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Poodles... Me again!

26 replies

Dotbydotbydot · 29/01/2024 23:13

Hello! After never posting in this doggy bit before this is my third in as many days - have read through other threads and found so much helpful stuff.

So after much thought and dog visits etc we're set to welcome a miniature poodle puppy into our home! Any top tips? Book recommendations? Socialisation tips? Training advice? All very gratefully received !

OP posts:
Dogdilemma2000 · 29/01/2024 23:15

Dogs trust do excellent basic training.

MissingMoominMamma · 29/01/2024 23:24

My poodles respond really well to positive reinforcement. They are bright as buttons and learn quickly.

Devilshands · 30/01/2024 12:43

1) Take her/him out from day dot. Literally, day one. Keep her/him in your arms and just walk around the local town/village, go to the seaside, go to parks etc. Don't let him/her sniff or touch other dogs but let them see the sights. Socialisation starts then - the longer you leave it (even until second vaccination) the harder it becomes. Lots of people don't do this until after the second vaccination stage and IME it's a mistake. Even if they can't say hi, they should learn about the world - it's also AMAZING at tiring them out. Trust me, a dog that has spent an hour in your arms watching the world go whilst sat in a cafe will sleep so much better than a dog that has just had a few hours in the garden and been played with.

For example; when I got my youngest dog, my mum would come on all my dog walks with me with my other two dogs. I'd drive to the beach and walk my other dogs whilst my mum sat on a bench with the puppy on her lap and he watched the world. Then we'd drive home. And puppy would sleep for two hours. It was BLISS.

2) Train from day one. Teach him/her how to do sit/down/basic recall/leave/stay etc from the first day. Don't feed them in a food bowl but instead from your hand and use their meal food as treats to reward them when they master something. This not only helps get them trained quickly, it helps tire them out (trust me, you will be so grateful for it) and it helps associate you with food.

On toilet training. When puppy is awake - every twenty minutes. Straight outside. Give them a high value treat when they perform (I also said 'wee wee' to mine after they did it along with a piece of chicken and after a week or so they would perform when I said wee wee) to reinforce that outside is where they do their business. If they do it inside - that's okay. Just pick them up straight away and take them outside. Mop the job up asap. After a game or play time - straight outside. When a puppy wakes up - straight outside.

For my youngest (14 months now). I set an alarm every three hours during the night for the first week. Every three hours I got up, took him outside and let him perform then tucked him back into the crate. If he didn't perform within a minute or so, he went back into the crate. By week two, he barked at night to let me know he had to go outside and he would go to the backdoor and bark during the day to let me know. He did it twice most nights. By week three, he slept through the night (9-4am). Dogs (especially poodles) are smart! You definitely don't need to be as keen as I was - but it's so nice not to have a house that smells like wee. Remember, little dogs have little bladders so a mini poodle will need to go far more often than a GSD would.

3) People. Invite people over soon. Not hundreds of them. But maybe your parents, young children etc. Don't overwhelm the dog but get them used to strangers in the house - this will avoid guarding behaviour.

4) Let them cry. Puppies cry. It's just like babies - their cry will break your heart. But you have to let them do it. If you don't they will associate crying/barking with you coming running - trust me, you do NOT want that.

5) Leave them from day one. You will be tempted to spend all day every day, for that first week, with your puppy. Don't. Let them get used to being alone (even if it's only a minute at a time - remember not to go back when they cry). I'm not saying abandon him/her for hours on end, but just get them used to it.

6) Handling. By this I mean get them used to having their balls (if it's a boy) (testicular cancer) or their eyes (cataracts, sleepy sand) or their ears (infections) inspected. I'm not saying grope your dog...but get them used to it. That way if you are ever worried something is wrong you won't have to fight the dog to check him/her is okay!

Once vaccinated.

A) Introduce your dog to as many other dogs as quickly as possible - little dogs, big dogs, fluffy dog, naked rat like dogs. Every dog. Always ask the other dog owners first and once your dog has had a quick sniff then move on. Don't linger. This helps socialise your dog but also teachers him/her that they don't pester. Take your dog away and reward it with treats afterwards - it will associate leaving other dogs/people with you and food (always useful!)

B) As soon as your dog can go out after it's second vaccine - straight to the groomers. Poodles need regular grooming and you'll want your dog used to it so when it gets bigger it doesn't get terrified at the thought of grooming.

Finally.

