When do you know its time?

[Feeblebeeble]

We have a 13 year old greyhound who we adopted 7 years ago and who we love to bits. Her mobility started to decline about 6 months ago and her walks have been getting gradually shorter and shorter during this time. Unfortunately she fell down the stairs 3 weeks ago (she was spooked by a car alarm and tried to escape upstairs) and landed on her rear with her hind legs up near her ears. She was obviously really hurt and crying out in pain. My DH had to carry her to her bed. We took her to the vet who gave her some painkillers and told us that her left hip joint is very weak. She has improved a bit but has not managed to walk any further than about 100 yards down the road before she starts whimpering. We have now stopped walking her and she can just about potter around the garden although she is limping quite badly and struggles to get up from lying down.

I am beginning to wonder if we might have to make the difficult decision about whether it is time to let her go. When do you know? I would hate to think she is in constant pain although she is still eating well and seems to enjoy her food.

I am heartbroken. Her sparkle seems to have gone and I can't remember the last time she looked happy and wagged her tail.

Please no judgement. She is our first dog and we don't know what to do for the best. The vet has not suggested any further treatment options.

Oh am so so sorry @Feeblebeeble, how is she doing with toileting? It's such a horrible horrible decision to make. Is someone with her most of the day, is she crying at night or anything? Unmumsnetty hugs to you.

Usually when you find yourself asking when is the right time, it’s usually the right time

Although that doesn’t make it any easier.

If she is still eating and enjoying her food then she deserves to carry on - if she was in pain she would not be eating - I would never have an animal euthanised just because they can’t walk - let her eat and sleep - carry her out in her bed into the garden to get some sunshine - make her last months as comfortable as possible for her 💐

And absolutely zero judgement here.

Please go back to your vet and tell them your dog needs help. It'a appalling that they have suggested nothing to help her. There may be nothing available, but at the point where you have exhausted all available options and you think she has had enough, then you will feel easier about letting her move on.
BUT - I would want anti inflammatories for the soft tissue damage and pain relief along the lines of gabapentin and paracetamol to back that up.
It doesn't matter if she's your first or your 10th - it hurts the same every time, but I always need to know that I did everything I could to make them happy and comfortable.
Massive hug for you and your girl xx

When you are wondering if it's time, it probably is.
Is she getting better or worse?

I'd book her in, spoil her rotten for a few days. If she improves, great you can cancel. If she doesn't, I'd say it's time.

I'm a big believer in a day too soon is better than a day too late as far as euthanasia goes. I also strongly disagree that an animal that is still eating should never be euthanised, they can have terrible suffering but still eat, and quality of life is far more important than quantity.
In your shoes I'd go back to the vet and say how she hasn't improved and that you are considering euthanasiaand ask if there is anything you can try first The vet should give an honest opinion, but I think you always know deep down when it is time.

Take her back to the vet, describe your concerns, and listen to what they say.

Look, DDog is 13 and a greyhound, very few live to 14 or older. You, however, have to live with whatever decision you make for decades. So really listen to the vet, and to your own heart, and don't be afraid to ask questions or even consult another vet to see what they say.

You can normally ask for a home visit (with good vets anyway) for euthanasia, and can ask for DDog to be sedated first so that the end is as peaceful as possible - this is entirely for you, but you are important too.

I've had dogs for decades, and have ended up calling the vet in for most of them (a couple did pass away on their own time). It still unsettles me, it still doesn't feel "right", just the least bad option when all the options suck. The vets have been pretty good at gently indicating when they think it's time to start considering euthanasia because no more can be done.

I know from experience that my dog can be in severe pain but mask it. Stopping walking and sitting down when out was the only way we knew he was in a lot of pain so still eating doesn't mean much to me in terms of quality.

Sorry OP but if you are asking the question I think you already know deep down that it's a valid option to consider

I'm so sorry OP, it's absolutely heartbreaking isn't it. I'm another one who would say a day too early rather than a week too late. Dogs are so stoic and hide how they are feeling. The fact you are asking yourself the question means it may be time. Hugs for you and your lovely girl

I'm sorry you're all going through this, it's horrible.

I would take her to a different vet to get their opinion. Your vet sounds hopeless.

try to focus on the fantastic years you have given her.! A lot sadly don't get that.

Sad to say, she sounds as if she is in constant pain. As a vet I could not agree LESS with the poster who would wait until an animal can no longer eat before having mercy on them.
Most people wait too long, some of them far too long.
Why would one wait until every spark of joy is extinguished? It's not you doing the battling.

It’s always difficult. I spent a while at the end wondering about my old girl. She was on good pain medication, short walks, eating and pooing fine, happy still, then just went dramatically downhill over 24 hours. So I knew and the vet came out.

I would suggest make sure her pain medication is as good as poss. Mine was on metacam plus tramadol (big dog). I also used to give her doggie massages over her back, hips, shoulders and joints. She really loved it and I think it helped her a lot.

All the best

I agree, there is so much pain relief available, my 13 year old dog is on monthly injections and liquid paracetamol with her arthritis, she is living life to the full and is very happy, I would only PTS if her discomfort could not be controlled.

Eating and drinking is the bare minimum.
There needs to be something else in the dog's life.

