Puppy Survival Thread for New and Old Pups - Spring is around the corner!

[Lougle]

A thread for puppy owners to share their ups and downs as we head into Spring. We're not just here for the idyllic moments. We've all had a cry at some point!

All posters welcome - just dive in.

The previous thread is here https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/the_doghouse/4945764-puppy-survival-thread-for-old-and-new-pups-heading-into-winter?page=1

That sounds miserable, Brodiepup. I'm really sorry. It's not just the arm-pulling, is it? It's like grieving the dog you thought you'd have.

In the short term, could you hire a closed field for him once or twice a week? that would mean you could let him off to be a nutter. If he does have any dogs he's good with you could go halves.

I'm sure you've probably looked at those halti harnesses that are meant to stop pulling - maybe someone on the board has tried them.

I do hope you find a solution. It sounds exhausting and very dispiriting.

@Bupster Thanks for your kind words, you've hit the nail on the head and I hadn't looked at it that way. He's a lovely little dog in so many ways, I just have to find a way to solve the pulling.
He's taken for 4 short walks a day because he won't poo in the garden...maybe I need force that? The problem I have with letting him the back garden is he finds things to entertain himself with...eating gravel, digging holes, pulling up plants etc...
Puppies! I'm sure they weren't so complicated in the past!!

@BrodiePup
Milo has never ever been "greatest" at recall the worst spaniel in fact the worst dog I've ever had in terms of it!
I've always let my dogs off lead from their first walk even with Milo - knowing how terrible he is - even knowing this it's made him better in the long run if that makes sense?
In order to learn how to recall - you have to teach him to recall
Have you any open fields that you can let lose in? As I have had most of my muscle nerves and fat taken out of my groin and I struggle to do the long walks on my own without my husband so I just think fuck this you're going on the field - a spaniel will never go too far and will always find you anyway 😂😂
Jokes aside I will mind him if you want to post him to me for a week 🫣

@JamieJ93 His recall isn't too bad all in all, just when he sees other dogs and wants to play. It's walking him from home that's the problem, we live on a large housing estate, there's patches of open land and lots of woodland walks, but they're not far enough away from roads to risk letting him off. The problem is we're running wick with foxes and we live opposite a hedgehog rescue, so it's when he picks up a scent that he goes nuts. The walks have to stop, he hates them as much as I do and always comes back gasping for breath and looking distressed. I don't know how I'm going to do it, but he's going to have to start going to the loo in the garden.
The main reason for me getting a dog was to keep me company on my walks...I got into the habit of doing at least a couple of miles every day during covid, and I feel better for it. Getting Brodie has stopped me doing it amongst other things.
I'm so fed up I can't put it into words.
Tried him on pate for treats today, he was more interested, but now has liquid poo again...

@BrodiePup
Have you tried him on skinners yet?
Their wet food comes in pâté, Milo was on this and this was the ONLY wet he could tolerate,
His stomach drove me mental - now he's 12 months he's more tolerable.
Could you drive him in the car to different places? This is what I/we do with Milo due to my leg? I do walk him on lead but it's miserable for us cos he pulls and sounds so uncomfortable and it hurts my leg so badly.
It's so hard with a pup but a working cocker is a whole new ball park!
I really do feel it because I felt I had no escape at times, no life and no way to breathe I literally felt suffocated.

Could you get one of those puppy pens to fence off a bit of the garden? My pup's eleven weeks old and eleven days home. He adores being in the garden but he's an idiot who likes to chew gravel and try for everything poisonous or dangerous so I've got a bit penned off outside the back door. That way he can make a pest of himself when I have the time and energy to supervise at length, and he just has to wee when I haven't. Sorry if you've thought of this - I'm just trying to come up with ways that could buy you a bit of respite while you think of a long-term way to resolve things.

@BrodiePup sorry you are struggling, pups are very hard work. 20 weeks is still very young. Have you tried a dogmatic? After trying various things, it helped us and I still use it on the initial walk to the open ground. Have you tried a long lead, not retracting, I used this for initial training, then you could drive to the off lead area. For the garden, could you fence off some areas ? We fenced off a lot of our garden to help with problems of digging and eating everything and it worked well. Have you done any training classes?

