Are you comfortable with this scenario if this was your child

[borntobeAcatslave]

I was helping my DC class for their Forrest school session today. We went for a lovely walk. A man with a large breed dog kindly gave us space to go first. One of the class boys went over to the dog and started stroking it's back. The boy has SEN and was with one to one with a staff member. This member stood right next to the boy but didn't really do anything.
I felt totally uncomfortable and my heart was racing and I felt I need to say something to the teacher.
Or am I overreacting here? It looked completely harmless, said boy has no sense of danger so needs handholding and supervision all the time.

Did the dog eat the child or something?

Perhaps they know the dog?

If the man walks him regularly in the area they might have met before, could explain the casual stroking.

Boy strokes dog under supervision with owner present. Total non-event.

Boy shouldn’t have just run up to a dog and started to stroke it. The boy should have asked permission first and if he has no sense of danger, the TA should ask the owner if the dog wants to be petted. Ideally you would ask every time, even if you encounter the dog regularly because they might be feeling ill or have encountered a child that scared them since the last walk. Realistically if they’d met before and met regularly, then most people don’t ask each time and it would be up to the owner to say the dog wasn’t feeling well today.

I do love on these threads that OP always has to mention that it’s a large breed. That has nothing to do with it and how likely the dog is to react. The most reactive dogs I know are small to medium breeds.

The staff member should have told the little boy to ask permission but I think you're being seriously overdramatic to say your heart was racing

The owner would have stopped the child or pulled his dog away if he was concerned. Unless your going to give a follow up they says it was a special child-eating breed of dog then I think you need to calm down

Not a regular dog. The owner did stop when he saw us coming and stayed on to the side with the dog till we pass. The boy is non verbal, makes random loud noises, like I said before has one to one staff member all the time. This is a SEN school.
Even if it's a dog that boy knows the staff member doesn't know that.
I'm surprised to see some replies here that this is ok?
Even the dog is small/big/friendly/child eating/whatever, may be it's better not to let the children interact with them because you don't know the dog/owner?

The TA should’ve stepped in and asked the owner if the boy could stroke the dog but nothing bad happened so I’m not sure why you’re so anxious over this? A responsible dog owner would have taken the dog further away and warned the group not to touch it if it would have caused a problem

Sounds like a pleasant, positive interaction. I hope the boy had a nice day and was permitted to engage in some other natural, spontaneous and enjoyable activities, which surely was the point of the outing.

We don't know if the owner is responsible or not. TA didn't ask any permission, honestly the child just walked up to the dog and started stroking. Plenty of time to stop him. TA was supposed to hold the child's hand all the time because he can be unpredictable.
I'm always extra careful as I'm taking care of someone else's child and IS a huge responsibility specially if the child have SEN and we are out an about.
May be I'm doing this all wrong.

Not a regular dog? Was it a two headed dog or something . Think pp meant maybe it's a dog they see on their walk regularly so staff so know the dog and owner and previously had the conversations about child stroking dog but now it's part of the walk when they see the dog, the child strokes and says hello. If you do the same walk most days/weeks you tend to bump into the same people.

I agree with you op.

Generally you can read the owner's body language. He's moved his dog to the side, which is considerate. If he'd been concerned he'd have pulled his dog further away or stood between the dog and the child. Obviously things happen fast, but when I see walkers with dogs I look at their body language to see whether I need to keep my dog/child away.
You say the staff member had plenty of time to intervene, she clearly read the situation and decided it wasn't necessary.

Ideally, she'll teach the boy about asking first. However, given his additional needs she must have decided it was not the right moment- she didn't want to escalate unnecessarily in that moment and place.

Forest school sessions are every other week and in different places/ activities. So not a dog we regularly see.
I don't know if reading the body language of a dog/owner is the way to do a risk assessment of this situation.

Is your blame at the TA or dog owner?

Dog owner sounds responsible by being courteous and moving aside. If the child is non verbal then the TA should have asked before petting and checked the dog was ok to be petted.

But it’s a non event. The child enjoyed petting a dog, I don’t understand the need for hysteria and the issue here isn’t really with the TA or the dog.

I blame the TA. Should've intervened stopped the child ask permission from the owner. Knowing the child can be unpredictable I still wouldn't be ok with this.
It's good to know how relaxed you all are and may be I should do the same as the TA next time.

If you are the owner of the dog and something happens are you ok to take the blame in this situation?
How can you all be sure nothing wil happen? Even if the dog is harmless child could've done something to provoke the dog?

What do you mean "not a regular dog"? Did it have two heads or something?

Everyone agrees with you that the TA should have stepped in but most dogs don't go round savaging random children the owner was clearly fine with the situation or he'd have said something or moved his dog away.

Many dogs even live in households with children and the children survive until adulthood

But it’s a non event. The child enjoyed petting a dog, I don’t understand the need for hysteria and the issue here isn’t really with the TA or the dog

Because risk assessment is about thinking about the what if and preventing it. The thought process of child makes loud strange noise and pokes the dog, dog reacts and barks/bites/scratches is not very difficult to make.

I would stand by the side. I would be fairly confident my dog would be fine, but having never met a classfull of children in a forest I couldn't be sure. Everyone should ask before they pet a dog, if the child couldn't the TA should. But even then I would say a good risk assessment for a class of kids is to not touch the dog, especially if one is allowed to others might follow.

Of course the TA should have checked with the owner before letting the child stroke the dog. Anyone who says differently clearly has no idea about risk assessment.

All children should be taught not to approach dogs without asking permission from the owner. It is very dangerous to assume that a dog will welcome the child's attention.

I always try and ask permission before letting my child stroke any dog, big or small. In fact, my toddler was bitten by a tiny chihuahua a few weeks back when I foolishly let him approach the dog without checking first.

how do you know the TA didnt ask permission?
and presumably the man let the boy

Child should have asked, but after that it sounds fine to me.
If a dog is not ok with children, the owner will say.

I agree with you OP, the TA should have checked with the owner first that the dog was friendly, regardless of whether the child has SEN or not.

Ideally, yes, the TA should have asked, but as PP have said might know the dog and owner anyway. If the TA was fairly clued on about canine body language and the owner was chill, that's half the risk assessment done anyway.

It sounds as if it was a lovely interaction for the child to enjoy. The vast, vast majority of dogs are not biters, and the sort of considerate owner who moves a dog to the side is also the sort of owner who is likely to say if the dog might have an issue.