Does this sound dodgy? Breeder

[SuspiciousHumanoid]

Hi, I’ve registered especially to get some opinions on this as I’m a bit worried.

Friend is getting two pups from a breeder found on P4H. They have been to a house and seen the pups, and the mother who they were suckling from. Also a dog who they were told was the dad.

Deposit was paid through P4H.

Friend was supposed to fetch pups at the end of this week and had a message from the breeder asking her to bank transfer the balance, a lot as you might imagine, the day before she fetches pups. Reason given was the breeder wanted to see it had cleared before they take the pups.

Friend messaged back saying she’d pay by bank transfer at the time of fetching pups and the money would transfer straight away, plus she’d show proof of the transfer.

Breeder said no. Apparently they don’t have such ‘sophisticated banking’ and transactions after 6pm don’t clear, or something.

Friend offered to take cash. Breeder said no, had to be transfer and had to be the day before.

The bank details friend has been given are a different name to the woman who they’ve met.

Friend said the breeder has sent her pics of vet records etc, and the breeder has said they can visit the pups the day they transfer the money, then pick them up the next.

I don’t feel right about this, it doesn’t seem right to me. It’s raising serious red flags that a legit breeder shouldn’t be raising.

Friend has said she’s google and FB stalked the breeder, she has a FB mutual, and that she’s not found anything concerning.

What do you think, does this all sound wrong? I can just think of so many ways this sounds dodgy that I personally wouldn’t go ahead but her DP has spoken on the phone to the breeder and she said he sounds happy that it’s legit. I can’t shake the feeling it’s not.

Collective dog house wisdom please MN, what do you think, and how else might we ascertain whether they’re dodgy or not?

Could it be that the breeder is being overly cautious about the funds going through?

Apart from anything else, no reputable breeder would sell two pups from the same litter to one person.

They're dodgy for selling two pups to one owner.

The money side is irrelevant imo.

Google the address. Surely they will show as registered breeders....
Part with not a penny more...

Scam.

Would bet any money that when she goes there breeder and dogs have gone. Probably not even their house.

Could she look up on the electoral role who lives there?

Agree re 2 pups - there would be absolutely no way I would transfer any money until the pup was in my arms. Account in a different name? There’s a scam where people hire out Airbnb’s get the money then are not there on pick up day - I hope your friend does not do this.

Go back on P4H and look at other ads... Look at the posters names. Look for the same details /same photo backgrounds /lounges /kitchens in other ads.. You can report ads etc also. I found lots of dpuppies with same number (same unusual woman's name also!) to ring with different 'home' settings. And reported them all.

It's the litter mares which is the biggest red flag. My dog came from what I now realise is a bit of a backyard breeder but when I suggested I might take 2 puppies she was having none of it. I got a flat no and a give me a call in a couple of years if you still want a second pup. It's been 7 and I don't 😂

The pups are a dog and a bitch, but yes, while my friend is a responsible owner, some wouldn’t be.

The breeder has been offered cash, which can be inconvenient, but surely that would be preferable to making yourself look suspicious? My friend has contacted the bank whose name came up when she put the details in her app, and they said it can take up to two hours, which I thought was standard.

Mates not mares!

Your friend isn't a responsible owner if she is taking 2 puppies from the same litter. Tell her to look up litter mate syndrome. The sex of the puppies doesn't matter. She needs to take herself off to the Facebook group "dog training advice and support" and have a good read.
No breeder worth their salt would allow this.
Also - sounds dodgy as hell re the bank transfer but this isn't the biggest problem. She should have legged it way before now.

The pups are a dog and a bitch, but yes, while my friend is a responsible owner, some wouldn’t be.

This makes her the very opposite of a responsible owner.

Has your "responsible friend" not heard of littermate syndrome and all the issues it can cause? And why would she want to have two opposite sex, same-age, un-neutered animals?

What is she going to do to prevent accidental mating? Neuter one far too early (which would make her incredibly irresponsible) or physically keep them apart for a month or more while the bitch is in season?

Please tell me they asked to see the breeders licence? And the link to their licence on their councils website? Licensing is a legal requirement under the updated animal welfare regulations except under very specific circumstances.

Oh, I’ve never heard of littermate syndrome, I’ll look that up.

My friend seems to be convinced this person is legit, mutual friend who knows the breeder well etc. i’m still not convinced, but it’s not my money.

why would she want to have two opposite sex, same-age, un-neutered animals?

Very much this.

Please get her to reconsider the whole thing.

Neither the ‘breeder’ nor your friend sound like they understand about dogs.

The money transfer wouldn’t bother me, the allowing two pups from the same litter would. I’d avoid that breeder for that reason.

I paid for my puppy in advance so I’m not sure it’s that unusual. I trusted the breeder and knew her on a breed circuit though.

I would be more concerned about a breeder allowing two pups to go at once.

A lot of breeders ask for payment the day before. Large sums of money can take hours to clear and it’s added stress and time on the day of collection as you won’t be allowed to take the puppy until the money has cleared.

My friend seems to be convinced this person is legit, mutual friend who knows the breeder well etc. i’m still not convinced, but it’s not my money.

You're both focusing on the wrong thing.

Come to think of it, our dog’s breeder said if it was bank transfer it would have to be paid the day before, but we paid cash in the end. I didn’t think they’d run off with the money though, because they were known to good friends and definitely lived where they said they did.

id message from a different account aski g for a pup and see if she sells the pup again

Right, well she seems convinced this person is legit, and it’s obviously not as unheard of as I thought. I’ve told her about the littermate thing which is all I can do.

Thanks for your responses, you’ve taught me something I didn’t know.

P4h have a payment policy,where your money is on hold with p4h and will be released to breeder,when you have the pets.It sounds very dodgy to me.it sounds, the breeder is avoiding p4h payment scheme.I would not get a pet from this breeder.Besides, having two pups from the same litter is never advisable anyway!

I would not transfer a large sum to a questionable / ??-name bank account in advance. Period.

The refusal of cash was a big red flag .

I’ve asked her how she intends to prevent accidental pregnancy. They dogs are a very small breed, so an early bitch spay might not even be possible, not that I think it’s a good idea anyway.

I can only raise these things with her, which I have done, I can’t stop her from making bad decisions unfortunately, and I thought it was a bad idea before I started this thread. TBH I’ve had it up to here with peoples’ irresponsible dog ownership today but that’s another story.

Thanks again for the input. If it was me I wouldn’t buy two pups at the same time, and I’d swerve any breeder that I didn’t feel I could fully trust, but sadly it’s not me and they won’t be my dogs.