Dobermann, Newfoundland, Irish Wolfhound, St Bernard or Leonberger?

[LockDownAndTwoSmokingBarrels]

We’re considering these 3 breeds. Not sure which one to go for!

Our dog will be going on 1 hour walks daily with longer walks on a Wednesday and weekends (and very long - all day walks probably once a fortnight).

I want a dog that can be offlead safely (With training of course).

I want a friendly dog that can be trusted with children (I don’t have children at home but I have a toddler grandchild who visits once a week).

I want a dog I can take on holiday with me.

I want a breed who is responsive to obedience training.
I am inexperienced dog owner. Last had a dog 20 years ago.

Must be a large dog.

I would hate to have a reactive dog (my last one was dog reactive hence why I’ve been put off getting another for so long).

We have a training school in mind and would be doing KCGC awards.

Dobermann, Newfoundland, Irish wolfhound, St Bernard or Leonberger??

[quote Wolfiefan]@sweetzy wolfhounds are sighthounds. They don’t take off after scent but will take after things they spot!
They like to be with their humans. And pups mustn’t have too much exercise at all whilst growing. No jumping off furniture. No flights of steps.
Parents MUST be heart tested and puppies liver shunt tested. Go through breed club to find breeders. Plenty of dreadful ones out there. And INSURE! For thousands. Large dogs get large bills!
Also giants shouldn’t be neutered until at least they are mature.
Of the breeds you have picked the grooming stands out. How much would you do?
Wolfhounds must be able to run. Is there somewhere you can let them do this?
Does slobber bother uou? Some of those breeds really do!
And a toddler? I wouldn’t get any giant dog until they were school age. Puppies bite. And jump. And big puppies don’t know they are big!
Shame you’ve missed crufts. Discover dogs would have been great.
Breed clubs will have shows you can go to and ask questions etc.[/quote]
Apologies for my ignorance! They sound lovely and I do love a massive dog. 😊

The Doberman that lived in our road was a pain in the bum. It barked, howled and whined all the time when it was left alone at home. Pleeeease chose a 'quiet' breed for the sake of your neighbours.

We have leonbergers (obviously) and they fit all of your requirements. Mine walk roughly 3-4 miles per day with another quick 15min wander on a night before bed but are happy enough to plod on all day. They are also equally happy to potter around the garden if required.

Mine do not stink however they take a lot of grooming. They only smell if you can’t be bothered to maintain the coat and let them get wet and don’t dry the coat properly. Otherwise they smell like any other dog (and I work with dogs…they smell considerably less than some small ones )
Daily brushing and a weekly blast with a blaster drier to get rid of the undercoat. I dry mine if they are wet. They love mud and ponds though.
They don’t drool. My GSD is more drooly than the bergers.

I’ve had no reactivity issues but adolescence is difficult at times with such a big dog. All dogs go through the bolshy stage but it’s a different kettle of fish if your teenage boy is 80kgs. Early neutering is not recommended so you really do have to grin and bare the adolescent bit until the brain returns once the hormones settle. I have attended obedience with all of mine up until adulthood. I dabbled in competitive obedience at one point but to be honest it’s hard to hold your own against something like a collie in sport! They will do anything I ask but in their own time. Mine are reasonably active and will catch a ball and that type of thing.
They don’t particularly have any prey drive that I have found but obviously it’s harder if you have a giant and live somewhere there are lots of small dogs off lead for the squished factor. I don’t let mine off around strangers for this reason.
They always recall and stay close. They have never ran away and probably couldn’t be bothered to do so.

Ive holidayed all over the Uk without issue. We have been to the lakes numerous times and never had anyone refuse us. One pub said they were too big and made us sit outside but that’s it

We have small children and they are very gentle and loving but are obviously big so I am careful around exciting things like dinnertime when a small child could get sent flying in excitement!
They are very affectionate and will try and sit on you like a lap dog. They really do love to be with the family and wouldn’t do well left much. Mine haven’t been destructive when left and mostly sleep but they are happier when we are home.

They don’t actually eat that much more than an average large dog…probably because they don’t burn loads of energy running around the house. They are expensive to insure. The average lifespan is lower than some of the larger breeds, somewhere around 8-10 although there are plenty in double figures.