Remember that weeks 12 - 20 are awful. For everyone. This is when your puppy will start teething - they will be a bite little nightmare. You will likely think at least once 'why did I do this? I should have got a cat.' Everyone thinks that. It's natural. Tag team with your husband/wife/inlaws/parents to take a break - you'll need it. And do NOT feel bad when you do.

I'm sure others will have further advice (and I have likely forgotten something)! But do keep asking if you have questions - people on mumsnet have lots of experience raising all manner of doggies and it's good to share experiences and know what does/doesn't work!

Dotbydotbydot · 30/01/2024 13:43

@Devilshands THANK YOU SO MUCH!! I really really appreciate such detailed and comprehensive advice and will be acting on it. It hadn't occured to me to take the dog out before vaccinations just to watch the world.

I'll be following your tips and hope the start goes smoothly.... !

OP posts:
Wolfiefan · 30/01/2024 13:46

Sorry but some of that isn’t great advice. Your puppy may be happy to be left. Or it may not be. Never leave a puppy for longer than they are happy with. That may be not at all to start with.
if you’re on FB join dog training advice and support. Great advice from positive dog trainers.

Dotbydotbydot · 30/01/2024 13:57

@Wolfiefan I presume that leaving them for tiny amounts (a minute or similar as suggested) from the beginning means it'll be easier to build that time up?

OP posts:
Wolfiefan · 30/01/2024 14:03

Look at that site. Often baby puppies just want to be with you and you should let them. As they grow in confidence they will stop following you about and be happy to be left. If you leave a young puppy to get distressed you’re more likely to end up with separation anxiety.

Devilshands · 30/01/2024 14:20

Wolfiefan · 30/01/2024 14:03

Look at that site. Often baby puppies just want to be with you and you should let them. As they grow in confidence they will stop following you about and be happy to be left. If you leave a young puppy to get distressed you’re more likely to end up with separation anxiety.

Never leave a puppy for longer than they are happy with.

That's just nonsense.

You can't just turn round one day in six months time and decide 'now is right' to leave your puppy. You need to start gradually.

Should OP keep the puppy with her overnight the first night and therefore risk it never being able to sleep along because it will cry when she crates it? No. Of course she shouldn't. Puppies need to be left and not just at night - otherwise they never learn. No one is saying abandon the puppy for thirty minutes - we're saying start off with thirty seconds and gradually work up.

There are dozens more links just like the below - all of which say leaving the puppy alone for a few minutes from the beginning is good for it.

Tbh if people are taking advice off Facebook on what makes for good dog training that explains the poor socialisation, resilience levels and general obedience of many dogs...

https://www.akc.org/expert-advice/training/leaving-puppy-alone/

https://www.rspca.org.uk/adviceandwelfare/pets/dogs/training/leftalone

The Importance of Teaching Your Puppy How to Be Alone

https://www.akc.org/expert-advice/training/leaving-puppy-alone

Wolfiefan · 30/01/2024 14:32

@Devilshands the FB group I mentioned is run by behaviourists. Of course you shouldn’t be with your dog 24/7 for 2 years then expect it to be ok with being left alone for 6 hours. But a new puppy has been taken from mum, siblings and the only home it has ever known. It needs to be close to humans for comfort and reassurance. (Some more so than others.) If you leave a really distressed pup alone to cry you just teach it that being alone is scary and make everything worse.

Wolfiefan · 30/01/2024 14:36

https://m.facebook.com/groups/dogtrainingadviceandsupport/
this group is run by professional dog trainers. They give practical and clear advise and there are files covering everything from first night and toilet training to resource guarding and recall.

Log in or sign up to view

See posts, photos and more on Facebook.

https://m.facebook.com/groups/dogtrainingadviceandsupport/

Zebracat · 30/01/2024 15:03

Remember he’s a dog, not a child. Don’t pick him up every time you feel threatened, dont have him in your bed unless you are happy for him to always be there, put him out of the way if people are bothered / allergic. Don’t feel him from your plate. Poodles are the best dogs in the world but toys and miniatures are sometimes babied and indulged so they become snappy and entitled.
Use your voice sparingly, so he knows to pay attention and not just ignore you. Calm people have calm dogs( mainly). But the best advice is that dogs are dogs and quite often, arseholes. They wee and poo, roll in poo, eat poo and anything inedible, turn your back for a second and they will steal anything. They will drag your dirty pants or used tampons into the room when you are entertaining , hump your aged relatives, develop strange fears and fixations, destroy your soft furnishings, and your garden, bark until your neighbours hate you. My dog stole 4 bananas yesterday. Very bad. But I think they are entirely worth it. Really important to go to training!

startingoveragainagain · 30/01/2024 15:16

Definitely leave the puppy. I used to leave mine and just walk up to the end of the road and back again a few times a day. It's not so much the length of time you are gone, but more that they are confident you are going to come back.