Oh @FeeFeeblebeeble. Sending you so much love. I confess that I did a double take when I saw your thread and wondered if my thread had resurfaced. A couple of months ago I posted a very similarly titled thread about our nearly 13 year old greyhound who we'd had for 8 years. Like your girl he'd developed difficulties walking and was clearly in pain on walks, he still enjoyed his food but just like yours he'd also lost his spark. When he started to not be able to squat properly to pop due to his poor hips/legs we contacted a vet who said that he was probably in more pain than he was letting on.

We decided to opt for euthanasia that week and I can't lie, it was incredibly hard to be there with him at the end and I've cried a lot since. I still think of him every day and do things like saving toast crusts or automatically checking my pockets for poo bags before leaving the house. But ultimately I know in the moments when I've questioned our choice I've been thinking of him as he was when he was a younger dog, and as soon as I remember the last few weeks of his life I feel reassured that we acted in his best interests. It's such a burden of responsibility that we bear as dog owners if the time comes where we are put in a position of deciding whether it's time, my thoughts are with you whatever decision you make. Seeing our dogs age before our eyes feels terribly cruel.

For what it's worth if it would help I'd suggest contacting your vet and saying overtly that you're not sure whether putting your girl to sleep is the kindest thing at this point and see what they respond. Any vet worth their salt would be balanced and put your dog first with their advice. X

For some unknown reason mumsnet added a Fee into your name, should have tagged you above @Feeblebeeble

It's always a horrible decision to have to make. Might be worth getting a second opinion from a different vet maybe. If she's not got long to go then just try and make her time left as comfortable and happy as possible. Now this is just my opinion...but I've found with animals that the eyes are a good giveaway as to when the animal has had enough. When I was a child I remember asking my mum if our German Shepherd Otto was sad. (He was very old and his hips had gone) I can still remember it now, if a dog could look like he was about to cry that's what it looked like. My Mum took me to school and when she got home he'd died. I think you'll know when your dog has had enough.

Thank you for your messages. I have read them all. She is still eating and appears to be enjoying her food but other than that she is either sleeping or struggling to get comfortable so I do think she is in pain. She is able to toilet but sometimes finds it difficult to get into position. She sometimes cries at night @MichelleScarn and we are taking it in turns to sleep downstairs with her.

@mummabubs greyhounds are the best! I'm so sorry you have recently been in this position. I'm wondering if she is in more pain than she is letting on. It's interesting what you say about the eyes @PoshHorseyBird because her eyes look dull and sad.

I will call the vet again and see if there are other pain options we can try and also see if I can have a frank discussion with them.

Here she is in her younger days

I’m sorry but I don’t agree with this.

We recently lost a very old dog (also a pointy hound). He’d been ill for quite some time with several chronic, but not ultimately terminal, health issues and we wanted to be sure we made sure he was pain-free, comfortable and happy in his last few months. He was seen by the vet regularly and we had lots of discussions with them about how to know when the time is right. The most important thing they impressed on us is that eating and drinking is no indication of welfare. The vast majority of dogs will continue to eat right up to the end, (unless their illness is something that actually affects their stomach/digestion).

Dogs are incredibly stoic, they don’t show pain like we do and when they do it usually means it’s significant.

Our vet advised us to think of a time in the last few years when he had a good quality of life and was really happy, then compare that quality of life to what he had left. Decide which things gave him the most joy/happiness to give him that quality of life and which ones he honestly wouldn’t be happy without. They also suggested writing a list of ‘absolutes’ ie events that would be mean no more questioning ourselves (for us it was things like not being able to get up on his own, becoming incontinent, clearly in pain that we couldn’t control or being obviously distressed by his mobility issues).

OP I would definitely speak to the vet again about pain relief options. A good vet will work with you to make sure they are kept out of pain. It should be their priority. My boy was on anti-inflammatories, paracetamol and gabapentin. The gabapentin made a big difference to his quality of life towards the end.

One morning he couldn’t get up, tried, fell back with his back legs refusing to work and really panicked then just totally defeated. The look on his face was enough, we knew he wasn’t happy living like that. He had been going downhill slightly for a couple of days, had toileted in the house a couple of times when he didn’t make it to the back door and seemed to have lost his sparkle, iykwim, but we weren’t sure until that moment.

It was a very hard decision, but a few months on, even though we miss him every single day, we know it was the right one for him and keeping him going any longer would have been for us not him.

So sorry you are going through this @Feeblebeeble she is absolutely beautiful.

She's gone😢I'm in bits. We managed to get some decent pain relief and she rallied after I first posted and then she fell again yesterday and lost the use of her hind legs. My DH had to carry her into the vets. It was so sad to see her like that. She fell asleep with DH and I by her side and at least she is no longer in pain. We loved her soo much xx

I’m so sorry for your loss x

I'm so so sorry you've lost your girl xx

Sounds like she had a lovely life with you OP, and you made her very happy.

I’m so sorry 😢
It’s the worst thing about being a dog owner, but it’s also the most loving thing you can do.

Oh I'm so sorry for the loss of your lovely girl... so sad to read this. We lost our 5 year old Retriever a month ago to multiple brain tumours. It'll hurt like he'll for a while but does get easier with time...im not constantly blubbingany more.....certain things set me iff, but im better. Take comfort from the fact she had the best life with you and felt nothing but love right til the end. She's now running pain free over the rainbow bridge. Take care