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The doghouse

If you're worried about your pet's health, please speak to a vet or qualified professional.

New puppy nightmare

54 replies

Sunny06 · 28/05/2023 07:33

Is anyone else having a nightmare trying to crate train? I’m on day 3 and feeling like a zombie as I’m running on no sleep 😵‍💫
It’s tough work but I’m trying to remain positive that it will get easier

OP posts:
Simianwalk · 28/05/2023 09:25

We have had 5 dogs now. 3 loved the crate, 2 didn't. To get them used to the crate we fed them in there and also lay in the crate with them for a while.

mauveiscurious · 28/05/2023 09:36

We ditched the crate on day two, happy dog happy pup

mauveiscurious · 28/05/2023 09:41

Remember Crate training is an American fad, no dog was crate trained before social media.

Sunny06 · 28/05/2023 09:49

To all those saying that I like the dog in a crate in another room and leave him to cry. That is NOT the case at all.
I already practiced with him but putting food/treats in the crate which he happily goes in & out.
I see the pros & cons of crate training so I wanted to give it a go but puppy seems most at peace lying on the carpet on the sofa next to me. I have been sleeping with him in the living room

OP posts:
Sunny06 · 28/05/2023 09:51

Also the door is open at all times in the day so he is never locked in it’s only when I try close it for a minute or two that he whines

OP posts:
bozzabollix · 28/05/2023 09:54

My first two Labradors loved crate training, but my latest lab hated it, in the end I left it open, my middle lab slept in it and our puppy on her bed. Even if I slept next to the crate with my hand through the bars she still cried, I couldn’t handle the lack of sleep.

Anyway she saw our room as a large crate and still asked to go out so house training was still ok. Doubt I’d get another crate again.

Discwriter · 28/05/2023 09:59

I've had dogs all my life growing up and never heard of crate training till I moved to the UK. We tried it with our pup but she hated it - wanted to be with us. We ditched the crate and she's happy and settled. Takes herself off to her bed when she wants a nap.

HappiestSleeping · 28/05/2023 10:00

twistyizzy · 28/05/2023 08:39

Actually for any reactive/anxious dogs, crates are their safe space and therefore invaluable. It very much depends on the dog.

Plus one for this. My rescue is two and a half and as soon as I put a crate out, he was straight in it. He goes there by himself whenever he wants. I only put one up as I was thinking about how to keep him safe in the car and was going to use a crate there so wanted one in the house for him to get used to. Turns out I didn't need to worry.

Sunny06 · 28/05/2023 10:49

Can anyone advise on what to do when a puppy wees/poos when you leave the room for a minute or two? It happens after I take him outside to go to the toilet

OP posts:
Snoken · 28/05/2023 10:55

Sunny06 · 28/05/2023 10:49

Can anyone advise on what to do when a puppy wees/poos when you leave the room for a minute or two? It happens after I take him outside to go to the toilet

It's probably separation anxiety, which is also why it is unhappy in the crate. All you can do is work on its confidence and slowly build up to leaving it alone for short periods of time. Don't tell it off when it happens, but praise when it doesn't.

bingohandjob · 28/05/2023 10:58

twistyizzy · 28/05/2023 08:39

Actually for any reactive/anxious dogs, crates are their safe space and therefore invaluable. It very much depends on the dog.

Fully agree with twisty - my dog loves his crate which is his den. It's super comfortable, darkened, and his safe space when he wants time out and was a real haven for him during fireworks season and when we've have really house rattling thunderstorms. We now only ever secure him away when it's for his safety and only for very short bursts but when we first had him we did use it to enforce naps and for him to feel secure being left to sleep overnight - we did not have it in our room and only slept on sofa near him for first new nights. During the puppy days, for naps, he'd maybe grumble for a moment then flake out into a deep sleep when we told him "in your crate" - he couldn't self regulate this on his bed in the living space so for this dog and our family it worked brilliantly. We were fortunate he came to us very used to a crate and pretty much toilet trained but it did reinforce the toilet training in the first week so I could see how it might help others. A crate should not be used to house a dog hours on end but used with the dog's and especially a puppy's welfare balanced with training behaviours you want in your home, it's a great resource for lots of people. You wouldn't put a baby in a crib with no sides on it if you wanted to ensure it stays safe and doesn't roll out - using a pen on crate is similar for a puppy. Appreciate it's not for everyone but it's also good for some! It's also been invaluable to teach him he's safe eg at the vets if he needs to be crated or in our dog walker's travel crate in car/van - in fact, when he walks past other cars with them an the boot door is open, he wants to jump in!

coffeecupsandwaxmelts · 28/05/2023 11:02

Sunny06 · 28/05/2023 10:49

Can anyone advise on what to do when a puppy wees/poos when you leave the room for a minute or two? It happens after I take him outside to go to the toilet

This sounds like separation anxiety - basically your puppy panics when you leave and toilets through fear.

The only way to prevent it is to never leave the puppy alone for now.

Sunny06 · 28/05/2023 11:17

What do you all do when you need to go to the toilet but he doesn’t follow you into the room? I literally leave him for 30 seconds

OP posts:
coffeecupsandwaxmelts · 28/05/2023 11:20

Sunny06 · 28/05/2023 11:17

What do you all do when you need to go to the toilet but he doesn’t follow you into the room? I literally leave him for 30 seconds

I had mine on a house-lead attached to my waist and took him with me everywhere.

It was a pain in the arse but much better than constantly cleaning up poo and pee.

bingohandjob · 28/05/2023 11:20

mauveiscurious · 28/05/2023 09:41

Remember Crate training is an American fad, no dog was crate trained before social media.