I do adore mine, I think they are the perfect dogs but not everyone wants a dog the size and cost of a Shetland pony. Have you met any in real life as they really are bigger than you think!

Another Leo owner here. In addition to Leonbergers comments I would add the following:

Most hotels have a limit of 40kg with respect to dogs. You might find anything bigger than a doberman tricky to get accepted if you aren't planning on a holiday rental. Mine also likes routine. His uncle was the same so don't assume they will immediately settle somewhere else. Think about your car. My Leo likes to be able to stand up and turn around when travelling. This means many cars are ruled out. Anything high requires use of a ramp. Consider the cost of medicines. Leos take 3 to 4 times the amount of everything in comparison to a cockapoo or similar- anaesthetic, worming tablets, painkillers etc. It soon adds up. Insurance is hugely expensive because a Leo going wrong is gonna cost more of everything at the vets! Grooming is definitely a consideration (as will a Newfie/St B) - they are like giant Velcro's when you walk them in the woods for examples. Plus they like to lean against everything, but particularly walls... Mine comes alive at night which is a trait. They are a guardian breed so on high alert all night long. Mine has a high prey drive for small furries - rabbits, cats, foxes. They also like to be able to wander in and out of the house whenever they want - ok in Summer, a PITA in winter. Mine is also particularly stubborn and recall can be hit and miss even with high value treats - there is no rhyme and reason as to when this occurs...!

That said for all of the negatives/things to consider they are a very easy dog to keep and a well socialised dog loves being part of the family pack. One walk in the morning and mine is out for the count for the rest of the day. Mine doesn't like a bed so sleeps on a hard floor. They do love being cold and walking in the summer does require a very early morning walk.

One thing to consider - our breeder requires someone to vouch for them as she only likes to sell to either previous Leo owners or someone with giant breed experience so you'll need to do some research as to how to get on the list. There are two different styles of Leo IME at the shows, giant bear-like dogs like a Newfie or smaller examples more akin to an Estrella, both are lovely but very distinct in size difference.

Wolfies are also lovely natured but I think I am right in saying a shorter lifespan than a Leo. Newfies are lovely but do drool. Leos do not. Good luck with your search!

Not sure why you’re singling the Wolfhound out for lifespan, I would think Newfoundlands and Saints come in the same category on average?

I would think the Leonberger your best bet, but thorough training required. I’ve not lived with them, so bow to the experience of those who have, but the ones I’ve known certainly had strong prey drive when not controlled.

I have to admit I didn't know what a lot of these breeds were but they are all so gorgeous, I am not surprised you are having difficulty decided, they all sound like lovely breeds to get. I had no idea they were so big either.

I’ve had a wolfhound and have a 1yo Leonberger. Both lovely dogs. My Leonberger is much, much easier to train as she just wants to please. Both are gentle giants. The Leonberger does moult a lot, but contrary to what people have suggested don’t drool at all (though they are messy eaters!). Leonbergers (or at least mine) don’t actually eat much when they aren’t mid growth spurt- mine leaves food when she’s had enough and generally by choice eats smaller portions than my Labrador, who is on a diet, is allowed.

From my experience a leonberger would struggle with the all day walking, especially when they are older (not a huge life span either)

But very trainable to walk off lead, good recall and generally an amazing dog. Great with kids

Tail is very swishy

I completely forgot about the heat since it’s been winter for years it feels like
They are rubbish in the heat. I don’t want them at all and then spend all day lying in the pond or paddling pool if it’s a smidge above 20 degrees. They sleep on our stone floors and don’t like to be hot in the house either. We leave our doors open and they wander in and out most of the day, I can often find them asleep on the patio in the rain

I also forgot to mention that 90% of other dogs seem to hate mine. I don’t live in a densely populated place but if I take them to the beach etc I’m constantly having to shield them from smaller dogs having a pop. I don’t think I would allow them to meet and greet strangers because even friendly dogs seem to have a go. The amount of times I’ve heard he’s never done that before is unbelievable.

