XL Bully ban/ Staffy...

[namec1234]

Hi All,

Not sure if anyone is able to shed some light at all?

Aware the XL Bully breed is now being banned in the UK and I'm just wondering what this means for Staffordshire Bull Terriers and other similar breeds? I own a lovely Staffy and I'd be lying if I said this isn't concerning me. He is pure breed, KC registered etc so not a cross breed of any sort if that makes any difference.

Our family would be heartbroken.

Thanks in advance.

To be honest I've no idea.

The current pitbull guidance covers some staffs but is very rarely enforced

The proposed ban does not include staffys, and even those people with XL bullies will likely be able to keep them as long as they are registered, chipped and muzzled when out as far as I believe, similar to when the pit bull ban was introduced.

I think the issue is in how they decide what's a big staff, staff cross and an xl bully

Yes, however in OP's case, her Staffy is KC reg'd and so not a cross breed. OP, there is no suggestion they'd take your dog - and even people with dogs classed as XL bullies will probably be able to keep them for the rest of their life as long as they comply with whatever regulations that the govt decide on.

this is going to be so problematic and will take years to solve.

I was in the vet recently, there was a big reactive dog and this very large vet practice had to clear everyone out - someone with a cat was shut in one room, I was shut in another room with my small dog and the entire staff of the practice present (more than 6 people) and the owner had to deal with one very scary dog.

I think we should also have more control over dog ownership. It's become so dangerous. Dh was walking our small dog on a lead and a massive dog charged out of some bushes, floored my dh and was about to kill my dog (who had laid over on his back in submission) until the owner pulled the dog off and got a very nasty bite off his own dog for doing so.

I've just been watching Trevor Cooper on BBC, he's had a lot of calls from worried XL owners. I'm in a similarish position to you @namec1234 we have two rescue mastiff x dogs, while they don't look like XLs, if it all comes down to measurements again we might find ours measure up... One thing that concerned Trevor Cooper is that there has been no mention so far of exemption and he is looking to have some clarification on that.

I doubt staffies would be banned. They were around when pitballs were banned and didn't go on the list. Plus they are not mutant dogs bred so unethically that they're probably in pain, among other negatives that the xl bullies have... They do have a strong bite and are strong in general, I'm actually more nervous of them since getting a dog as I've seen them bowl my dog over as if she weighs nothing (when playing!). I would expect a well trained and socialised staffy to be a pretty safe to the public dog, whereas I think poor health and breeding makes the xl bullies too unpredictable.

@jlpth Oh wow, that sounds absolutely terrifying! It's horrifying when you're walking and a dog approaches I find. I used to have similar when I owned a smaller dog and my heart would drop when I'd see a bigger breed approach! Our Staff is incredibly well behaved, we undertook the KC training programme and even though amazingly trained, I still walk on lead as I'm worried what others would think. Do sometimes take to a private field though which is lovely.

@Unluckycat1 Yes yes yes to everything you've just said!

@Girlwithapple Thank you for that. I will keep an eye out!

I also walk my staffy on a lead even though she has amazing recall. People who live near me know how good she is and love her to bits but I have seen people side eye her so I feel it’s better all round

I think it’s far more likely that a staffy would be targeted under the pit bill type aspect of BSL. A KC reg staffy that’s true to standard is nothing like and XL or a PB.

@Needsomethingtoread Yep exactly that. Feel it's better for everyone and if it helps put peoples mind at rest (I know some are worried about the bull breeds) then I'd rather do that knowing people have a genuine fear of dogs at times.

Thanks @Lastqueenofscotland2. Am I right in thinking they have to be true to standard in order to be KC registered?

Not really

It just means that the parents are documented also.
So for example you might put down the dad as "x" Dog but actually it isn't. The pups aren't dna tested so there's no proof that this pup goes with that paper work, and that those parents are actually the parents

You can also breed to extremes so for example you can breed a runt to a runt throughout a long line and get some of the tea cup, tiny versions. Or the opposite of breeding the big examples etc. Merle has been encouraged currently as its in vogue which is never on the breed standard but is possible to do using kc registered parents.