I think a fair number of very reputable breeders, kennels, trainers and working/gun dog trainers would argue with that! It's what is right for your dog and your life/home. I think it's fair to say that it does work really well for some, not for others.

coffeecupsandwaxmelts · 28/05/2023 11:23

mauveiscurious · 28/05/2023 09:41

Remember Crate training is an American fad, no dog was crate trained before social media.

It's not an "American fad" at all.

Working dogs have been crated and kennelled for years in this country.

pookiedoodlepuppy · 28/05/2023 11:33

bingohandjob · 28/05/2023 11:20

I think a fair number of very reputable breeders, kennels, trainers and working/gun dog trainers would argue with that! It's what is right for your dog and your life/home. I think it's fair to say that it does work really well for some, not for others.

Really ?! I used a large cardboard box in the 90's to that affect and then bought an actual crate in '03 .

pookiedoodlepuppy · 28/05/2023 11:42

ahh OP you're having a rough day , tomorrow will be better 🍷

Anewuser · 28/05/2023 11:51

The answer to “what does the dog do when we leave the room?” Is come with us. A lot of dog owners will say their dog follows them everywhere - to the toilet/shower, outside to empty the bin or put out recycling, into the garden to cut the grass etc. I can’t remember the last time I did something by myself at home!

twistyizzy · 28/05/2023 12:02

mauveiscurious · 28/05/2023 09:41

Remember Crate training is an American fad, no dog was crate trained before social media.

Completely inaccurate. Working dogs have always been kennelled/crated in the UK.

twistyizzy · 28/05/2023 12:05

Sunny06 · 28/05/2023 10:49

Can anyone advise on what to do when a puppy wees/poos when you leave the room for a minute or two? It happens after I take him outside to go to the toilet

It is a puppy, it has been torm away from Mum so you are now Mum. Let it follow you but also you need to TRAIN it to be left otherwise pup will develop separation anxiety. Read up on flitting and again the Facebook group I mentioned earlier has lots of going advice on how to do this.
You have the equivalent of a 1 Yr old child so you need to think about what puppy needs/wants rather than what you think it should be able to do. It is up to you to guide and teach puppy, they don't magically know what is expected of them

LightDrizzle · 28/05/2023 12:39

It’s so hard!

My only puppy was before crating became normal in the U.K. so he just had a bed in the dining kitchen in a very small two up two down cottage. Like you I slept downstairs on the sofa and he was in the neighbouring kitchen with a lino floor until he was sleeping through as he was a giant breed and we had a steep kite-winder staircase that he couldn’t have used safely so him sleeping upstairs was never an option.

Are you a light sleeper? I found because he was on my mind, like when my babies were tiny, I’d wake up as soon as he started stirring and I’d be up and out in the garden with him before he got round to weeing or pooing. If you are a heavy sleeper a monitor might help. I was always silent and boring in the night except for very muted praise once he’d done a wee or poo. He was on a loose lead at night in the garden and I had a torch so I knew if he was going or not. It was February and we had snow and it was fucking freezing! During the day I took him out on waking from naps, after playing, after eating or every 30 mins. I think he was on a loose lead then too but can’t swear to it. The door wasn’t left open because the weather was freezing but I think that also helped toilet training because I knew when he had and hadn’t toileted and he also learned very quickly that the garden was for weeing and pooing.

During the day you could do the flitting game, never preventing him from following you, but hopefully boring him and reassuring him into relaxing in the knowledge that you leaving him doesn’t mean abandonment. Unfortunately because the crate door was shut overnight that will have created anxiety so I wouldn’t consider shutting that door again in the near future.

If you lift all rugs and maybe buy a big piece of a cheap roll of vinyl flooring to cover most of any carpet, you can minimise the work and stress of inevitable accidents. I’m sure you know this but it’s important not to make a fuss of accidents as that just creates more anxiety around toileting.

My puppy was from a breed that although very devoted, is a more independent and steady breed than many companion or sporting breeds so I realise I might have had an easier ride than is normal for puppies. He wasn’t a Velcro dog but on the other hand he was never physically prevented him joining us if he wanted to. Dear god the mouthing though! My forearms were covered in bruises for weeks.

At 3 days your puppy is so tiny it’s fine for him to be with one of you all the time, even if that involves him following you to the loo. Is there a loo you can use that he can follow you too if he wants to? I’d leave doors open and not announce your plans but crack on and let him join you or not. If he follows ignore him, you want to be quite boring some of the time so eventually he’d rather not get up, or break off chewing on that nice toy every time you move out of sight.

It’s such early days. This won’t be the rest of your life, I promise!

Sunny06 · 28/05/2023 13:01

Thank you all for the replies and helpful comments. For example when I do nip to the low he refuses to follow me even though the door is open and I’m saying/actioning him to come with me. He’d rather sit in the living room than poo or wee because he panics. I’ve tried to offer treats to follow but he gets to the hallway then backs out

OP posts:
LacewingOrpington · 28/05/2023 13:15

Sunny06 · 28/05/2023 10:49

Can anyone advise on what to do when a puppy wees/poos when you leave the room for a minute or two? It happens after I take him outside to go to the toilet

I just clean it up. I try and let them out when they wake up and after eating and just don’t worry the rest of the time. I also have a phrase I say when I take them outside and they go and treat them afterwards. Our dogs have always ended up fully toilet trained. Sometimes takes a bit longer depending on the dog. My husband always goes through a few weeks of despair where he thinks they’ll never be toilet trained and that’s usually just before it happens!

primoseyellow · 28/05/2023 13:29

@Sunny06 if he gets to the hallway then backs out has something happened in that area to scare him? A loud noise ,the chain flushing, or something fell? I remember our puppy was scared of the loo brush for a few days!

Does he ever go to toilet outside? Can you use treats and encourage him to follow you then walk straight back to the living room?

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