DataBatman · 30/01/2024 17:08

You can't just turn round one day in six months time and decide 'now is right' to leave your puppy. You need to start gradually.

You can actually. We didn't leave our older pup home alone until she was about 7 months old. At that point we took her for a good walk, came home and went out without her for a couple of hours and she slept. We've never had an issue leaving her home alone since then.

catelynjane · 30/01/2024 17:20

DataBatman · 30/01/2024 17:08

You can't just turn round one day in six months time and decide 'now is right' to leave your puppy. You need to start gradually.

You can actually. We didn't leave our older pup home alone until she was about 7 months old. At that point we took her for a good walk, came home and went out without her for a couple of hours and she slept. We've never had an issue leaving her home alone since then.

You were very lucky - many dogs would have freaked out.

Devilshands · 30/01/2024 18:15

DataBatman · 30/01/2024 17:08

You can't just turn round one day in six months time and decide 'now is right' to leave your puppy. You need to start gradually.

You can actually. We didn't leave our older pup home alone until she was about 7 months old. At that point we took her for a good walk, came home and went out without her for a couple of hours and she slept. We've never had an issue leaving her home alone since then.

And how many people has that worked for, other than you? Probably none.

Dotbydotbydot · 30/01/2024 18:35

Think following the general consensus going to go by a little by little approach to being left alone! Seems to make the most sense.

Yes @Zebracat that he's a dog not a child! Definitely keen on that distinction and keeping those boundaries (while also having him as a loved part of the family). We've got the children already, looking to add the dog!

Do people think training at home (I have a couple of books) is doable? (will take to socialise with other dogs). Or is a class invaluable?

OP posts:
DataBatman · 30/01/2024 18:47

It's worked for me with more than one dog. And I know others that follow the same approach. It's about letting a puppy bond and become secure in their attachment that you leave them at a stage where they're happy being more independent.

The only people I know with dogs that have/had separation anxiety forced small amounts of separation from day 1 (and they're all poodles/poodle crosses)

Dotbydotbydot · 30/01/2024 20:07

Thanks @DataBatman . Definitely interesting to hear this different approach and that you've seen it work so well. Will see what my books say and what the puppy is like the first few weeks and go from there taking onboard these different ideas

OP posts:
Zebracat · 30/01/2024 21:30

I think classes are helpful. Mainly because it’s easier to see what other people are doing wrong and right, than it is to critique yourself, especially with stuff like pulling. Trainers are great for teaching you to properly observe and get timing right too. Plus poodles are so bright, they really benefit from mental stimulation. And praise. Poodles like their superiority to be confirmed regularly. And dog training classes are proper little sitcoms, really fun.

Brightandbubly · 30/01/2024 21:34

Poodles are Velcro dogs will follow you everywhere even to the toilet They thrive on love

nodogz · 30/01/2024 21:44

It's already been said but get them used to grooming. Don't be fooled by a silky puppy coat, brush with a comb and slicker every other day. I was pretty good at this but neglected to do the tail as it wasnt knotty. Bit of a mistake as now it does get knotty but I'm not allowed to brush it!

ACynicalDad · 30/01/2024 23:24

We started leaving our Poodle Cross for extended periods at about 6 or 7 months and set up a camera, the first couple of times must have been hellish for our neighbours, but he soon got used to it. Can do about 4 hours at 9 months but make sure he's had a long (age appropriate) walk before that.

Dotbydotbydot · 30/01/2024 23:37

@nodogz thank you for grooming tip!

@DataBatman on a practical level, how did it work not leaving the puppy? As in, if you need to go to the supermarket or the hairdresser or whatever, where you cannot take a puppy with you, what did you do for those 7 months? Genuine question, I understand I will need to be with puppy a lot but presumed things like a weekly supermarket trip would be doable within a few weeks of him settling in....