@JamieJ93 I've not tried skinners yet, I'm pretty sure he's ok on his kibble, it's training treats I'm struggling with. His kibble doesn't interest him that much and literally everything I try gives him the runs. Milo sounds exactly like Brodie!
Is he easier to feed now?
Would you say he's improved on the lead a bit with age?
I'm going to start driving him to a park where I can let him off, I'm just a bit worried about him going nuts with other dogs and getting me in trouble again.
I feel utterly defeated today. It must've been hard for you when you struggle with your leg...that sounds pretty horrific.
@Bupster We've managed to dog proof the garden, we did keep him in a small part at first but he totally refused to go to the loo there. We've let him have full run now and occasionally he will have a pee, but never a poo. I'm going to have to stand my ground and wait it out, but I'm worried that he'll start going in the house again. Thanks for trying to help.
@Floramac I've not heard of a dogmatic, I'll have a look. I've tried a long line and I was hopeless with it, I also hated the jolt he got when he ran full pelt on it. He's on his second round of training, it does help, but when he gets distracted it's all forgotten. Thank you for replying 🙂

@BrodiePup
It's all down to what lead/collar/harness you are using as well, a lead and collar are a definite no no.
I think I've found a Y harness and strong rope lead the best when comes to pulling.
He still has his moments - he pulls more when he's on to a scent as you say he pulls more when he can't actually get to another dog BUT when he's off lead - he's happy doing his own thing and doesn't approach other dogs funnily enough.
He's better with age.
I got necrotising fascitis in my groin (similar to gangrene) as I had an arterial line in the femoral artery because the staff weren't using aseptic techniques properly in intensive care and got bacteria in it and I got blood stream infection then gangrene then sepsis then multi organ failure arghhhhh then I put myself through Milo ha ha ha ha

oh @JamieJ93 those are huge medical hurdles, i'm glad your still here!

we're contending with pulling and jumping and chewing, but so far we think it's pretty much par for the course and are not too too concerned.
fin lost his another tooth yesterday evening and i think that it?? it was a pointy canine (the other pointy canine came out a few days ago).
we're in a heat wave 36-39 last week and this one, and fin's not a fan of the heat, so we've had a few puddles indoor and immediate turning around when we let him out (which btw is with a timer and 5 minutes max) large grass lawn and some shady spots.
unfortunately he's taken a liking to my raspberries and currants (currant's now harvested).
much much more food driven than expected, stealthy and fast!! "lured" my husband into thinking he was calm and relaxed just watching him make a sandwich (same spot as the crepe thieving several weeks ago) dh turned to put the stem into the compost and swoosh the sandwich was gone. poor dh was irate....

@JamieJ93 that sounds truly horrific! You've done amazingly well to get through that, and make me feel quite pathetic with my woes.
I don't know what to do, I've hardly slept a wink and really can't face another day. He's such a gorgeous little dog, he's just a puppy and none of this is his fault, but I really don't think I can do it.

Morning Brodiepup. Sorry you've had a shitty night. Everything feels worse on no sleep.

Can you give both of you a break for a couple of days? Don't try to walk him, don't try to do anything except feed him and play? He will eventually poo in the garden but he might dig some holes - does it matter for a couple of days? You can always fill them in, or build him a digging patch when you've a bit more energy. Is there anyone who could puppy sit for a few hours so you can have a rest? It sounds like you're just so exhausted it's impossible to see through this patch.

Cheering you on from over here x

All the best,
Bupster

Did he have a problem weeing in the fenced off bit? We've tried fencing off a bit of the patio by the house for evening toilet trips to stop the constant sniffing for slugs. He hasn't wee'd or pooed in it yet though. I've ordered some astroturf to see if that helps.I stood out with him for about thirty minutes last night trying to get him to wee.