@Leonberger lol at ‘he’s never done that before’ yeah, right.

Wet rainy dogs 😭😭😭

I'd say to go for a Newfie if you want a chill and cuddly dog who adores kids. But having one myself, you need to be aware of the puppy years. Big dogs take longer to mature and so they're in that crazy puppy state for up to two years. This suits us fine, but might not fit with you. You also wouldn't want to be walking a giant breed an hour a day especially not while they're growing, you could damage their delicate joints very easily.

On the plus, they're super chilled out and cuddly, really social and so eager to please which helps with training. They're great with kids, my girl loves my three young children so much, on a Monday morning when they leave for school she howls with sadness. She's not left alone DH is there, she just misses them.

Newfies are prone to seperation anxiety too. Which is manageable for sure, but you can't be leaving them long stretches all the time, it's not fair on them. But they're an amazing breed and such loving company.

Bernese Mountain Dog...hands down the BEST dogs in the world!! 💗💗💗💗

I'm on my third now...I've had labs, goldies and spaniels before...goldies are also awesome, but Berners are glorious dogs 🥰

I know not on your list, but I’d highly recommend an Irish setter. Lovely nature, big but within hotel limits, loves to walk, trainable, not reactive

Bernese mountain dogs are beautiful - can you tell me more about them? @SpringIntoChaos

I LOVE Irish Setters - not sure why I’ve not looked into them before! Could you tell me more about them @WouldBeGood

Grooming is not an issue for me, I love grooming and find it very therapeutic - I could do it all day! And I have a good shark vacuum 😂

Or a Gordon setter?

The Gordon Setters and English setters look lovely too- I’ve been looking at them idly as I lost my beautiful Irish Setter last year, and would love another dog of that type. She was just so gentle and affectionate, loved being with her people (or any people!), loved other dogs. Not too big to travel in the car with us - regular trips to France, loved being out no matter what the weather, hot or cold. They can be exuberant 😃. Check for known illnesses, etc, as you would with any dog breed of course.

We considered an Irish Wolfhound but ruled them out because life expectancy is so short- only 6 years on many cases.

"The characteristics you listed had me thinking Bernese Mountain dog"
Some lovely, some neurotic fear aggressive arseholes (more so than other breeds- maybe I've just been unlucky). The sweetest nicest one I ever knew got systemic histiocytosis at age 5 :-(
Newfoundland- I've known some right orthopaedic train wrecks, even more so than other giants- again poss unlucky.

I'd probably pick a Leo from that list, if I could be bothered with the grooming, which I couldn't, so on second thoughts I'd probably go with a Dobe and try to get one from really relaxed, non neurotic parents that had already thrown calm, non neurotic pups.

Oh yeah- insure up to the hilt or just check with your vet how much a GDV costs at 2am and make sure you can drop that on the counter at a moment's notice with possibly the cost of a TPLO a month later if you're really unlucky.

From your list I would prefer a Doberman purely from the grooming aspect. I struggle enough with my neurotic cocker spaniel. But if you don’t mind grooming then I love Newfoundland’s, we had one when I was little and it was the gentlest giant.

I would stay clear of Doberman’s, they are not easy to train and the ones I have met have been quite barky. From your list I would go for Newfoundland but sadly they don’t live very long and I don’t think I could cope with having a dog that will die before it’s ten years old.

I would look at getting a lab, retriever/flat coat or spaniel, all active dogs and trainable.

There’s a place near me that breeds Newfoundland’s with labradors and they are lovely

We had a wolfhound growing up. Beautiful, daft, clumsy beast that was scared of his own shadow. He wouldn't have coped with walks that long every day - they need short sharp bursts. He was OK off lead with me. He couldn't go upstairs as he wouldn't have been able to come back down. Rarely ever barked and never snapped. He was 14 stone and over 6ft long (giant even by breed standards) and died when he was about 8.

They're beautiful, we had him in a 3 bed semi with a good garden and plenty of countryside, but they certainly need a specific person!

Our family pet growing up was a Bernese - they have a lovely temperament and are trainable. We really want one but impossible to get one at the moment.

Gordon setter. Not as scatty as Irish.