Does this sound dodgy? Breeder

[SuspiciousHumanoid]

Hi, I’ve registered especially to get some opinions on this as I’m a bit worried.

Friend is getting two pups from a breeder found on P4H. They have been to a house and seen the pups, and the mother who they were suckling from. Also a dog who they were told was the dad.

Deposit was paid through P4H.

Friend was supposed to fetch pups at the end of this week and had a message from the breeder asking her to bank transfer the balance, a lot as you might imagine, the day before she fetches pups. Reason given was the breeder wanted to see it had cleared before they take the pups.

Friend messaged back saying she’d pay by bank transfer at the time of fetching pups and the money would transfer straight away, plus she’d show proof of the transfer.

Breeder said no. Apparently they don’t have such ‘sophisticated banking’ and transactions after 6pm don’t clear, or something.

Friend offered to take cash. Breeder said no, had to be transfer and had to be the day before.

The bank details friend has been given are a different name to the woman who they’ve met.

Friend said the breeder has sent her pics of vet records etc, and the breeder has said they can visit the pups the day they transfer the money, then pick them up the next.

I don’t feel right about this, it doesn’t seem right to me. It’s raising serious red flags that a legit breeder shouldn’t be raising.

Friend has said she’s google and FB stalked the breeder, she has a FB mutual, and that she’s not found anything concerning.

What do you think, does this all sound wrong? I can just think of so many ways this sounds dodgy that I personally wouldn’t go ahead but her DP has spoken on the phone to the breeder and she said he sounds happy that it’s legit. I can’t shake the feeling it’s not.

Collective dog house wisdom please MN, what do you think, and how else might we ascertain whether they’re dodgy or not?

Come back and tell us if she gets the pups or not. Unfortunately I know what my money would bet on. Who cares if they’ve got a mutual FB pal when the money is going into a third party account anyway?!

That's dodgy af a deposit in advance fair enough but you pay the rest when you have the pup in your arms

Anyone who buys puppies from P4H is not responsible. It's where backyard breeders sell dogs.

No reputable breeder has both the bitch and the sire either.

I wouldn't automatically say that anyone who advertises on P4H is an irresponsible breeder, however it does make it hard to find the good breeders. A lot of people just want a healthy and happy family per, so KC breeding isn't necessary.

I'm glad you're trying OP but if your friend won't listen to reason there's little more you can do.

@DramaAlpaca

Apart from anything else, no reputable breeder would sell two pups from the same litter to one person.

This with bells on. Our breeder won't sell two to same family. We were told that they would want at least 18 months between pups. Huge amount of effort into raising one nevermind two at once😫

Our breeder needed the money to be transferred over before they would bring puppy over to us. Reason being that people have walked away in past with puppy and not paid.

Can she pay by PayPal goods and services? Then she has some sort of protection if anything goes wrong.

Our dog came from a large established kennels that is council registered for breeding.
The owner wasn't there when we collected so one of his kennel hands dealt with it all. He gave us his details and said bank transfer when we get a minute, which happened to be later the same evening!

I went to the breeder’s house, chose the puppy and did a bank transfer in her kitchen. Easy and straightforward. She was also a Kennel Club breeder, which is also important for the puppy’s health and lineage. You get what you pay for.

Totally dodgy. She might get her dogs but two small yaappy siblings from the same litter?. No no no. Why anyone would want two I have no idea and the principal issue isn't mating but dogs bonding so closely with each other they are horrible with their humans. Small dogs can be snappy anyway. Litter mates.... Agh no. And for any goods or services I wouldn't pay till I had possession.

@Clymene I did have that same thought about the mum and dad the first time she told me about it TBH. I’m no doggy expert but keeping a fertile bitch and a fertile dog in the same house doesn’t scream careful breeding to me.

I have huge reservations about my friend getting these two pups and I’ve had a good chat to her about it, but she seems set on doing it and she thinks she’ll find solutions to any problems that might arise. Personally I don’t think it’s fair to subject one or both the dogs to an early neutering just because it’s cute to have a brother and sister, and that’s not even taking into account the littermate thing PPs have mentioned, but it’s not my decision. I have told her what I think and asked her to think about it and she still has her heart set on them so I’ve done all I can.

FWIW I think one or both the dogs will be neutered far too young, they are a very small breed, but it’ll happen because it’s easier, but there’s nowt else I can do. I don’t like it , but…

Re P4H: I wouldn’t look for a dog on there. I’m sure some reputable breeders advertise on there but it’s not the way I’d go about looking for a pup. When she said she’d found them on there my eyes did roll, but again, what can you do?

My friend has had a good think and decided to just get the one puppy.

Thank you very much for all your information on here. You made me consider things that I didn’t know about, and that my friend didn’t really give much thought to, and I was able to have a calm chat with her and flag up potential issues and very real concerns, and it has resulted in the right decision being made.

That’s really good news, OP! I hope all goes well with her new puppy. You’re a good friend.

That’s brilliant news @SuspiciousHumanoid, hope your friend enjoys her pup and that you have chance for a few cuddles!

Having seen the way my dog behaved (or tried to, we cut the meet up short!) with one of her litter mates when they were still quite little there is no way on earth I’d ever get two at the same time. Absolute chaos!

That's good @SuspiciousHumanoid - well done. I hope the puppy is healthy

The puppy has landed.

I’m awaiting pictures as we speak.

I’ve done it and it was cash on collection, deposit in advance.
2 dogs from the same litter can be a mistake as pp state.
No way would I transfer the cash in advance, if it was being done that way I would want a written contract/paperwork.

Oh seen update- glad it turned out ok.