@BrodiePup I heard the lady who runs our pet shop talking to a lady with two young working cocker spaniels causing chaos in the house. She said she needed to train them to do jobs as they are bred to work. She suggested specialist training which it looks like you are trying but I suppose things like unloading the washing machine etc would be good places to start? That might sound crazy but we have friends who trained their lab to do that.

@newusern99
My WCS is 12 months old and has a particular fetish for socks - he could unload the washing machine if it was full of socks and he could hide them all,
Every night when I go to bed I find about 5 million hidden under the covers / pillows - he's forever bringing me socks!! I don't even know I owned that many
Be great if I could teach him to match pairs and bring me them 😂😂

@Bupster Good idea, and I'm giving it a go...I'm not holding my breath though.
Sadly, I've no one who can help, it's all down to me and my husband when he's not working 🙁.
I sound a right moaning misery! Believe it or not I'm usually quite upbeat...get a pet! It's good for stress 🤣.
I hope all is going well with you.
@newusern99 we tried to fence off the patio at first to keep Brodie away from the gravel, it didn't work. We then built a box and put some soil and turf in it. He will pee on that very occasionally if he absolutely has to. Hope you have better luck.
I'm reading a book about scent training at the moment, and am going to try that. He does steal odd things out of the washer, and also puts his toys in it 🤣

@BrodiePup
My husband is always at work as well,
Milo has tested our marriage at times we had so many arguments and resentment at times
Who said puppies were these cute little things..
Cos they aintttt
Milos annoying me today 😬😬
Wish I could lock him outside in the rain but that's tight 😂

The puppy (~ 20 weeks) has also just started to eat his poo again which DH does not cope well with. He was just doing it if he pooed inside (hiding evidence) and maybe once or twice outside but then hadn't done so for a while . This week the poo eating has been outside when not cleared up straight away (this isn't always possible when DH is looking after him as he has ADHD and gets distracted easily). It seemed to start up again after his worming tablets on Tuesday evening so I am wondering if they are making the poo smell tempting ? Or maybe it is just coincidence. Anyone have any good recommendations of things to add to the diet to make it taste horrid.

@JamieJ93 we have so much in common! I'm not at all pleased that you've been through what I'm going through, but it's so nice to know that I'm not on my own...
Shall we send the mutts on a holiday and have a week off? Goodness knows I need it! I'm even considering a dog walker or doggy daycare to have a break, I dare say I'd see the price and change my mind though.
I might have had a breakthrough! I soooo hope it wasn't just a fluke. I took him for a short walk and put his harness on, a struggle but I can't stand the choking sounds anymore, and used a double ended lead attached to his back and chest. I sort of used it like reins, so it wasn't actually pulling him round, but OMG was it better! He didn't mind it one little bit either. Please, please PLEASE let it not be a fluke!
@newusern99 Ew! That can't be pleasant, but I do know that it's quite common, and not as disgusting as it seems to humans. It's not something I've encountered, but hopefully someone will be along that can help.
This thread is saving my sanity at times.

@newusern99 its a bit in dogs (unlike horses where it suggests a nutrient deficiency). The best way to break a habit is to just make it impossible. You might have more luck “training” dh to be attentive to the issue than finding something you can add to food which is palatable the first time they eat it, but makes their poo extra unappealing.

@BrodiePup@Ilovehimbut

My whippet/IG (I suppose in many ways very different to a wcs, but still a puppy) is now 6 months. She wants to jump up every person, meet and play with every dog, she also gets overtired and very noisy, bitey and chewy. Digs holes in the garden, pulls up grass and chews on the roots, searches for snails ugh. She's a bit funny with pooping, she has to run around a lot first. Anyway, so I'm thinking it's just stuff she'll grow out of? I keep the lead tight and keep her close unless people or their dogs clearly want to say hello, and put her back on lead if I see unknown dogs when we're out and she's off lead.

Anyway, I have been taking citalopram for 6 weeks now, I'm on my own with her and was in such an anxious state, stressing over everything. Not saying you should do that, of course, but to demonstrate how much of a state I was in!
When not overtired and excited she is an angel, beautiful pup, and I do overlook things in the garden as long as she doesn't get anything dangerous to her.