OP posts:
Yllasin · 31/01/2024 08:04

Devilshands · 30/01/2024 12:43

1) Take her/him out from day dot. Literally, day one. Keep her/him in your arms and just walk around the local town/village, go to the seaside, go to parks etc. Don't let him/her sniff or touch other dogs but let them see the sights. Socialisation starts then - the longer you leave it (even until second vaccination) the harder it becomes. Lots of people don't do this until after the second vaccination stage and IME it's a mistake. Even if they can't say hi, they should learn about the world - it's also AMAZING at tiring them out. Trust me, a dog that has spent an hour in your arms watching the world go whilst sat in a cafe will sleep so much better than a dog that has just had a few hours in the garden and been played with.

For example; when I got my youngest dog, my mum would come on all my dog walks with me with my other two dogs. I'd drive to the beach and walk my other dogs whilst my mum sat on a bench with the puppy on her lap and he watched the world. Then we'd drive home. And puppy would sleep for two hours. It was BLISS.

2) Train from day one. Teach him/her how to do sit/down/basic recall/leave/stay etc from the first day. Don't feed them in a food bowl but instead from your hand and use their meal food as treats to reward them when they master something. This not only helps get them trained quickly, it helps tire them out (trust me, you will be so grateful for it) and it helps associate you with food.

On toilet training. When puppy is awake - every twenty minutes. Straight outside. Give them a high value treat when they perform (I also said 'wee wee' to mine after they did it along with a piece of chicken and after a week or so they would perform when I said wee wee) to reinforce that outside is where they do their business. If they do it inside - that's okay. Just pick them up straight away and take them outside. Mop the job up asap. After a game or play time - straight outside. When a puppy wakes up - straight outside.

For my youngest (14 months now). I set an alarm every three hours during the night for the first week. Every three hours I got up, took him outside and let him perform then tucked him back into the crate. If he didn't perform within a minute or so, he went back into the crate. By week two, he barked at night to let me know he had to go outside and he would go to the backdoor and bark during the day to let me know. He did it twice most nights. By week three, he slept through the night (9-4am). Dogs (especially poodles) are smart! You definitely don't need to be as keen as I was - but it's so nice not to have a house that smells like wee. Remember, little dogs have little bladders so a mini poodle will need to go far more often than a GSD would.

3) People. Invite people over soon. Not hundreds of them. But maybe your parents, young children etc. Don't overwhelm the dog but get them used to strangers in the house - this will avoid guarding behaviour.

4) Let them cry. Puppies cry. It's just like babies - their cry will break your heart. But you have to let them do it. If you don't they will associate crying/barking with you coming running - trust me, you do NOT want that.

5) Leave them from day one. You will be tempted to spend all day every day, for that first week, with your puppy. Don't. Let them get used to being alone (even if it's only a minute at a time - remember not to go back when they cry). I'm not saying abandon him/her for hours on end, but just get them used to it.

6) Handling. By this I mean get them used to having their balls (if it's a boy) (testicular cancer) or their eyes (cataracts, sleepy sand) or their ears (infections) inspected. I'm not saying grope your dog...but get them used to it. That way if you are ever worried something is wrong you won't have to fight the dog to check him/her is okay!

Once vaccinated.

A) Introduce your dog to as many other dogs as quickly as possible - little dogs, big dogs, fluffy dog, naked rat like dogs. Every dog. Always ask the other dog owners first and once your dog has had a quick sniff then move on. Don't linger. This helps socialise your dog but also teachers him/her that they don't pester. Take your dog away and reward it with treats afterwards - it will associate leaving other dogs/people with you and food (always useful!)

B) As soon as your dog can go out after it's second vaccine - straight to the groomers. Poodles need regular grooming and you'll want your dog used to it so when it gets bigger it doesn't get terrified at the thought of grooming.

Finally.

Remember that weeks 12 - 20 are awful. For everyone. This is when your puppy will start teething - they will be a bite little nightmare. You will likely think at least once 'why did I do this? I should have got a cat.' Everyone thinks that. It's natural. Tag team with your husband/wife/inlaws/parents to take a break - you'll need it. And do NOT feel bad when you do.

I'm sure others will have further advice (and I have likely forgotten something)! But do keep asking if you have questions - people on mumsnet have lots of experience raising all manner of doggies and it's good to share experiences and know what does/doesn't work!

Edited

Thank you for this, obv I'm not the OP but am getting my pup end of the month.
It's a great reminder and guide.
😀