bella went to was 60 miles away from me as he was the closest that was suitable. Less common breeds will have to travel in further but Ragdoll’s are popular so that’s reasonable. Your female needs to be tested for FIV and FELV the day before she goes, these are sexually transmitted cat diseases and are incurable so very important. Then you pay the stud fee (£200-£350 average) and leave your girl there. Some girls get pregnant straight away, some take many trips. You pay the stud fee regardless of the outcome.

So by the time you’ve got to the stage of a pregnant cat, with all the tests, fees and travel etc. you’ve usually spent around £600-£700!

Sorry that’s so long, just realised I’ve wrote an essay! Hope it all makes sense x

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EachandEveryone · 09/06/2019 17:34

It’s all really interesting and expensive! 😀 what happens to your girls when they are past 5 do you keep them? Do they get sad when their kittens go?

Allergictoironing · 09/06/2019 18:06

Someone i know breeds & shows poodles, and has a similar (but not QUITE as involved) procedure to follow. In miniature poodles the genetic issue is an eye condition called PRA, and same as with the cats and HCM you never ever breed from "C"s (2 genes), and only cross "B"s (one gene, so carrier but won't get it) with "A"s (no PRA
gene). Colours are a little less involved, but similar e.g. need brown in the heritage to breed browns.

They don't usually go back as many generations and don't need tests like the cat FIV & FELV beforehand. She has imported dogs from Sweden, Italy, Spain and even Australia (cost her about £4k in total that one with flights etc) to get the exact mix she wanted.

WatcherOfTheNight · 09/06/2019 18:32

I hope one is lilac !
Love the names,my dd was obsessed with the PPG Smile

Can you tell what colour they are when their eyes open @TastingTheRainbow ?
I've not got Persians but I've a "lilac" dog & a chocolate,their eyes glow red with the light of camera

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