I'm definitely feeling better now and I'm sure I can do it.
I've also been at my parents for a week with her, as they both caught Covid. Their home is small, not puppy proofed and their garden isn't secure 😂

Luckily they had whippets and adore her, but they're in their late 80s so she has to be on a lead indoors at times to prevent her leaping on them with joy.

Try to hang in there, and if there are any of pup's habits you can let go of for a while do it.

I hope you're okay x

@Yllasin Thank you so much for your lovely reply, and I'm sorry to hear that you're struggling too. I've been so tempted to go to the doctors, the only things putting me off are the fact that I have white coat syndrome, can't get appointments, and it seems the most bizarre thing to say that you're fall apart because you have a puppy!
It's just so hard and relentless isn't it? I'm like you and hoping that a lot of things will naturally get easier as he matures...
Brodie also has a thing for slugs and snails (ew) and this morning discovered the joy of rolling in fox poo...puppies really are the gift that keeps on giving!!
Fingers crossed that everyone who is struggling will look back a year from now, and think that it really was all worthwhile 🤞🏻.
Hope your parents are doing ok, and stay strong.

Can I join you? meet Libi (Liberty) a 12 week old Flatcoated Retriever. She's been with me a month tomorrow.

This is her "If I jump now I could get your nose!" face (she was about to go into manic mode)

She's my eight Flatcoat, though I also have (and had) other breeds, a mix of rescues and pups. My last rescue Flattie boy died 8yrs ago and I decided I had one pup left in me, so she has joined my two little rescues and a 7yr old Golden that I got as a pup.

Finally integrated into the pack with the other three, and developing relationships with them all. Now sleeping on my bed at night with the others (though funnily enough a couple of THEM now sometimes decide to sleep on the sofa 😆). Slept from 10:30 to 5:30 last night (🎉) then settled back down until breakfast at 7. Bliss. (I started out sleeping on a camp bed arrangement next to my bed, with her. This now provides a platform for her to get on an off the bed without joint strain). I live in a bungalow which also helps.

I'm expecting house training to take a while as my oldie has become unreliable with his weeing - but I recently had all the carpet in the hallway taken up and Karndean put down, so the mop is earning its keep - as is the carpet cleaner 🤷🏼‍♀️.

My arms are a bit shredded, but she's a gentle soul and responds well to me pathetically crying like a pup when she hurts me (it winds some dogs up the other way and they go in for the kill!). Life is a lot easier having the other dogs around though - as the two younger ones both now play with her, which really helps, my oldie likes puppies and is firm but fair with her. He can't manage the big walk anymore, so I can leave her with him while I walk the other two. When I check on the web cam they both just settle down in the kitchen and hallway until we get back.

I hesitated to post for ages, because I'm clearly not having the same issues many of you are - didn't want to come over as smug - but that's because
a) realistic expectations born of experience - she's my seventh puppy (5 FCs and 2 Goldens) and I know this breed very well. I've never had a pup that wasn't house / recall trained eventually! This means I'm pretty relaxed about the whole thing.
b) having other NICE dogs around is a game changer
c) I live alone so don't have to navigate around protecting DC or other adults not being consistent with commands etc.

But yes, I still worry about all the same things, what she's eaten, if I haven't seen her 💩 is she constipated? does she have a blockage? When she squeals - Has she stood on a nettle or broken her leg?........hey ho! We start school next week too, so I have to up the ante with getting her comfortable on a lead!

@BrodiePup

Is Brodie driving yet ? 😂😂

I've not posted in a while, JanePup is now 8 months old and just the best little lad.
Apart from when he chased my neighbours cats today.
Or when he vomited on the stairs on Tuesday. I digress!

He's on his first overnight stay at a home boarder tonight, in preparation for our holiday in 2 weeks time.
Just got a text from her to say he's sitting by her front door whining a little - it's all I can do to not rush over there and scoop him up!!
My heart actually aches for him!!