It's why often show dogs look wildly different from the street versions as what your breeding for is different

You see tiny staffs and really big ones these days, just like working line gundogs and show can end up looking really different

I appreciate that YOUR Staffy is very well trained and you always have control, but the sad fact is that many Staffs are owned by the wrong people for the wrong reasons, and they have an incredibly strong bite and a huge mouth.

I've seen 2 staffs fighting in the street. Their owners (large adult men) couldn't stop the fight. One dog killed the other.

ive seen dogs fight before - this was another level by a mile. Horrific.

I wish all Bull breeds were banned. They were bred to fight bulls, then other dogs. They are simply too dangerous if they turn.

Yes I'm sure lots of pics of your adorable soft Bull breed will now be posted, but no cute pics will change the amount of damage they are capable of, more than any other breed.

Yes @Flamedmoth Makes perfect sense. Thank you for that  I suppose ours is quite a big Staffy in comparison to some but I'm sure still within standard, the vet said so anyway.

@BMW6 Thanks for taking time to post your opinion. I don't have anything to say back to it though. I didn't make the post to argue.

Even if SBTs were included in any new legislation, I highly doubt they're are going to order a mass cull. Compulsory muzzling and neutering would be the max I expect.

No. KC registration does not necessarily mean they will adhere to the ideal as set down by the RKC (Kennel Club). KC reg would certainly help prove they are a SBT not an XL Bully should that be necessary.

However as someone who keeps dogs, has a Rottweiler and also shows (exhibits) other breeds of dogs, I've had enough. They are not the culprit here but the SBTs at shows are forever snarling and snapping at each other and that is at high level showing in the UK. I hate being anywhere near the Stafford ring. I hope there is wide implications to new legislation. People should not be being killed and attacked by dogs. It's insane and just horrific and something severe needs to be done. If this means restricting /licencing /banning a lot of dog breeds so be it. We're at crunch point.

A 52 year old man died defending his elderly mother in a Staffordshire high street yesterday. Ripped to pieces by two fucking bull breeds. I feel utterly sick to the stomach just thinking about the amount he must have suffered.

Something big needs to happen. If we lose lots of dog breeds, so be it. There'll still be dogs.

They ban xl bully pretty sure some.people will.move to standard and pocket bully those that want a certain look and trait

There is a standard bully in our close and is all over sized muscle and is nasty the female owner can't actually hold last time she was holding on to a tree it so always her partner now.He admits his dog would tear throat out my lab if got free ( I see them and turn walk away)

Yet next door xl bully is far safer and never had a reason to worry (but I can also understand why so many people are worried)

I’ll be exceptionally unpopular for saying it but I think all types of bull terriers should be banned. Sadly for the few responsible owners the many many idiots who use their dogs as style/status statements have ruined it for them. Anything less than a blanket ban will be pointless. Sorry.

Problem with a ban on all bull breeds is that people will shift to breeding aggression into other large breeds.

I’d like all dogs over a certain weight to require a license to keep and breed. Just make it too difficult to create a dangerous dog.

@kistanbul I think a licence and proof of extensive training is more than fair and I think people would find that the majority of owners would be more than happy to comply! I know I would.

@Blinkingbonkers That's so sad to hear But also understand your mindset. It is such a shame that they're tarnished due to irresponsibility.

Isn’t it about American bully’s? I would have thought Staffys are fine.

It would just be easier to introduce blanket measures for all bull breeds - muzzle , lead etc I’m sure that way it would be easier to enforce .

@Floralnomad I don't hate the idea of this at all. As long as no one will be seizing, destroying or assessing my dog for months/ years then I'd do whatever it takes.

I own a Stafford and I’m not concerned. They’re an established breed and if you have the papers, it’s easy to prove they’re safe.

To ban the Stafford I think you’d be looking at all banning Rottweilers and German shepherds etc which have a strong guard instinct and a lot of power.